SFA3: All about Zangief


#1

Since the A3: Everthing thread has become unmanageable for individual character help I’ve deicded to take Zangief and give him his own home. These posts came from all over. Some from the A3: Everything thread and a lot from salvaged A3 threads before the SRK forums blew up. I’ll try to organize the sections into semi-relevant pieces and always give credit to the original posters.

Quick Summary
General Strategies
V-ISM Specifics
Fighting Dhalsim
Other Match-ups
Miscellaneous

There’s also a lot of stuff on fighting against Zangief and if there’s a big enough interest we can post it here also.


#2

Quick Summary

This post is here by me to handle the common questions that come every up now and then in the A3: Everything thread. In no particular order:

Resources

http://www.shoryuken.com/features/s000329.shtml
SRK’s guide to maximizing your spinning pile driver range. This is very important for all Gief players to know and if you have not read it yet you should do so now.

http://www.shoryuken.com/features/s000602.shtml
Zangief’s kattobi cancel. If you’re interested in V-Gief you should read this.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/coinop/arcade/game/11395.html
Under In-Depth FAQs lies JChen’s A3 Systems Guide. Contains a lot of great information least of which is an “Off The Ground” section that pertains to V-ISM Zangief.

http://shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?
The previously mentioned A3: Everything thread. Though more of a free-for-all A3 discussion than coherent strategy guide, there is still a lot of activity and people who are willing to answer questions on anything Alpha 3.

Spinning Pile Driver Ranges

Quick list of ranges taken from the above SPD guide for reference. In pixels:

Button Full Range Pre-jump
Jab: 84 68
Strong: 80 64
Fierce: 76 60
Kick (any): 64 56

Popular V-ISM Combos

These are just the generic V-ISM Zangief combos since a lot of people tend to just ask, “I need VC’s for Geif.” For more detailed descriptions and analysis see the V-ISM Specifics section.

[VC1]: KKK Lariat -> FP Banishing Flat -> [ (whiff) C.SK * FP Banishing Flat ] (repeat)

Note: This VC is very modifiable. It can be VC1, VC2, or VC3. The crouching kick can be of any strength or even omitted if you have the timing. Corner options discussed below.

[VC1]: KKK Lariat -> S.FP -> [ (whiff) FP Banishing Flat * S.FP ] (repeat)

Note: This VC is considerably more elegant and damaging than the first. It also can be VC1, VC2, or VC3. The whiffed Banishing Flat can also be done w/ SP, which helps with the timing by allowing you to use two fingers for the punches.

Corner Options: When you reach the corner you have some choices.

S.RK (repeat)

Zangief can juggle with repeated roundhouses in the corner. There’s a rhythm to it.

FP Banishing Flat (repeat)

You can actually keep them up in the air with the Banishing Punch if you slow it down enough.

Anti-air Note: It’s worth mentioning that for anti-air the Lariat can be air-blocked under certain circumstances. To combat this some people start the VC with a JP Banishing Flat, though it’s considerably more difficult as you have to worry about the controller motion and the jump-in angle.

The other VC is sometimes known as the glitch VC or the three 360+K VC. This VC is pretty difficult and only works under certain situations. You have to be on the left side of the opponent (in game, not controller side). It only works in the arcade version. You also need at least 75% meter for all 3 grabs.

[VC3]: 360 + K -> (otg) 360 + K -> (whiff) JP Banishing Flat * 2 -> (otg) 360 + K.

Note: I’ll try to keep this brief. It’s all in the first 360. You have to hit the kick button at the very last possible period of your VC activation. I lost the technical data on the window, but shoot for the last possible frame of your activation (chi gathering) before you start the VC. If you get it Zangief will do the suplex but land practically on top of the opponent when done. You’ll know if you get it because the spin will be a little funky.

After that grab them off the ground again. Then go sacrifice something to aid in the 3rd 360 since it’s all luck at that point.

Note: And since everyone asks, no this cannot be done off a kattobi cancel. The first suplex has to be performed during the activation period. By the time you’re kattobing across the screen you’ve already lost that window.


