Rose vs Sagat

rose

#1

When fighting Sagat, you wanna keep the fight up close or mid range as his Tiger Shots are too fast to keep trying to reflect, because eventually they’re start to catch while you’re recovering from reflect another tiger shot. Remember hes S Tier for a reason.

A Sagat that knows the match up is gonna make you come to him. So you gonna have to learn safe ways to close in through his Tiger Shots. When full screen you gonna want to FA/Slide to pass his Tiger Shots, you can reflect few Tiger Shots before closing in to build meter or to send low ones back at him while closing in. Never try to sit back as I said earlier the speed will catch up to you, not to mention the mix up between slow ones will throw you off, and EX ones are just hell.

Once you start getting in(mid range to close range) you watch for spacing as to not jump in and get roundhouse, Tiger Knee(depends on spacing), and Tiger Uppercut. Rose slide goes under Tiger Knee so if you read it and he does it you’re cross right under and be in the perfect position to throw or start other mix up and mind games. Rose pokes are faster than Sagat pokes and have better range, s.mk owns Sagat’s c.mk and c.hk similar to when fighting shotos. Spiral is also good to stuff his attacks on startup. Only jump in if you read Tiger Shot coming and you are mid to or close range. If he try to ultra, guess what? Rose j.lk beats it out on startup. I think does the same to TU IIRC, but remember only on startup.

Now that you’re in on Sagat you gonna wanna stay in, Sagat will be a threat always as he does good damage regardless and have an answer for anything you do if hes read you and counter, so you gonna have to outsmart/outplay him. Watch for TU on wakeup or to stuff your pokes, FADC to throw, or FADC to Ultra if hes has the meter. Always be aware of meter what he can do to limit your options. Never jump in from Long to mid range when has ultra or you will eat massive damage for free. Sagat TK have to be spaced right for them to be safe on block, if he TK at you and it hit twice or is too close punish him. If Sagat does ultra and you have ultra, just shamwow him for the counter.

That all I have for now, share your thoughts people.


#2

Far-jump in: FAIL - Never ever do this unless your timing with c.HP is dead-on; his standing HK will own you nonstop and it has amazing priority and reach.

Crossover / close jump-in: WIN - Sagat’s wake-up defense against a cross-up is not as bad as it seems. Not ideal, but at worst a deep crossover attack will be traded if he tries to TU.

This fight is not good for Rose, but her slide will help mitigating range problems. There are a million ways he can stuff you if you jump at him, not to mention he will beat you out 80% of the time if you both jump.

Try to stay out of his jump-in range too, your c.HP will not beat out his shoulder drop when he wants to play dirty.


#3

I used to think "well who care if I j.hp and we trade TU with my hit. As long as I’m close. Til i saw him trade off with me…recover…f.HK (roundhouse), and then ultra me.

DONT jump in willy nilly. Thats given for any match up, but really gotta watch this with Sagat. It’s annoying.

Note: Tiger Uppercut recovery is weird. Since he flips down after a whiff if you time it incorrectly a crouching attack can knock him out of the air and a missed drill will wiff in his favor. Ugh.

Watch for his Jump in’s. his elbow for some reason I cant c.HP.

You really wanna keep him on his back. He cant harass you on his back and you have options to mix up and confuse. But you really don’t wanna be thrown away or play a distance game. You just will have to get close again anyway, which annoying.


#4

i love playing sagats. it seems to me that he always has an open hitbox the size of rose herself :smiley:
i may sometimes get hit by a S.HKx2 into ultra, but that’s usually in the first round : it just makes me realize that he actually has worked on his training mode, so let’s show him a bit of concrete footsie overpawnage.


#5

I could exploit that if I were Ryu. I feel confident DPing people who put their legs out for no reason. But Rose, I feel a little less confident to nail people. Like Dhalsim…puts his hit box right infront of me all day and i cant do anything lol


#6

My beef with Sagat is simply:

C MK - the reach on it tricks me often
J MP - it wins from anything for free
C LP to LK TK - keeps me in stun forever
J LK - easy crossup

Random tiger knees often land on my slides, giving him the knockdown. Random Ultra (as reversal eg) makes me cry.
I actually dont mind Sagats who zone well or combo hard, thats what he’s supposed to do.


#7

Regarding Sagat’s cross up: You wanna watch if he crossed you up deep or not, because his lk cross up does not put anyone in long hit stuns like most cross up does so he gotta be very deep with it to combo you off of it. Like he gotta hit you right before hit touch the ground. If isn’t deep enough you’re recover in time to and can try to punish, which you could go for a Throw or other options if you don’t think he try to TU you when he lands, so it all depends.


