i know a generic Alpha 3 thread already exists, but i figured V-Akuma deserved his own thread.
here are the VCs i use. my stuff is pretty limited, so i’m welcoming ppl to post variations and VCs for other purposes. (sorry if the format’s a bit difficult to understand, just something new i’m trying)
standard blow through
(a.a) [FP.hadoken > FP.demon flip (K ender)] repeat to corner
(a.a.a) [FP > hadoken (miss)] repeat til meter runs out
(a.a.b) [SP.shoryuken] repeat til meter runs out
(a.a.c) [FP.demon flip (K ender)] repeat til meter runs out
(a.a.a.a) c.FP > FP.demon flip
(b.a) JP.demon flip (otg) > RK
(b.a.a) = (a.a.a), (a.a.b), or (a.a.c)
I was just wanting to know what V-Akumas most damaging VC is… I am not a A3 buff, but I know a REALLY simple one with Charlie… probably very old but I just picked up the game, dusted it off, and was testing some things. It is a 27-28 hit combo doing 67~ damage I think, just repeated Somersault Kicks in the corner, then end with 2 s.hk… o_o I don’t know, just thought I would see if it is worth anything…
hehe… that’s the first VC i ever learned actually. very simple, but u could try his midscreen carrier VC (more damage with less hits). last i checked Charlie had a reset VC that refilled his meter to about 40% with crouch cancels, but i haven’t pulled it off.
i don’t know what Akuma’s most damaging VC is, but i know that by doing ONLy demon flips instead of repeated [demon flip > hadoken] in the standard VC, u get more damage. his unblockable is a bitch in the corner too coz it can be reset (as BAS demonstrated at B5).
who’s good for fighting off V-Akuma? what does he have to watch out for vs Sak, Nash and the other top tiers? are there any non-top tiers that give him hell…?
StrP shoryuken(or if on the ground c.Fk into Fp red hadoken)
FP demonflip(K ender)
Fp demonflip (k ender)
neutral FP (or you can do a hop kick instead)
Fp demonflip (k ender)
(this only for player 2 side)
after last demonflip in corner do another Fp demonflip but no ender let him slide, he’ll turn around:
Fp demonflip(k ender)
Fp demonflip(k ender)
Fp demonflip(grab ender)
there you go that should be some help… it’s kind of hard to do at first but eventually it’ll become easy…
as for fighting against v akuma, charlie does well, sakura does well… it just all depends on how you play them though.
I have limited experience in this game, but…I find V-Sak does really well against V-Akuma, especially if you can get him the corner. He doesn’t really have any moves that will consistently outprioritize her normals (b. fierce, s. roundhouse), so you can pretty much rape him (force him to eat damage or break his guard and eat damage). Throw into crossup is quite gay. If you can avoid getting VC’ed (save meter for counter VCs), you can give Akuma a very tough time. I suppose V-Charlie does well against him for the basically the same reason. I used to think that V-Gief beat him, but I believe most experts agree that V-Akuma wins that fight (runaway, VC, repeat).
Supposedly V-Dan counters V-Akuma (pushblock, runaway?)…Can someone elaborate on this?
Sak does well against Akuma due to her greater range and priority. As for cornering him, it’s very hard to due even with her because (assuming he has good timing and reflexes), he can still DP her limbs when she tries to hit him. Also, if she is trying to corner him, he can still teleport out of the corner (not sure how safe this is if she has meter though).
I think that Sim should give Akuma a hard time, possible more than any other character. His quick long limbs make it hard for Akuma to get in on him, and he always has the teleport to get away from danger, or ACs if in A-ism. His limbs also have very good priority, as does his in close moves. He also has to be careful of those DPs though, when trying to poke.