#3

General Strategy

Posted by jchensor on 05:24:2001 05:44 AM:

Let’s just do a start-up of strategies here… If you want to play Zangief, you can’t rely on tick throws. Actually, once you play Zangief a lot, you start to learn that Tick Throws are about 5% of your SPD opprtunities. You have to learn how to maximize Zangief’s SPD range, or else you simply cannot win as effectively as possible.

Once you do that, 95% of your SPDs will be just walk-up or jump-in SPDs. Learn his basic ground game: Crouching Fierce, Crouching Roundhouse, Crouching Jab, Standing Forward, and the Kick Lariat… Learn how to use those moves properly (their roles will be discussed in a later post). Once you learn those in a good ground game, you’ll open up the SPD game. If the enemy becomes worried about attacking (thanks to the Kick Lariat), you have a much easier time walking up and SPDing the enemy.

But the one thing you’ll learn about 'Gief is the magical Jump distance. There is a perfect distance at which, if you Jump at the enemy, VERY few Normal Moves can hit you (outside of stuff like Cody’s Stand Roundhouse). And right when you land, you can reach the enemy with a Jab SPD (extended range) and a Jumping Fierce will also reach the enemy. So if you jump at this distance, you can grab a LOT of people with SPDs. Otherwise, jump with Jumping Fierce to get enemies to block. Very few characters can stop it from this distance.

The main way you can get punished is an anti-air V-ism. You can lose up to 80% from a good anti-air V-ism. However, outside of V-Isms, there is almost no way anyone can really do THAT much damage to you outside of Supers. But, Supers and V-Isms both have the same weakness: Start-up. The Chi-gathering for either one is a dead giveaway. Especially for V-Isms. If you see a V-Ism get activated to anti-air you, respond with your own V-Isms in the air, then nail them with a Jumping Jab or Short or something, land and SPD them in the V-Ism to combo.

So once you get good at walk-up SPDs and master that Jump-in distance, you can land yourself a LOT of SPDs. Jumping with Zangief is by far safer than ANY other character in Alpha 3. And never forget that his Splash works wonders on people who don’t have good anti-airs at all.

I’ll get into the poking and ground game a bit more in detail next post…


#4

Posted by jchensor on 07:18:2001 06:19 AM:

The ground game consists of small Crouch Jab pokes, Stand SHort, Stand Forward, Crouching Roundhouse, and Crouch Fierce MOSTLY. Other moves can be used… THe Banishing Flat can be used occasionally, for example, to beat things like Sagat’s kicks. Also, Kick Lariat is still the ultimate anti-poke, even in Alpha 3. Crouch Fierce is a good space controller, which allows you get passed that “far range” and move in closer. Stand Forward is a good poke. Crouch Roundhouse will catch people off gaurd occasionally, and Crouching Jab is a good poke up close. But all of these things really just help Zangief get in close enough to do one of two things…

First is walk up SPD. Walk-up Jab SPD (using the Whiffed Jab technique) makes Zangief REALLY scary. John Choi does this VERY well and efficiently. Very scary. :slight_smile: Learn the whiffed Jab technique, and learn the distance. Once you get the enemy scared to anti-poke you thanks to your Ground Game, you can walk-up SPD more often than you think.

Second thing is to just jump in. Learn the magic distance, the one you referenced. The distance is about the max range you can jump from to land a Jumping Fierce. A little bit closer than that makes it so that you can Punch them with Fierce, or land and SPD thm. The other benefit of this distance is that anti-airs (Dragon Punches, Crouch Fierces, etc.) will in fact completely miss you. There’s really no other way to properly describe the magic distance… Just experiment with it, and you’ll eventually learn it.

Save your Custom Combo as an Anti-Custom Combo, for the most part. Use it if you’ve got a clear anti-air V-Ism set-up, but otherwise, jump in, and if the enemy tries to VC you with an Anti-Air V-ism, respond with your own V-Ism and blow through their attack with a combo into SPD.

For the Custom, the Standing Fierce one is best. Better transition into corner combo and does more damage. HARDER, but still better to learn. And yes, you CAN Air-Block the Lariat. I’ve heard that in Japan, players start the Custom with a Jab Banishing Flat instead, which canNOT be Air Blocked. And I think if you do with the right timing, you can nail the enemy before they can nail you with your invincibility period.

