You can dash up MP after a CC second hit cr.HP, though the timing is very strict. Also linking it to HK is great anyways if you have VT stocked.
Messing with more non followups to EX Spike, I found you can do HK WWS after an EX spike and it hits super meaty against quick getup. Depending on the spacing and roll cancel delay, you can roll out of the HK WWS and be at least +9 (since I’ve had it block string into cr.HP). Though rolling too quick can make only one hit of the WW be blocked and then it’s not so good.
If the cr HP tagged, add cr MK into L mixer, rinse and repeat.
If cc, F+MP into a bigger combo.
If they stay down after the dash cr HP,
add a cr MK then go back to cr HP to put them in the same situation as before.
If you know they will block, add another cr HP then proceed to throw. It’s a perfect wake up throw that beats 4f jab. Not sure about 3f?
After you condition them to stay down from L mixer, LK MK for a safe cross up jump MK.
LK HP for a safe jump HP. Both are around 4-5f safe.
The thing is all these are safe too if you decide not to do anything but bait a dp after the dash in.
For crush sweeps, immediately do F+MP, LK, cr HP for the same meaty as before. Or F+MP, LK, wake up throw. Beats 4f jabs.
Haven’t tested on timing for after a throw. Hopefully can come out with a pseudo vortex throw that can shut down turtles. Hate turtles.
so I was practicing some Crush Counter corner combos for Rashid and I realised I have a question:
after st.HP xx EX.WS roll cancel, why do people go cr.HP, st.MP xx M.ES when instead you can simply do st.HP xx nail assault into H.SM?
The first version (which I’ve seen pretty much everyone use) does 355 damage and 652 Stun but leaves you in a tough position to follow up with a meaningful mixup or pressure (to my knowledge, by all means prove me wrong on this part).
The follow-up I’ve been doing does a bit more damage (360 which is practically nothing but extra is extra) and deals a bit less stun (604 which might be a difference between stunning on your next combo or not) but the best part is, it leaves you considerable closer to the opponent to go for corner pressure. Any input on this?
The dmg may not be exactly accurate because I think the scaling ratio was on in training mode. Stun seems to remain the same though.
In mid screen, you can either:
CC HK, F+MP EX eagle at a good height, and EX eagle again from opposite direction. Then M/H/EX Mixer. (345 dmg, 510 stun, 2 stocks). You can throw in a VT after the first eagle if you want. But I personally find it hard to combo off hurricane that is launched midair. The juggle seems to fall off real quick for some reason.
CC HK, F+MP EX shot, dash K eagle. (290dmg, 461stun, 1 stock)
At corner, CC HP, EX shot, cancel to roll, HP cancel to roll, M mixer, you can mash it(345 dmg, 616 stun, 1 stock) and dash in for the cr HP meaty or let it stop and HK cross up for more pressure.
CC HP, EX shot, cancel to roll, cr HP, MP, M mixer same as before. Lesser dmg though. (331 dmg, 616 stun, 1 stock).
For both, you can throw in another EX mixer after the first unmashed M mixer. The dmg won’t be worth it but if you are trying to push for stun, it does 664 stun.
However, if stun is what you want, might as well do this:
CC HP, EX shot, cancel to roll, cr HP, MP, EX eagle, H mixer. (365 dmg, 670 stun, 2 stocks)
Quite pointless to throw in a VT after the MP. Due to all the scaling dmg, you will be wasting the VT for a mere 687stun.
I rather keep VT for emergencies or other setups that involves cross up hk on wake up or trip guard cr MK/ st MK pokes etc.
I already shared this on twitter, figure I’ll stop being lazy and put it on srk as well. Hopefully some of you will find it useful. This is basically a list of meaty options and safe divekick/enhanced mixer setups you can use off various knockdowns and block strings. It’s not complete, there are definitely more options, but i made it mostly as a reference point for myself. I realized during my short play time that I was giving up too much pressure when I ended combos with eagle spikes for damage and rashid really needs to keep his momentum. So this has really helped me keep that going and hopefully it helps someone else out.
So after messing around with y’all’s tech up here, I gotta say I really like the dash cr. hp setup to hit both recoveries after lp mixer.
While I was learning this though, i stumbled on something else. If you get the counter hit on the first hit of cr. hp, you can do CH cr. hp xx ex wws, st. hp, hk eagle spike (291/482st)
I believe this might be the optimal 1 bar crush counter in general since the other option is st. hk, f. mp xx ex wws, dash eagle spike (290/461st). If the second hit of the cr. hp hits, meaning they back teched, the cancel won’t come out since the 2nd hit isn’t cancellable anyway. This means you have tons of time to react to either option, and get fat damage.
The reason this works is because cr. hp moves you forward a bit before the cancel, so it makes getting the ex wws close enough to link st. hp possible. The reel animation after rashid’s cc st. hp puts them too far for this to ever be possible. There are lots of good options out of this too. You can cancel to v skill and divekick for less damage, but a side switch. You end with vskill roll kick for corner carry and a safejump.