I would also try A-Rolento against him, due to his speed and ability to get away.
i don’t know about teleporting out of corners. in my experience Sak gets back in Aku’s face very very quickly. i play this match up a lot but i’m still not very sure what it depends on and would like to become more familiar with it.
on the ground Aku can just jab Sak’s limbs, follow with walk in c.FK xx FP.hadoken. also, i seem to hit Sak a lot with hadokens just before she throws her own, from about half a screen away. is it just me or is Sak’s j.SP annoying anyone else? rushing down Sak seems to be more difficult than doing so other chars coz of it. jump straight up SP smacks Aku while his divekick misses, c.FP smacks Akuma out of hopkicks and seems to have more horizontal range than i give it credit for. what’s the best way to avoid or counter c.SK X3 > b.FP > fat hadoken? what’s the safest way to get out of a Sak midscreen crossup-fest? like crossup.FK > s.JP(whiff) > throw > crossup (empty) > c.SK c.SK c.SK > shou’oken > etc…?
Uh, can you DP Sakura’s limbs on reactions? I would think standing jab is a hell of a lot more reliable for that purpose. And teleporting out of the corner seems really, really risky. At the very least, he’ll eat a standing roundhouse.
In theory, yes. In practice, even the best players in the world can’t do it consistently… if it were half as easy as it sounds, characters like Dhalsim would never even make it mid-tier. Missing a DP against Sakura would usually mean a VC in Akuma’s face. Jabbing limbs (I prefer crouching SP and hitting Sak up the crotch) is a bit less dangerous.
On Akuma vs Rolento my money is solidly on Akuma. Most Rolento players love their anti-air. V-Akuma (any V for that matter) can jump into what seems like an obvious candidate for a stick up the ass, then activate VC and whack away.
confusion/guard crush VC, midscreen:
VC2/3->FP->FP red fireball->whiff demon flip (slide kick ender)->repeat
Done properly I think this is actually a true guard crusher – FP red fireballs (both real and shadow) will be hitting the opponent midscreen and keeping him blockstun. Slowing the combo down a bit turns it into a confusion VC, and chances are one of the fireballs will hit. It can then be converted into a standard midscreen damage VC (which, unfortunately, because it is VC2/3, is hard to convert to a corner VC).
Don’t you have to whiff a crouching Roundhouse for aab?
Another way to do it is B+RK, FP demon flip ended with Kick, hopkick xx FP demon flip ended with kick, standing FP(?) xx [Fierce(?) demon flip with kick]x2, hopkick xx demon flip grab with Roundhouse. At least I think that’s how it goes, I don’t play Akuma, really. VC stolen from Mouko at some tournament. This is VC3, I think.
For the first one, you can actually take out the hopkicks to do a little more block damage, and it’s almost as safe if your timing is good. To the best of my knowlege, faa isn’t safe if blocked. Or are you saying do faa if fa breaks their GC guage?
first one is okay, but you may want to try a hopkick or a sweep instead. Hopkick to get closer, and sweep since it will push them out anyway, and do more GC damage in the process. Also, keep in mind you could use crouching Short instead. Short, short, nothing, or short, forward, red fireball, or short, jab, hopkick, short, axe kick, low Forward, or something.
Second one looks a little dangerous, but I guess it sort of depends on the match. Do you mean cancel the hop kick, or just wait until it’s finished? Don’t you get thrown after that if they crouch under it or block? Third one seems better than a fireball, but you may want to do a low Forward instead, as it leaves you a little less open if you should happen to whiff the Roundhouse, or if they should happen to see it coming.
Seems to me that the tick is a little too slow. And if you can predict when they won’t fall for it, you’d be better off using a DP or something better and/or safer than a crouching Roundhouse.
The first one I like, but the hurricane kick bothers me. Otherwise it’s really good.
Kick teleport is almost ALWAYS a bad idea. Unless you’re already in the corner, and are trying to mess with someone’s head. Even then, you’re probably better off finding a way to PPP teleport out of the corner.
I like to use the overhead as a poke, but just for the second hit. A little too slow for me otherwise. That’s just me though… Regular standing Strong is good…well at least I know Ryu’s is. And since it’s the same move for Akuma, I’m gonna go out on a limb and say it’s good too. More vs stuff that you know is coming though, than a random poke (since it will whiff vs crouchers). Standing Forward is actually a nice move, and I’ve only really ever seen one person use it (and he doesn’t use it anymore…). After empty crossups, you’re probably better off going into a throw.