And I THINK you can Combo the Jad Banishing Flat after a Defensive Crouching Forward, but that’s a bit tougher to do, since you have to go from Defensive Crouch into a DP motion. No “simple” way to do the combo.

Anything you’d like me to go into more depth on?

  • James

#5

Posted by omni on 08:23:2001 04:23 PM:

In the beta of A3, Xism had no guard meter, but every version you have played Xism has a guard meter, therefore gief can be guard broken. I don’t know who told you that one…

I played X Gief in the very beginning cause he does so much damage and you baically only need one button (fierce), but now I play nothing but V and sometimes A when I’m bored.

I personally think V is the best gief in the game cause you have so many options. A is good cause of the damage you get (it gets frustrating landing 8 billion jab spds with v and still only doing 50% to the opponent) but overall A doesn’t have as many options when you get to a higher level of play.

You NEED to learn Jab SPD tactics. My main game with Zangief these days is nothing but jumping from this one specific range, that range being if I do jumping fierce (the flying superman thing) then that will force the opponent to block and or be hit, and if I press nothing while in the air, i can land and do jab spd and grab the opponent if they do nothing.

The technique that I use every single time I go for Jab SPD’s is this:

Do the spd joystick motion then press Jab with the middle finger then ‘drum’ the Jab button with your index finger IMMEDIATELY. What happens is that you get a standing Jab (whiffed) buffered into Jab SPD. We wrote an article on this which you can read more about by clicking on the articles up above. Trust me, it’s a good thing to learn.

The good thing about this is that you are jumping from a distance where it’s really really hard for the opponent to hit you, yet you get to do damage via the jumping fierce or the max range jab spd.

Once the opponent gets frustrated and starts attacking you, then you can kick it and either play stndard counter games or go for a vc. At really high levels, it’s so hard to land a vc though, so I never ever VC unless the opponent vc’s first. At B5 when BAS was playing VAkuma, he basically never VC’ed unless it was something completely and utterly guaranteed (like when they through a fireball) or he’ll VC after the opponent VCs. I like to VC in the very beginning of the 1st round, cause I can gain a big lead and build up meter during the rest of the round so I can start off with 50% or more for 2nd round.

Zero 3 upper sucks, don’t play it. Thawk sucks too in it.

Good luck,

Derek Daniels


#6

Posted by omni on 08:24:2001 04:42 PM:

Yeah, the Jab SPD is totally worth the damage tradeoff. It serves two purposes to be honest. The first is that it’s basically free damage. Granted it’s not a lot…but you are at least doing something where the opponent isn’t.

The second thing that it does is more mental than anything else. For the past 10 billion years, Zangief’s SPD has done a gang of damage and the opponent knows this. So when they get hit by a SPD, they are used to thinking, ‘fuck - i just got hit by this high damaging move, i gotta do something now’ and start doing stupid stuff. Plus, people just hate to be hit by this thing. Doing like 2 or 3 in a row, even though you are doing essentially no damage - it makes the opponent wake up and start trying to attack.

The green hand to get in on the opponent? Hrm…it’s okay I guess. I only really use it for anti air and a few other things. It can get you killed in a lot of situations.

Yeah, upper sucks. No one plays it at SHGL. When BAS was at B5, I was talking to him about upper and he’s all, ‘upper? it sucks’. Then I go, ‘what about pro?’ and he’s all, ‘capcom vs. snk pro?? it sucks’. Seems like no one likes it.

Vs. V Akuma? It’s a good matchup. The general strategy that most gief players is to do nothing but jump towards akuma no matter what. Even if you get hit, get up and keep jumping. You do more damage and akuma has a good chance of being damaged by 8 billion jumping fierces. I prefer to jump and keep my fingers over custom just in case they custom while also hitting fierce. So that way while I’m jumping if Akuma tries to anti air vc me, I can vc instead of hitting fierce. It’s a gamble, don’t get me wrong. But if you get really good at Zangief’s custom, then it’s a gamble worth taking IMO.

Derek Daniels


#7

Posted by omni on 08:24:2001 06:06 PM:

You don’t want to land next to them, if you did, you would be doing fierce spd. You want to land at the max range of Jab SPD. If you click here:

http://www.shoryuken.com/features/s000329.shtml

There is an article about it for more information. Yeah, I know the video link isn’t working. I’ll crack the whip on javi and get it going.