I need to know too. Been testing all day. L Mixer and EX Mixer still works very well. Theoretically the Eagle Kick should bounce far and fast back too since it itls modified by wind but I can’t get it to work? All these 3 needs to be in corner or the wind won’t stay long enough for the roll. I however wonder if the vskill Aerial Eagle trick still works? I successfully got it modified by the wind(it travels snappy fast) but I still bounce back quite negative after blocked. Even with the EX WWS I still can’t do it. Any tips guys?
I also noticed I can’t buffer qcf while in thr roll state after cancelling my WWS. I need to do it immediately after the roll.
Thanks for this as it’s probably the easiest 1 bar punish that gives optimal damage.
There is, however, a more damaging punish but it’s not as easy. You can actually do st.MP, ex whirlwind, delay, roll, st.MP, cr.MK xx L Eagle. This does like 297 dmg and works on everyone. Character specific you can do st.MP xx ex whirlwind, delay, roll, st.MP, st.MP xx M Eagle. This does like 315 dmg, but it doesn’t work on everyone unless they’re crouching.
Still those are much more difficult to time, while the cr.HP xx ex whirlwind, st.HP xx H Eagle punish is consistent and deals a fuckton of damage.
Oh wow I didn’t know about the st. mp cc combos. Thanks for that. I will have to test when it is optimal.
There are a number of perks of the cr.HP starter though that I think everyone should be aware of when deciding on optimal punishes. The first is that it works off the lp mixer knockdown to cover both back and normal tech as other people discovered. The second is that if you are even kind of close to the corner you can end with roll xx k, HP mixer for more damage. The option for the roll ender is also useful in certain matchups for the safejump with corner carry setups you get off roll kick. The final reason I like it is because you don’t have to react to whether or not it hit to decide to roll or how much to delay the roll. You can take your time to determine whatever ender is appropriate. If during the ex wws animation you think you are out of range for st.HP, you can end in sweep or cancel to v skill divekick which will allow you to hit from either side or spend more meter on ex divekick for DMG and corner carry.
Ok guys, i did a little bit more lab work trying to combine some of the good ideas in this thread with some of my own, and here’s what I got:
A couple of you guys found out that cr. hp can catch people off both back and normal recovery meaty. I discovered that you can do cr. hp xx ex wws, st. hp xx hk ES for more damage than any other combo he has other than his situational st. mp xx ex wws xx delay roll, st. mp, cr. mk, lk ES combo. As a result of this setup and this combo, we can do a sort of option select where we get the ideal crush counter combo every time depending on which hit of the cr. hp counter hits. The second hit of cr. hp is not cancellable, so you can do the combo as if you are going to hit on the first hit of cr. hp and blindly buffer the ex wws while inputting a dash right after wards. You then have a second if not more to see if rashid is doing ex wws or he just crush countered the opponent. In the first case, you simply link the st. hp and go into whatever ender you want. In the second, you dash up and do st. mp, cr. mk xx lk ES. I’m going to call this setup with the option select together the “cr. hp cc trap”. I think it’s reaaaaaaly good and we should be doing it all the time. In fact a few of the next tips are places u can use the trap
HP mixer antiair is key. Good players will jump in at you from ranges that are inside cr. mp’s hitbox and will cause ex mixer to whiff due to it’s forward movement. Beings able to use hp mixer on such jumpins is very useful. Not to mention, no matter how many hits of the mixer hits, you can still dash and do the cr. hp cc trap. The time they hit the ground will vary based on how many hits, but the beautiful thing about the cr. hp cc trap is that it will counter hit a 3f jab no matter what. If they hit the ground a bit quicker, they will get hit by the first hit of cr. hp, if they hit the ground a bit later, they will get hit by the second hit. Unfortunately, this loses to back recovery so only do this if you think they are going to normal recover. You can manually delay the cr. hp if you think they are going to back tech.
MP mixer is really good against neutral jumps. This is fairly obvious, but what I recently learned about MP mixer is that it has unbelievably good horizontal range against standing opponents, way more than one would think out of a an antiair-ish move. Can be used as a situational far whiff punish. As a bonus, you can do the trap off of mp mixer. The only difference is, you have to do a st. lk right before the cr. hp. Also, you are too far to link st. hp if they don’t quick tech, so you have to link cr. hp instead.
The cr. hp cc trap sets up perfectly for a reset using Mienaikage’s blocked hk wws tech. You can do cc cr. hp(1) xx ex wws, st. hp xx hk wws xx vskill xx (blocked) hk divekick, and you can get toooons of frame advantage after the block. I set the dummy to reversal 3f jab on block, and I was able to do a cr. hp in the blockstun which means this reset leaves you at least +9. This reset is really good because it gives you massive frame advantage, does a good bit of chip damage, and doesn’t rely on having to guess or OS a back tech and normal tech.
That’s really good. I’ve been trying to use H Mixer as an anti-air when they’re trying to jump over you and it really works well. It does a surprising amount of damage. The HK wws xx V Skill to blocked HK Divekick I’ll have to practice ASAP. As that sounds extremely good.