I think Jab air fireball is better than Fierce, and you probably want to keep your options open as for what to do afterwards. Crouching Short, crouching Fierce is good after blocked crossups. Demon flips CAN be a good idea out of a VC, but not terribly often IMHO, as you can react to them on…well, on reaction.
Vs falling people, you may want to consider crouching/b+Fierce into one of the demon flip grabs (punch one does more damage, but the kick one is prettier). Crouching Short into axe kick is good, but you may want to try doing it into a sweep, so you can get a crossup (or a VC). Last combo will whiff vs a lot of crouchers, and you’re probably better off using a hurricane kick if it hits anyway, so you can put them in a worse position.
Standing Roundhouse and Strong are good vs people Gief, who like to jump in empty. However, since they can’t be canceled on reaction to anything, it’s not as good of an idea vs V-Gief. Crouching Fierce is okay, and both it and standing Jab get let you buffer into a demon flip grab if they jumped in with anything. Strong DP is probably is best anti-air (not counting VCs) because it sets up a crossup. Strong dp, crossup Forward, low Short, repeat if it hits (stolen from a V-Ryu vid which was formerly on Cornertrap). Doesn’t work vs a handful of characters (ie Gief), and you have to keep in mind that they can roll, but it’s a really nice thing to have. Also a nice setup for the unblockable VC, IIRC.
You can actually just do Short hurricane kicks pretty safely if you happen to be across the screen or something. And crouching Strong and Forward are better for canceling that Fierce, as for some reason they give you more meter. You can also do a hurricane kick as you land from an empty jump, and do so pretty safely. Just do it a milisecond before you land, and you still get the meter for it.
Sak has already been explained, though I wouldn’t say she beats him. All top tier characters do well, for the record. It’s said that Charlie beat him, because for one thing, he basically never has to jump, and therefore doesn’t have to get hit with the anti-air VC. And even if he does, there’s a good chance he has meter, so… Anyway, he has really good priority, and a couple of moves that bother shotos more than usual (see standing b+RK), and good everything else.
I think Dhalsim beats him like 6-4. I actually had Sim and Akuma tied for #1 when I tried to tier A3 one time, but since Sim does better in a match between the two, I gave the top spot to Dhalsim. This is A-Sim, btw, though V is okay. Dhalsim has a good Alpha Counter, and the ability to use it without getting GCed, good supers, good normals and throws, great range, obviously, Crazy Air Throw of Justice, and of course the C-C-C-C-COMBO BREAKER, ala Killer Instinct.
Sodom does okay, but he has to be real careful when he’s out of meter. Ditto Ryu…you could consider saving it for reversing Akuma’s VCs, like someone mentioned over in the A3 thread, and like Valle was doing VS BAS at B5 (though ironically, I think that costed him a couple of the matches).
Gief doesn’t beat him either, but does well, just because of the ridiculous amount of damage he can do, and the fact that in practical terms, all Gief players are required to figure out how to beat shotos to get anywhere with their character. Ambiguous jumpin doesn’t hurt either. A-Gief has a good AC, and the meter to spare to use it, though V-Gief is the better character for this match, IMHO.
Regarding teleporting out of the corner vs Sak, yes, you can buffer into it. Also, teleport is invincible from about the abdomen down, so if you smell a sweep or low Forward or fireball coming from Sak, you can teleport then.
Like I said before, I don’t really play Akuma (this is all just stuff I’ve picked up over time), so I can’t give you a basic game plan. However, you can throw after an empty crossup, or VC through her Short, since she can’t cancel into anything that will save her. Also, use your fireball every so often. Puts on preassure from the right distance, and encourages jumping, if nothing else. And once you see the throws coming, the match gets a lot more winnable. Sorry to be so vague.
I have never, ever heard of V-Dan countering V-Akuma. The whole problem with the pushblock is that it leaves Dan out of options, AFAIK, and he still loses Guard meter. Even if he could keep Akuma out (which I don’t think he can at all), I don’t see how he could win the match.