So yeah, you want to land like at the tip of a shoto’s low forward. At this range, your jumping fierce still hits, but there are very few things the opponent can hit you with. When you land they have to do something, if not they get jab spd’ed. Things they can do is jump or get off the ground with a special such as hurricane kick, flash kick, etc. Since dragon punches have a frame where they are on the ground, I’ve even heard, ‘shoryuken’ and grabbed Ryu anyways - but don’t count on this ^_^.

You can jump in and VC through the uppercut also, so don’t forget that.

The main VC that I do is VC3 (Fierce+Roundhouse activation), Kick Lariat (it’s better to start off with the green hand cause they can airblock the lariat, but not the green hand), then cancel the Kick Lariat with a standing fierce (hits), cancelled into a whiffed fierce hand, standing fierce, whiff hand, standing fierce, whiff hand, etc.

There are a variety of enders, ranging from repeated standing roundhouse kicks, to another lariat then whiff hand, otg rbg, etc. Just take a look at some of the vc’s that James Chen has done here on srk, check out the vc’s over at www.cornertrap.com and check out the ones on BAS’s page - i forget the url though. we had it our front page at one - it’s the one with the character selection screen.

Derek Daniels


#8

*Posted by omni on 08:24:2001 06:06 PM: *

You don’t want to land next to them, if you did, you would be doing fierce spd. You want to land at the max range of Jab SPD. If you click here:

http://www.shoryuken.com/features/s000329.shtml

There is an article about it for more information. Yeah, I know the video link isn’t working. I’ll crack the whip on javi and get it going.

So yeah, you want to land like at the tip of a shoto’s low forward. At this range, your jumping fierce still hits, but there are very few things the opponent can hit you with. When you land they have to do something, if not they get jab spd’ed. Things they can do is jump or get off the ground with a special such as hurricane kick, flash kick, etc. Since dragon punches have a frame where they are on the ground, I’ve even heard, ‘shoryuken’ and grabbed Ryu anyways - but don’t count on this ^_^.

You can jump in and VC through the uppercut also, so don’t forget that.

The main VC that I do is VC3 (Fierce+Roundhouse activation), Kick Lariat (it’s better to start off with the green hand cause they can airblock the lariat, but not the green hand), then cancel the Kick Lariat with a standing fierce (hits), cancelled into a whiffed fierce hand, standing fierce, whiff hand, standing fierce, whiff hand, etc.

There are a variety of enders, ranging from repeated standing roundhouse kicks, to another lariat then whiff hand, otg rbg, etc. Just take a look at some of the vc’s that James Chen has done here on srk, check out the vc’s over at www.cornertrap.com and check out the ones on BAS’s page - i forget the url though. we had it our front page at one - it’s the one with the character selection screen.

Derek Daniels


#9

Posted by Gunter on 08:25:2001 06:27 AM:

Okay, I’m joining this thread a little late, so forgive me. Usually SRK is just a bunch of ppl wondering what team in MvC2 is top tier, and other ppl saying that whatever team A-san said is top tier is NOT top tier. Oh, and then of course the ppl who then ask James Chen who HE thinks is top tier. So I’ve been avoiding.

But when it comes to Gief threads, I simply can’t pass them up.

For the majority of my A3 career (which is since its debut until B5), I have been an A-Gief user. I still have difficulty conceding that V-Gief is better. I think they are at best, equal. Omni covered V-Gief pretty excellently. The only thing I would not agree with is his “vs. V-Akuma” strategy. Since B5, Choi and I have been playing this matchup a LOT, and although I think the majority of my wins against him were charity wins, I do know that jumping AT V-Akuma will get you nowhere. The most annoying thing to Choi was my anti-air jumping jab. This is without a doubt Zangief’s BEST anti-air, if for no other reason than that you are NOT ON THE GROUND while performing it. Hence, you are less susceptible to being combo’d. When fighting Akuma, you should concentrate on your ground game, as according to Choi Gief wins that… You do this mainly by s.forward, s.short, and most of all STANDING FIERCE. S.Fierce is especially good after a knockdown, as many ppl like to walk forward or jump as they get up. The Fierce will hit them as they do so. Once Akuma takes to the air, jump straight up and jab him. Worst case scenario - he blocks it. Otherwise, you are hitting him out of just about anything he tries to hit you with. Other than that little strategy, follow omni’s advice for everything, as his Zangief is eons better than mine (damn that max range SPD!).

