Sexism/misogyny on the Evo stream

From the Evo site:

So first we have this ridiculous strawman that completely fails to address any legitimate grievances people (including women, such as SuperYan) have raised with the idea of a women-only tournament. Then you render your childish diatribe completely hypocritical by the content on the stream.

From Keits claiming that women use being a girl to downplay losses and exaggerate victories, to commenting on the attractiveness of female participants. And right now whoever is controlling the camera is systematically panning the room and zooming in on every attractive female in sight.

It’s easy to make token gestures about “widening the scene,” much harder to actually put into practice the creation of a safe space for women when it requires changing attitudes and behaviour. If I didn’t already believe the women-only tournament was more shameless objectification than an genuine, if ill-considered attempt to reach out, I certainly do now.

Some women may enjoy the kind of attention they’re receiving on the stream, but many do not. If you’re really serious about bringing more women into the scene (which is a noble goal if done with actual inclusiveness in mind, not simply wanting to have more eye candy at tournaments), it would serve you well to ensure streams aren’t full of the kind of sexist, objectifying, and honestly borderline-predatory conduct I’ve seen over the last two days. You have rules forbidding cursing and racial slurs; why are there no rules forbidding the aforementioned?

Some suggestions:

  • It is not okay to comment on how cute women are when they’re there to measure skill at a game.
  • It is not okay to make generalizations about how female players act.
  • It is not okay to constantly compare women’s skills only to other female players.
  • It is not okay to patronise female players with excessive compliments when clearly their skill doesn’t warrant it, because they are female.
  • It is not okay to satisfy your creepy voyeuristic urges using the stream camera.

If you’re serious about inclusiveness, put your money where your mouth is. Right now you look like a fucking joke.

Main offender: Keitis

None of this seems to be a problem in the current Tekken 6 stream.

I think it’s just a problem with with the new Street Fighter 4 Community being immature, vain, players

O.o lol

this thread is so less. how many threads do we need complaining about the women’s tourny? people so eager to make a big deal out of things - reminds me too much of politicians campaigning.

Commentary has been joking on everyone
The camera man is finding people sleeping in the room

Are you asking for special treatment?

Joke topic?

Regardless, I think it would be cool if female players participated in the regular tourneys. That is, if they even sign up.

First of all, we’re talking about a group of gamers who are for the most part anti-social nerds.

But that’s besides the point. The commentators have been saying shit about everyone, not just girls. And as for the cameraman, he zoomed in on the fat guy who looked like Rufus several times last night, as well as of course a few good looking girls, to satisfy the stream watchers, a good portion of whom are lonely nerds.

But he also has zoomed in on a guy sleeping, an asian girl who appeared to be a massive crackhead, several EXTREMELY unattractive girls, a ton of guys. You’re just picking out the times he HAPPENED to zoom in on a decent looking girl.

I saw the cameraman zoom in on 3 or 4 girls in a row (he was panning and scanning for them) for about 5 minutes. EVO will never be taken seriously with commentators this offensive and a production this poor. Just because you make a racist remark doesn’t mean you can make a sexist remark for balance, as some seam to have alluded to - if anything, that means the problem is worse, not better.

Its this behavior that makes sponsors reconsider the partnership. Oh, and by the way, as I typed this, a commentator said, “any hot girls that want to e-mail me feel free.” How immature.

keits didn’t say any of that shit and you heard him REALLY wrong. he was talking about the MEN’s reaction to their fellow MEN losing to a WOMAN. He said something along the lines of:

When you lose to a girl, everybody [this obviously refers to the most part of the EVO-goers and players, which means MEN] is going to say you suck because you lost to a girl, if you win, everybody will be like “Big Deal, it’s just a girl”.

IF ANYTHING, Keits was criticizing the male attitude and nothing else.

1-Commentators comment on every single thing. From Tatsu’s hair to Marn’s shitty attitude and to his fatness. They say that Rico is buff and that Random dude is skinny. Why wouldn’t they say a girl is pretty? Don’t we all want to be treated the same? Then there you go.

2-The generalization was about male players, and it’s mostly correct.

3-Are you crazy? because kayane was playing against males and her game was being compared to theirs. “her footsie game is far superior to his” and things like that. Furthermore, it was being commentated by James Chen, one of the most respectful commentators on the scene.

4-She lost they proceeded to the next match. She won they said ggs and moved onto the next match. They didn’t patronize her or anything. They grieved kayane’s loss just as much as they grieved any other player’s loss. Unfortunate, ggs, see you next year.

5-If this did Happen, Then that sure is a sad attitude.

Most of your post revolves around the assumption that Keits was talking of female actions when he was talking about male actions. So I think at least THAT POINT should be edited out of your post.

Not gonna step into this minefield of a thread/topic, but on this particular issue, the camera DID zoom on practically every female in sight for about a 5 minute span. It wasn’t super-consistent (the first person he zoomed in on was some random dude’s face for a few creepy seconds), but the cherry-picking was noticeable.

Otherwise, I have no opinion.

Really? okay, then I’ll get that out. i didn’t notice because I left the stream for 15 mins (food, it is good), but I’ll believe you.

more hot chicks please

  1. Commenting on hair, attires, shoes, etc…(as was done with the Texas Tekken 6 player, I dont recall his name) is still not appropriate if it’s not POSITIVE feedback, as color commentating is meant to stay within the subject matter, in this case: the game, fight, and tournament. Now, to argue, that because they can make comment generalizations, they are allowed to make sexist comments as well. Allow me to enlighten you that I’ve seen many people be fired for sexual harassment for MUCH LESS.

I work in academia, and we are presented with sexual harassment classes constantly. This is a very hazy subject for people that have not yet begun their professional career. But this stream is far from crossing the line, it could never be broadcast or put on cable without the FCC fining it a few million dollars.

And yes, I understand that sexual harassment is SPECIALLY misunderstood in a community of younger male players – but that is not an excuse for sexist behavior. The ACT of using gender as tool within a professional setting (this is PROFESSIONAL gaming) is SEXUAL HARASSMENT. Make no mistake, that entire table would have been fired in any respectable setting.

  1. Because YOU haven’t seen the cameraman perv several girls in a row doesn’t mean it didn’t happen. It happened. I was amused, because I dont take EVO seriously - but the fact is that the original poster is correct.

no fun allowed.

fired from what

There were hot chicks?

Commenting on the players, telling jokes, etc etc, this is all part of making the commentating more entertaining. While we all like to get insight on how the game works, personally, and I think many will agree, IT WOULD BE PRETTY FUCKING BORING, if that was all that happened.

There is NO sexual harassment going on here. Apart from the deplorable attitude the camera man apparently displayed, there was no offensive or sexual-in-nature comment towards any females. Do we live in the 15th century? it is common in today’s media for someone to refer to a female or a male by mentioning their characteristics.

Furthermore, this is a redundant discussion, as THE COMMENTATORS didn’t even focus on the fact that she was a female player. They were obviously making a strong effort to avoid it. Maybe one or two comments slipped by, but I think that’s amazing, considering it’s rare to see a female player, especially one of a good level (I’m not saying they don’t exist, I’m saying it’s rare to see one in a tourney) and “sponsored” by daigo.

Going even further, the commentators cannot be “fired” as they are not employees.

kor filing a suit against aris for talking about his hair right now

Pfahahha, aris is Hilarious.