Since the poll is pretty much done and Ryu had an overwhealming amount of votes, I say we start on Ryu first for our weekly character matchups. Post everything you find out about Ryu in here and I will update first post.
First, Pros and Cons
Very balanced, can play zone and rush.
Easy combos into Ultra/Super.
Has a super zone game.
No good combos that don’t use meter.
Balanced character means he can’t rush that well.
Ryu has an excellent zoning game and this is where most Ryu’s are going to give you trouble. This fight is a lot like Dhalsim for the sole fact that you are going to be taking damage as you attempt to move in close. The main difference though is that Ryu can push you back out pretty easily with LP Dragon Punch.
You are going to want to Dive Kick, MP Tornadoes, and Focus Attack Dash through fireballs to attempt to close in. Eventually you are going to get in a knockdown and this is where things get interesting. You are going to have to play mind games with Ryu here and do one of the following:
Dive Kick bait.
Cross-Up Dive Kick (Risky but could work)
Focus Attack bait (Only do this if they don’t quick rise)
The “I’m Far Away” Strat:
The “I am close, but not close enough” Strat:
The “I am finally in his face!” Strat:
Ryu Is On The Floor:
Baiting out DP’s
DO NOT EVER MEATY ANYTHING WHEN RYU HAS ULTRA/SUPER This is where you try and throw out a move so the tail end of it hits them as they get up. You will only eat a Dragon Punch xx Super to the face.
The main thing to do with Ryu is to get in on him and beat him down there. Do your best not to let him knock you back into zone range. The more you are in his face, the less options he has.
Good Combos Against Ryu:
After a whiffed/Blocked MP/HP DP- HP xx HP Tornado
After a Blocked LP DP - Ultra at max range, launcher into ultra if they are close enough, If they are ontop of you then HP xx HP Tornado, Throws also work. cr.MK xx HP GT is useful. Will either beat out or trade with Ryu. Don’t do it if Ryu has Ultra.
cr.MK XX Ex Tornado for pokes.
Tatsumaki - Cr.LP, Cr.MP, or Cr.HP
That is it for now. Feel free to post all strats for RYU and RYU only.
Yeah I find this is a difficult issue as well, have not really found any decent tools to bait the DP yet. I would try to focus after the Dive Kick but I know I will get knocked out from the air before I even get anywhere near the ground, Also its too high to air focus as well. So most of the time I’ll try a focus & roll in near enough so I can try & get in low Dive Kicks.
That’s a good strategy. I am too anxious in this matchup to build meter, and that’s my problem. Everything your saying basically means your going to need meter/ultra to punish him.
I want to add that if you close in at mid range, you can bait him into poking/footsie that you can EX messiah through. Think old school Alpha 2-esque Ryu/Ken matchups. You would get Ryu to stick out a normal so you could use Ken’s Alpha counter HK. Except in Alpha there was little no risk- if he threw it out, the counter was free, if he didn’t you were blocking anyway. With Rufus if you guess wrong Ryu blocks the Messiah and you are left with a little guessing game at the end, worst case he FA’s your mixup, best case you fool him and break his FA with the LK followup, or he trades with DP.
Or it lands and you hurt him and put him into a bad position where you can work this strategy.
The thing that kills me most when Ryu has two meters is I can never do dive kick into poke string/throw mixups b/c he’s mashing on DP FADC the whole time. Even if you mess up a blocked c.LP string he can punish you. However I’ll occasionally follow up a c.LP with nothing to bait the DP FADC just to make Ryu burn meter and start over from there.
EX Messiah Kicks can either save you or ruin you in this matchup, in my opinion. I find if you use it smart it’s 50/50 risk but Rufus has greater reward if he has meter and Ultra.
Also, I find that good Ryu players are very good at either staying out of your focus attack range or knowing how to break it, so I only use it to get through fireballs.