Now for A-Gief info. I still consider A-Gief to be a worthy tournament selection. Offensively I think he is a better choice than V-Gief. His ground game is entirely identical to V-Gief except for one move - V-Gief’s toward+strong hop. That is an excellent move, but you can make do without it. By making do without it, you are now doing more damage per hit than V-Gief does (as is true for all A-ism characters when compared to their V-ism counterparts). Since omni explained how to use V-Gief so well, I’ll just go into how to make use of Gief’s supers when using him in A-ism.

At lower levels of play, you will more than likely see a lot of Kick Supers with Zangief. While this is definitely a recommended tactic, you’ll notice that at lower levels, they are not comboing into it. If not combo’d it is totally escapable. I can think of two extremely good situations to land the Kick Super -

  1. Jumping Anti-Air Hit (e.g. Jab)
  2. Ground Anti-Air Hit (pref. s.jab… although c.jab also works)

For 1) you will be taking advantage of the crouch cancel feature that has ruined A3. Remember that when counter hitting an opponent air-to-air, you can prevent them from teching away by not making your sprite go through a neutral frame. You can do this by doing any of 3 moves the instant you land - special, super, or CROUCH. Crouching and then jumping again lets you get another hit “FOR FREE!” You can also do a DP motion just before you land, and then hit Fierce as you touch the ground, and you can combo an inescapable Green Hand for another hit (this is what I tend to do 99.9% of the time). However, the best and most non-ghetto thing to do (hence the thing I tend NOT to do… doh) is to pump a double-FB motion just before you land… then hitting the appropriate kick button with which to combo a Kick Super. Because you are bypassing neutral frames, the opponent cannot tech out, and it is a free grab for tons of damage.

For 2) the reason I say to use s.jab is so you can do the FB motion-Jab-FB motion-Roundhouse sequence to guarantee your super. Zangief has no FB+punch special move. Hence, if you DO FB+punch, all you get is a s.jab. IF you anti-air with this, AND IF it counter hits, you can then continue into FB+Roundhouse for an inescapable Kick Super.

But I don’t do either of those options. Many people say I don’t because I am infamous for being Ghetto. I will almost always footsweep a whiffed DP/FK when a Fierce SPD would be better… and if I do an SPD at ALL, it’s usually a Jab one even at point blank range. I’m just ghetto like that.

However, my favorite usage of the super bar is anything BUT ghetto.

You will rarely ever see me use the Kick Super. Only about 0.1% of the time am I using the Kick Super. 0.4% of the time my bar is for Alpha Counters. 99.5% of the time, it is for FABs.

The simplest way to land an FAB is to jump in, do the motion in the air, and land while pressing the appropriate punch. You can whiff a move in the air if you want, though that is mainly to A) pre-counter their move, and B) fake them out.

The next simplest way is to tick into it. A favorite trick of mine which I stole from James Chen’s match on the B4 tape (Chensor taught me Zangief before B3, in the good old A2 days…), is to beat their wakeup with a c.short and buffer into an FAB from that. In the corner, if your opponent jumps after the short, you can anticipate that and switch to a Kick Super, but that’s another story.

Now for my favorite trick with A-Gief. “My Trick”. Actually, it isn’t my trick, but simply something I picked up in my training time in the 2 1/2 years I lived in Japan. However, since I’ve never seen anybody else in the US use it (prolly cuz everyone else in the US is using V-Gief… except for Chocobo and his damn Crazy No-ism Gief! Grrr…), I am claiming it as My Trick -

Anti-Air Final Atomic Buster.

This is easily the best usage of a super in the game, style-wise. Vs. any air hit that hits HIGH, and ESPECIALLY shotos Air HKs, whiff a c.short and use that animation to anchor you while you do a 720+punch. If timed correctly, they will land in your FAB. You can also do this after a whiffed DP (esp. a blocked Sakura Fierce DP… but you’ll probably only see that situation if your opponent misjudged how much energy/guard meter you had left), but anti-air is MUCH more flashy.