#8

Cool protip: If Sagat is going for s.lk/c.lp xx TK safe 2nd hit pressure you can make the TK whiff by hitting c.mk ;).


#9

what do you mean? s.lk/c.lp >TK doesn’t actually combo? One thing I’ve learned about that string, is you can slide under the tiger knee at the right distance. very useful.


#10

But he has a tendency to land on your head if the TK is short enough


#11

I have a really hard time trying to slide under those low tiger shot, i cant get the timing :(.


#12

If it’s a fast one, do a lp reflect.

If it’s a slow one, at all cost, if you aren’t good at sliding it, DO NOT SLIDE IT. The timing is fairly strict for this one.

The medium one is slow and should be j.lk over.

But yeah, abuse cross ups and j. lk in this match. I believe j. lk can beat tiger uppercut with some sense of timing.

But sliding Tiger Knee <3.

It whiffs Tiger Knee, makes Slide a counter hit, gives you a free c.lp or grab ( mixup).


#13

I played against a bad Sagat who was relying heavily on the HK AA to Ultra trick. Jumped around with LK all match long and he wasnt able to land a single hit. Must have been really pissed. The LK rocks against Sagat, only danger is trading with TU, on which he normally can juggle afterwards.


#14

To beat hk with lk, u need to throw the lk at the certain timing? or it’ll always beat hk whenever u’re in the lk stance?


#15

gonna be reading this thread closely because it’s a problem i really need help with! Sagats always go for full screen spacing on me and no matter how much i reflect they -never- get tired of it so i need thiiiiiiiiiiiis


#16

Aiight…Sagat.

You know what annoys me with Sagat? I can deal with his jumping Elbow. Whatever, my fault for being so defensive. But I have a problem with his crouching punches. I dont know if its his c.hp or c.mp. Its a straight punch that seems to just destroy me all the time. I usually get this when sliding. On block, he just nails me with this. I try and poke and he beats me sometimes with it. Its really frustrating.

I feel like sometimes my slide doesn’t hit when it should. his kicks, although his leg is really high sometimes stuffs my slide.

tip: Watch his uppercut recovery carefully. If you try and Counter too early he will flip back and you will wiff a drill or whatever you were trying and eat whatever counter he’s got. Its frustrating.

I hate to sling mud at Sagat players, I find a lot of them are mashing the hell out of buttons. Sometimes I get thrown out of no where in the middle attacks. Like I timed my c.lp’s too far apart. He threw me out of a c.lp, c.lp string. Yes, i know my timing was off but why would he be trying to throw at that time anyways!? Same thing goes for random crouching punches or TU’s (But i’m used to this from DP’s and such). Its frustrating as all hell, lol.


#17

i agree in regards to the mashing Sagats. Tiger Knees/Uppercuts all back and forth across the screen regardless of what i’m doing. i mean, really lame spazz out. and they get rewarded for it! it’s even more frustrating because that style is the anthesis of playing as Rose - you really gotta outhink ppl even more.


#18

Saqs advice is great, with cr MK you can make Sagats TK to whiff and then punish with cr LP xx SSpiral or combo.


#19

U ve says almost everything; I just want to say
-Dont play risky game, like throwing random spark at mid close range
-Play mind game a little, reward is not on ur side

  • have a very safe game, dont lose ur opportunities to punish him hardly

I think reflect and absorb can be a key with this type of opponent. When u learn and master how and when to use all of them correctly, ull make him think twice before landing a TS; just be careful about ur range and his ultra also.

Rose Ultra can play alot in ur gameplan and strategy so if u can have it early with absorbing some random TS or some normals, it always good for you.

Its very hard to anti air him; depending on distance and attack (air MP, uugh!!) u d better have to use our evasive option (cross under him, back jump/dash). Never do ultra to anti air a close jump: well timed air MP or HK will beat u or at least trade but sagat takes no damage. The only relialable anti air for me is well timed and spaced (always) ex ST on reaction when u see him left the ground: only early jump attacks can beat it, but who is that fool to do random early jump attack at a wrong distance.

Also, Rose Super is good especially when u can throw the enhanced one; try to find an opportunity to do it when u can.

A lot of character crouch MK have these low hitbox frames property: it makes some mid attacks whiff.
Rose slide and crouch HK have them too.

Also, dont forget that stand block push u a little far away than crouch one and give u little more frames to react: u d better have to block TK in standing position.

Hope that all these stuffs can be useful.


#20

There is zero way to punish a well spaced TK ? i’ve played a sagat who does lp lk tk, lp lk tk, continuously when i was at corner.