-Crossup from Strong DP, already mentioned earlier
-After ending a VC in the corner, let them flip, and you neutral jump Short, cc jump Fierce, and I think you can CC into something after that. If they don’t flip, you can of course go for an air throw or whatever.
-After landing a hurricane kick midscreen, if they flip towards you, and maybe neutral also, you can do b+Fierce into demon flip grab, or just do a VC and start it with standing Roundhouse. Or you can try and jump throw them.
-Standing Fierce does a lot of GC damage
I never meant that you can always DP Sakura’s limb’s every time. But from my experience, Sak players just love to throw out that standing RH, and they tend to get relatively predictable with it.
I definitely agree that A-Sim is probably the best choice for fighting V-Akuma. Another thing about not being able to DP Sim’s limbs is that Sim has a lot more variety in his ranged pokes than anyone else, so if a person is mixing it up, it makes it so much harder to DP them.
I still think a good Rolento player can do decently against V-Akuma. He does have good anti-air, decent poke range, and after recently playing with him a bit, I’ve noticed that his cr. FP does almost a full block’s worth of block meter.
I have found though, that V-Akuma gives virtually everyone problems.
Rolento fighting Akuma off is a pretty big claim i think. i’m sold that he breaks both A-Akuma or even A-Shin Akuma, but not V. ppl with DPs and anti air VCs already get rushed down, and Rolento doesn’t have any of those. but yeah, Aku gives everyone problems…
nah, in VC1 the SP.shoryuken takes long enough to land. maybe the JP version would need the c.RK…
cool VC, with the hopkick > demon flip > slam. many many style points
always cancelling the hopkick…
agh. KKK teleport IS a bad idea. should’ve been c.FK > PPP.teleport. just wanted to emphasize cancelling into the port from a move type (K > P.port or P > K.port) to reduce negative edge slop.
i’ve really avoided FP, i keep forgetting it did good block damage. i’mma try it later on. and yes FK is nice.
should’ve been JP.air fireball > b.RK. d’oh.
is it just the FP version or can Aku cancel c.FP at any point in animation on arcade? the demon flip has trouble reaching sometimes. oh, and i think the K one does more damage by itself, but the P one can be comboed after (probably what u meant)…
i haven’t tried SP.shoryuken, didn’t know it set up crossups. i always thought it knocked far away ala Ryu or allowed a flip…
does Akuma have many good corner damage VCs in VC2 or 3…? i’ve used VC1 religiously for a very long time just for the corner transition, and since otg works off that anyway. i’ve recently started trying a VC2/3 combo that looks like c.SP > c.RK > JP.hadoken > JP.roll > JP.roll > repeat (ripoff of a Ken Oriren). the damage is nice and he can transition into an otg, but the corner juggling isn’t so hot.
With the Akuma vs Rolento thing…well Rolento has like one of the best Alpha Counters in the game, but unlike Sim, I think Rolento is going to end up doing his fair share of blocking, which is bad. Plus he likes to jump a lot, which is also not so great… Does better vs Akuma than VS Gief, anyway…yipes…
Crouching Fierce is cancellable until after it’s fully extended…just easier to do it before. I believe this is true for ARK, Rose, Dan, Karin, and anyone else who has a cancellable crouching Fierce anything like theirs (Sak, Cody, etc). I think Strong demon flip is the best one to combo into for anti-air. And I remember the demon flip grab with P doing more damage than the one with K, (though this may vary depending on whether they’re in the air or not), but I will check it out tonight.
Strong DP can be flipped out of if you don’t get all 3 hits, like if you DP too early or possibly if you get a Major Counter. Otherwise they can’t flip out of it.
Only corner VCs I ever end up using are DP, whiff fireball [standing Fierce xx fireball] until VC ends, and then end it with b+fierce into demon flip with punch, or something. You can whiff a hopkick in there after the first fierce or fireball, if you’re too far from the corner. There’s all sorts of stuff Akuma can do in the corner (ie GC/block damage VC, corner juggles, unblockable rest, probably turn them around and do the midscreen, etc), but that’s one of the better VCs to do just for damage, especially if you’re starting it in the corner and don’t have to worry about damage scaling.