-David Alexander S. Dial-


#10

Posted by mondu_the_fat on 03:03:2002 03:15 AM:

It’s hard to label Gief as being rushdown/turtle. Most of the time he’s positioning for a max range SPD, which means staying out of range for almost anything the opponent can do. Z-Gief’s kick super (especially right after jabbing your opponent out of the air) smells turtlish, but landing an FAB is not. V-Gief’s main VC is definitely a turtle tactic, since there is almost no way to land it offensively other than being preceeded by a deep cross-up Body Splash, while that triple Siberian Piledriver VC is, almost by definition, a rush-down strat.

About the Honda thing: One thing about SFZ3 (and all SFs, but Z3 is prominent; EX is worse) is that attacks will not connect given a certain distance from the ground. For example, trying to get Zangief’s jumping FP or most weak attacks to hit shoe-lace deep is very hard to do – you’ll here the audio cue for the move and even see the first few frames of the move come out, but the attack won’t hit. Now factor in Honda’s height. When he’s crouching, he’s very low on the ground and you’d have to time it well to hit him deep, but if you do the move too late your move simply whiffs. Then he SPDs you when you land. Yes, Gief can do the same, in a fashion – “Gunter’s Trick” illustrates this. Unfortunately, while the CPU can do it on a regular basis, attempting to SPD/FAB an opponent as he whiffs a jumping attack isn’t practical for humans. It requires that your opponent do a mistake that’s ultimately punishable by a VC – in Gunter’s Gief example, an attack that hits that high would have been punished by the standard Gief VC. A human V-Honda would have headbutted VC.

It’s possible to SPD right after blocking an attack, provided it isn’t in the middle of a combo. For example, if an opponent tries to hit Gief too high, Gief can SPD him when he lands. Learning to do reversals helps.

There isn’t any special timing required for ticking: ticking isn’t useful in the first place, and not really a skill worth expounding on. If your opponent is the type whom you can standing SK -> SPD regularly he isn’t the type you should learn Gief with.

On Gen: Yeah, when I was starting with Z3 (with Z-Gief) I also found Gen annoying, but the fact that you can even air-block that kick of his tells something about your opponent – his timing sucks. He’s using the kick on reaction, hoping for a hit. In this case, using a VC drop-through won’t be useful, since you’ll be trying to react against what is basically a random act. Concentrate on your ground game instead. Gen and Gief have comparable ground priority, but Gief has his JP SPD to back him up.

My favorite method of getting max SPD range is by jumping into it. Green Gloving into range (then use the recovery time to spin the stick) also works, but getting into right range prior to the glove is a bit hard – right after a successful SPD as your opponent is getting up seems best. Most human opponents go into a state of shock right after being SPD’d, and since Gief is so far away a lot really can’t react when Gief Gloves into max range, not seeing him as an immediate threat. Remember: green Glove into max range and no closer, otherwise Zangief will end up eating something. I don’t like whiffing a standing JP into an SPD, mainly because I get hit while doing the jab, but maybe it’s just me screwing it up


#11

*Posted by Apoc on 03:07:2002 03:01 PM: *

On the subject, I had a talk with Calipower a few days ago and V-Gief was brought up. I had a good laugh when he talked about how good Japanese V-Gief was. What was funny was the reason. What’s funnier is that the reason is true. The Japanese are the only V-Giefs that can do the extended range grab from both sides consistantly! LOL TO think that one minor thing is what separates it at all.

I use V-Gief and I use a lot of walk-up SPDs with the extended range, I make use of the katobbi cancel if it’s strategically applicable, and I commonly use about 4 versions of OTG combos. Needless to say, I don’t lose too often with V-Gief if the controls are nice. But my biggest weakness IS only being able to do the extended range grab from one side perfectly. LOL. How deadly would I be if I had it 100% from both sides without having to cancel the whiff jab? It comes down to laziness I think. I’m just not interested in spending a grip of time learning how to do something on the other side. To me, that’s pretty darned funny. Because V-Gief is very easy to use once you understand him and have his skills down. This is the “free-damage” character afterall. Still, I don’t see anyone in the US busting the extended grab from both sides. I think that anyone can pick up Gief and learn the necessities(although those without great footgames will be at a loss in some matches)and use him to place highly even at a national level.

