PROPOSAL: USA and Japanese speed standards in Super Turbo should be unified


#1

The USA version of ST has four speeds:
0,1,2,3

The US Tourney standard is 3, which is the FASTEST.

In Japan, ST has four speeds
1,2,3,4

The Japanese tourney standard is 3, which is the SECOND FASTEST.

US and Japan tourney standards hould be the same. I’m sure most people will agree in principle to this, but some reasons are:

  • Don’t fragment the game
  • Encourage top US players to do well in Japanese tournaments and vice versa

At this point I’d like to assume that everyone agrees in principle that the speeds should be unified, and I’d like to discuss what speed should be used. Should the standard speed be FASTEST or SECOND FASTEST.

Pros for Fastest:

  • Most US players are used to this

Pros for Second Fastest

  • Most Japanese players are used to this
  • Doesn’t drop frames (Fastest speed drops frames)
  • US ST community is tiny compared to the Japanese ST community. It would be easier for the US to change than for JPN to change.

The main issues I see is that the Fastest speed drops frames. I think this is a problem. We should not be playing the game at a speed that drops frames. For this reason I propose that tournament standard for 2008 be changed to SECOND FASTEST.

Julien Beasley


#2

You have my vote. Snuck in first.


#3

Wait what? If they use 3, and we use 3, we use the same speed? Unless the japanese version is different, there is no frame difference. Plus you can set up to Turbo 4, in some versions. So again, I don’t see how its not unified. We play on the same speed? The fact, that they use turbo 4, or vice versa is irrelevant, unless there is some speed change on the JPN version that I am not aware of. However I have played on a JPN version before on turbo 3, and saw no difference.


#4

This pertains to the Capcom Classics Collection 2, where free select 3 is pretty fast.


#5

its not same

The USA version of ST has four speeds:
0,1,2,3

The US Tourney standard is 3, which is the FASTEST.

In Japan, ST has four speeds
1,2,3,4

their 3 is our 2


#6

If you read the first post, you would see that Japanese turbo 3 and USA turbo 3 are different speeds.

I’m all for this, it’s been a problem for too long


#7

/vote


#8

Very good idea.


#9

Yeah, I played a few weeks ago at TGA on their Free Select 3 Japanese version.

Couldn’t time ticks or reversals.

There needs to be a unified standard because the speed difference is HUGE. Even after playing on the cab for a few solid hours, the timing for “2nd fastest” speed never came to me. It just doesn’t feel like ST being so damn slow.

I prefer Free 3 (US)/Turbo 4. Turbo 2/“2nd fastest” is garbage imho.


#10

No.

The speeds are:
SLOW, FAST, SECOND FASTEST, FASTEST

USA plays on FASTEST
Japan plays on SECOND FASTEST

It just so happens that the Japanese names for these speeds are 1,2,3,4 while the US version are 0,1,2,3. It’s like the Boxer->Claw->Dicatator name switch. Only the names are really different.

What I’m proposing is that the USA tournament standard become SECOND FASTEST


#11

I thought US standard already used the rule of thumb which is to pick the second to fastest. Also, regardless of what speed setting you use in ST, it’ll drop frames. It’s just that the faster it is, the more it drops per second/animation.


#12

Yeah we should definatley change it.


#13

No. Let’s stick with the speed we’ve been using for the last 15 years. Our best players (in California) already have to put up with enough Japanophile bullshit (from yours truly, NKI, etc.) Strongly disagree with zass’s proposal.

Japanese players aren’t picky about speeds anyway (many tournaments use rock paper scissors where winner gets to choose speed.) FWIW, turbo 4 was used over there in the mid 90s.

Also slower speed helps Dhalsim sort out his air defense and that fucker is plenty strong as it is.


#14

Whoever told you that Japanese Speed 3 doesn’t drop frames was a liar and a thief. Indeed, a genuine scoundrel. All turbo speeds in all Capcom games drop frames.

Listen, we’re all for unifying speed settings if that helps improve things. But why should the US be the one to change? We’re the ones offerring tournaments for money right? All sports have home court advantage. Why should we put another bullet in our feet? We’ve already got plenty.


#15

^He already mentioned that the US scene is smaller than JPN so it would be easier for us to switch over instead.


#16

agreed…too much confusion during tournament play about speed issues for ST is a hassle…VOTE for US Turbo 2= Jap Turbo 3


#17

So technically Japan Tournament Speed, is US Turbo 2? Thats better for me imo, makes it easer to play, I played ST, on all speeds before, none exclusively, so I supose thats why I don’t notice to much of a difference. I can normally adapt to any speed, though US Turbo 1, bothers me for being to slow.


#18

yep yep…after SO many years im suprised this was finally brought up…it even says in the ST wiki that US turbo 2 is the same as Japan Turbo 3…but lets see if it changes for the players this year


#19

i already posted in the thread because i saw that one first, but i might as well say it here too.

who cares?

it doesn’t matter if we coincide with the japanese or with any arcade boards. as long as the entire country recognizes a certain speed as the US tournament standard, it won’t effect anything. if anything, to go back to a different speed from free select 3 (which is what we’ve all been playing on since CCC2 came out) is going to throw off a lot of people’s game.

the only people changing the speed requirement might benefit are a handful of OG players who might be thrown off from the speed change, going from arcade to console. but to be perfectly honest, nobody besides maybe 10 people tops are still playing this on an american arcade machine.

and to be perfectly honest, it won’t matter anyway due to the stage bugs. the speed will ALWAYS be off as long as you’re on Gief/T Hawk/Fei Long and a few other stages. i’m actually convinced that EVERY stage actually plays at a completely different speed due to the emulation issues present.

so yeah, we can argue til we’re all blue in the face on this issue, but the fact of the matter is that everyone has been playing on free select speed 3 since CCC2 came out, and changing that now will probably throw more people off than anything else.


#20

The US scene may be smaller, but not every Japanese player is gonna come to evo. In fact they’re barely breaking 5 right now. So messing with the 80+ USA entrants for 5 japanese isn’t right.

On top of that the japanese have been adopting to using USA speed 3 for several years now. I never heard them complain.

And why should we be the ones to change? Does everything japan do become some sort of golden rule that we all must adhere by? If thats the case, then we might as well stop playing MvC2 cause they don’t play it and it isn’t “fair” to them.

To me, this is no point in changing this. Most USA players play on this speed to begin with, and they are the ones attending our tournaments.

If you truely want to change it then run your own weekly tournaments at the japanese speed. If people adopt it then more power to you.

Besides that, using a “stop watch” to time the rounds is full of human error. A far better way would have been to record it at 60fps and figure out from the round starting to round ending exactly how long the rounds are. and thus be able to figure out the speed.