I’d just like to point out that cr.HP is not a good counter for whiffed LP srks in my experience because usually players will just keep mashing it and hit you out of your cr.HP with a 2nd (or 3rd or 4th ) srk
I’m pretty sure lp Snake Strike also completely owns Tatsumaki and sends him flying towards the corner. Also, I’ve found a lot of good Ryu’s are VERY aware of the j.HK >> EX Snake combo and will air Tatsumaki when you try to jump at them, which has been generally beating my j.HK. In that case I’m forced to simply Snake Strike and forgo the massively damaging juggle.
I generally just try to bait wake-up DPs. I stay standing or walking forward above a knockdown and then crouchblock when they rise and see if they’ve take the bait. I usually do it at least twice in row before switching it up if necessary.
If I do it the first time and he DPs, it will be blocked and I punish. I keep baiting until he catches on, where usually I see that they will crouch-block on wake-up (he might try a grab after wakeup here though, watch out). Now he thinks he’s smart and he’ll probably hold back the DP again next time. If he DOES throw it out yet again, I would just keep up the baiting because he obviously can’t resist throwing out wakeup DPs, despite the consequences…
Basically though, when I’m confident he’s not going to be throwing out a wakeup DP (because I’ve been punishing it everytime), I end up meeting him with a HP Tornado when he rises. The next time though, I generally expect another DP so I go back to bait mode. At this point, you’ve just got to keep it confused by mixing it up. Several times I’ve totally destroyed my opponent by just alternating DP baiting, and then meaty HP Tornado, and then back to baiting. Also, instead of having them wake up into an HP Tornado, I’ll alternately try to dive kick/crossup on wakeup, or start right into a some kind of crouching LP or LK combo.
Yeah but all this is on knockdown what about baiting on a good Ryu who is actually standing up and ready for you?
A good Ryu clearly knows you want to jump in if hes zoning with fireballs, the point is how are you going to bait him to do DP so Rufus can get a clean shot at him?
Personally, I just don’t try to exactly bait a standing Ryu…It’s difficult when he’s being a fireball factory. Though I’m all for hearing other players techniques! (that’s the point of the thread, ain’t it?)
In that case though I don’t jump in but focus absorb the fireball and dash in. If you know he wants you to jump in, well all the more reason NOT to do that. If he’s spamming them, you should be able to mix up between focus-absorb-dashes and short vertical jump dive kicks, etc. If you’ve gained enough ground on him, you can messiah over a fireball and heel him in the face before he recovers in time.
If they are spamming FBs, I focus absorb and dash back. Dive kick over next one, focus again, dive kick until recovery and repeat until I have an Ultra. Next I’m going to start training myself to Snake Strike over them with the same patience.
That’s the thing about Ryu he recovers so fast from his hadouken if you try anything to get at his face you will get DP and also the extra damage you had taken from absorbing the hadoukens as well, only real chance you got is predicting his hadouken.
lol kills it sometimes hes so mobile an he recovers fast as well, really good corner pressure too.
This is why everyone is looking for something decent to bait his DP.
Good idea still jcerwinske, Focus dash >> short vertical jump dive kick it does gain ground but risky.
i know its late(4am)… but i was thinkin about it. s.mp->hp tornado is rufus’s best option to retaliate wiffed lp dp.
1- s.mp startup is 1 frame faster than s.hp(5 close, 7 far), & you only have 10 frames of recovery to retaliate.
2 - far s.mp has greater horizontal range than s.hp, and far s.mp hits crouching characters(do not misinterpret this as it hits high, b/c it doesn’t)
3 - because far s.mp is not bufferable, you can always do hp tornado input. if you’re close enough, you get free knockdown. if you’re too far, tornado does not come out, and you can instead plan for further retaliation/rtsd.
4 - s.mp has longer active frames, this along with it’s hitbox location & speed make it a preferable option over c.rk(which I think really is underused) and s.hp
more to come about other stuff, with reasoning too