I dunno, I just find it funny that the only thing that separates good US giefs vs. good Japanese Giefs is laziness. I see a player doing extended grabs from both sides I think: “Shit, dude is tight”. Even if that’s his only strength lol.

The extended grab is his biggest asset I believe.

Apoc.


#12

V-ISM Specifics

*Posted by mondu_the_fat on 10-16-2002 05:38 PM: *

Superassrider: Here are Gief’s combos that I know of.

VC3 -> KKK lariat -> (green glove -> whiff anything) repeat until in corner -> repeat RK

VC3 -> KKK lariat -> (FP -> whiff green glove) repeat until corner -> repeat RK

The second VC is slightly more powerful (on a full meter it does around 10% more damage, on half meter the benefit is really obvious), but a bit harder (the first combo you can just mash out whiloe the second requires timing). With a cross-up splash I’ve been able to squeeze as much as 90% off the second one, but these combos are generally used as anti-air.

Alternatively, you can end the VC with an OTG throw (which is a lot easier than repeated RKs, BTW), but be aware that this is can be rolled away from.

From the old posts, Gief has also these combo, but I can’t do them so you may want to find someone that does to fully explain:

VC3 -> 360+K -> 360+K -> whiff green glove -> whiff green glove -> 360+K

or maybe it was

VC3-> 360+K -> 360+K -> whiff green glove -> 360 +P

Anyway, AFAIK, you cannot use this with kattobi cancel. You literally have to be standing right next to your opponent when you start the VC.


#13

*Posted by Gunter on 10-16-2002 07:01 PM: *

For this combo (affectionately called the Glitchdriver combo for nostalgic reasons), you have to have 75% meter and be to the left of the opponent. Immediately upon activation with any strength VC, grab with any kick SPD and the opponent will land next to you. That’s the easy part. Timing the next kick SPD is kinda hard, then the 3rd one you’re just praying that you cover their wakeup with a Green Hand so you can get them out of block stun, or get there in time to OTG them.

I like to have them block a splash first and then activate and do it. I’ve also done it as anti-air (ala Anti-Air FAB), but that way is less reliable. If you have them block a splash (with you to the left of the opponent), that’s pretty much guaranteed win if you can do the Glitchdriver combo consistently.

Also, this glitch only works in the arcades and on the ROMs (i.e., not on console).


#14

*Posted by Gunter on 10-19-2002 06:50 PM: *

Because it’s a glitch, and one of the stipulations of that glitch is that you have to be immediately next to and to the left of the opponent when you activate, and cancel your activation with a 360 Kick Grab. If you Kattobi cancel, you aren’t immediately next to and to the left of the opponent when you activate, so you cannot cancel your activation with a 360 Kick Grab, can you?

Actually, it’s a Banishing Flat. The Green Hand isn’t actually a fist at all, it’s a palm slap… hence its name is “Flat”. We all already knew this, and we don’t care. No one goes around calling FBs “Wave Motion Punch”, or SPDs “Screw Piledriver” for that matter. We have our own names for the moves. The Green Hand has been called The Green Hand since it came out in ST, because the first time someone saw it, it was green… or something like that.


#15

*Posted by mondu_the_fat on 07:21:2001 04:06 AM: *

Here’s the VC I most commonly use:

(any VC) -> KKK lariat -> (FP Green glove -> whiff crouching FK) repeat until opponent cornered -> whiff crouching/standing FK or crouching RK -> OTG throw

You can use any VC. VC1 gives more hits, but less damage (damage scaling is a bitch). VC2 and VC3 give the same amount of hits, but VC2 tends to mess up the OTG throw because the shadow’s attacks hits the opponent before he touches the ground. I use VC3.

You can skip the whiff crouching FK and just juggle your opponent with the FP Green glove, but the whiff crouching FK gives more “rhythm” and allows you to do the combo easily.

