SF2 dizzies are not as random as one might think?


#1

I remember reading in either the turbo or world warrior instruction booklet that 3 consecutive fierce hits can dizzy. (If you dont believe me, try out Guile’s Four Fierce or Chun’s “3 fierce” combos.)
In practice though, the hits do not have to be consecutive, rather, it seems that three-four fierce hits within a short time period can cause a dizzy, and about 6 medium hits with in a bit longer period…
I’ve tested this out and it seems to work, and it also seems that a certain number of mediums can increase the “stun meter” like the fierces, as if they were proportional (This can be seen with Sagat’s fireballs.)
I think that this is the old rule that everyone has forgotten. Help me out if you can.


#2

lolz


#3

I don’t think anyone’s ever thought they were completely random?


#4

This is cute.


#5

Hey according to the wiki, they are random (There’s even an article on it)… But i go by this rule, and it seems to work. And it says “help me out”, so yeah, if you can explain “the why” or an alternate way of determining dizzies, it would be nice- that was in part a reason for the question mark. The other part is that, I thought, that by blatantly stating; “hey I know how dizzy works!” an S.F. “expert” would come with all his buds (of course) and troll the s(tuff) outta me, like we still had some sort of rep system-where everything posted had to be completely groundbreaking or you’d get ultra 'negged.


#6

No no man, it’s just an amusing thing to hear for us because it’s considered common knowledge. Most of us are always happy to actually see new people interested in our old game. :smile:

(For the record, I think it’s pretty cool you were able to start figuring this stuff out on your own.)

ST’s dizzy system works more or less the same way as it does in SF3 and SF4, except you can’t see a gauge for it and you can’t get numbers on it out of training mode.

The word “random” is probably better replaced by “inconsistent” in discussions of the dizzy system. There’s a level of some inexplicable variability as to exactly how much “dizzy damage” is caused by a given attack on any one particular hit. However, there is a fairly recognizable common average amount from which results rarely deviate. If you made a demonstrative graph of dizzy damage caused by an attack (on the horizontal X axis) versus the frequency of causing that much dizzy damage (on the vertical Y axis) to show the spread of probabilities, I think you would get a pretty sharp bell curve. As such, experienced players tend to grow a knack for feeling out how close the characters are to getting dizzied.

If I’m not mistaken, I believe that previous versions of SF2, while using a similar system, had a more wild spread of results for any one specific attack (the bell curve would be shallow), and so it was harder to accurately predict when a character would be dizzied.


#7

Thanks man. Actually I’m not new to sf2, I’ve been playing old sf2 games since I was a little kid (as in like 3-5 yrs old.). I just thought people who thought it was random deserved a heads up… And yeah, inconsistent is a nice term for it- even powerful combos like 4 fierce don’t always dizzy…
BTW, has hdr fixed that inconsistency issue? I mean I know there’s some facet in place to keep you from super abusing some combos…


#8

If you hit four fierce in a combo and your not getting dizzys, you have really bad luck. If you do get a heavy combo like that in, keep up the pressure and get like 2 more shorts in after they wake up and that should get some dizzys. Different players have different combos that dizzy faster. Sim dizzys really fast he he gets 2 drills in followed by a ducking strong. Doesn’t have to be combo’d, but they hits have to be back to back in a very short time frame. Random is not the right word to describe the dizzy system.


#9

most consistent dizzies i’ve seen are ryu’s jumping high kick, crouch medium, fireball and then walk up and trhow as well as chun-li’s crouching medium kick into fierce punch.


#10

Since damage is scaled; and does have a RNG {Random Number Generator} it only follows that unless one can instantaneously calculate the damage scaling for every move with respect to the amount of life left the dizzies have the POTENTIAL to be random; therefore, I would say that if they can be random I would always suspect a possible dizzy opportunity for any opponent whilst playing them (always calculating that chance via basic formula given) so from that perspective I would say random system of dizzies would fit for a beginner, thus allowing them to always pursue the optimum play level available to them at any given time. But, on the other hand, yes for general purposes you are correct that dizzies are not completely random, and far from it at that. Most individuals will not seek information to investigate principles for themselves so basically this post is to save you and me time when playing beginners (increasing our enjoyment, if only a little).

All credit goes to Majestros (Maj) for his article on sonichurricane regarding the system we are discussing. :smokin:
http://sonichurricane.com/articles/sf2randomness.html