If your meter is 100% full, you can do this combo from end to end (that is, you start with your back to the corner and you’ll end the VC with the OTG at the other corner). On a full meter and VC3, you can get the KKK lariat to hit for 2, the green glove would hit for 7, then the OTG throw (usually I use the running grab, since the timing is easier than pie, but if you can get the double suplex to hit then good for you) for a total or 10 hits. The shadow shouldn’t hit at all. This will do up to 60-80% damage, depending on who you’re fighting. With VC1, the KKK lariat hits 3-5 times (depending on how deep it hit), the green glove should hit twice – one from Zangief himself and one from the shadow (if you can’t get the glove to hit twice then used VC3 instead) for 14 (7 gloves x 2), then the OTG thow. Damage is 40-70%.

If your meter is 50% full, you can do this at midscreen. This should give you an idea on where to place yourself if you want to land the VC fully.

This combo can be used as anti-air and against a grounded opponent (mainly because the KKK lariat will hit even crouching opponents). When used as anti-air, be aware that the KKK lariat is air-blockable. If your opponent knows what you’re planning it can be pretty hard to land it. More and more I’ve been having to use this combo against grounded opponents.

Cross-up Body splash -> VC.

One problem with this VC is if you’re forced to use it from, say, midscreen while you’re 100% full. You’d end up doing the OTG throw then landing too far away to use the rest of your meter. This sucks.

He’re one solution: the OTG throw should be the double suplex, then do a Green glove then do an OTG JP SPD. It’s supposed to work, but for the life of me I’ve never been able to do it. The OTG double suplex is hard enough.

Sorry, I can’t help you with the standing FP VC. I can’t do it.


#16

*Posted by Apoc on 06-28-2002 05:23 PM: *

It’s like akuma’s in that you must grab them while they’re flat on the ground just after the bounce that occurs when they land on their back. Thing here is, I think it is so much easier because Gief’s spds are instant frame grabs and his drss feel like it anyway:P So you can just time the button press to match the moment that they land flat.

Characters land differently so, to do these on every character, you may want to watch closely.

Some common ones:
After one DRS(player one side glitch)
far long RH, fierce green hand(pause)–

My personal favorite is less practical but I always got it a lot anyway:P KKK in the corner, activate-- The trick to doin’ this is to pause and then activate RIGHT when they are flat. VCs stop time and you can cancel that timestop into the special. So you can just watch and you’ll get this one

Finally, if, for some reason, you trip them while they are in your face(instead of 360), activate–

Hope that helps.

Apoc.


#17

*Posted by v-ryu_jimmy on 09-28-2002 05:59 AM: *

with v-zangief:

in cornertr: PP throw > start OC > 360^^

or even the one i put im my old video :

start OC > 360+K > 360+K > walk > 360+P


#18

*Posted by toilet on 07-23-2002 07:44 AM: *

Well, don’t forget you can grab them in hit-stun while in a VC, so you can kick them in the face then SPD :slight_smile:

One thing to spend some time with is his crouch-cancelled j.rh VC off a counter-hit. Counter-hit someone out of the air with an early attack (say the splash), land, CC jump, activate, repeated CC’d j.rh’s. Does a great amount of damage and the opportunity happens more often than you would think. You can practice against the computer since they jump around fairly aimlessly.


#19

Fighting Dhalsim

Posted by jchensor on 06:01:2001 06:15 AM:

My biggest tip: Kick Lariat hits ALL limbs. If you can time it so you actiate the Lariat RIGHT when Dhalsim sticks the Limbs in you, you’ll hit him cleannly, and you can keep advancing on him.

So purposely get a screen away from Dhalsim. This is your best starting distance. Stay there, and watch if 'Sim throws a Fireball or not. If he does, let it come close, jump over it with Down + Fierce. This will beat or trade with ALL of Dhalsim’s limbs until you land (just make sure you get CLEAR over the fireball, or doing Down + Fierce will cause your legs to hit the fireball behind you). Once Dhalsims learn they can’t poke you out of the air, they’ll try to poke you when you land. That’s a perfect set-up for hitting them with the Kick Lariat (allows for good psychic “DP’s”). Once Dhalsim gets worried to poke when you land, land and just start walking forward or jump again. It’s perfect opening for you to get in close. From there, learn how to jump from a distance so you can land and Jab SPD Dhalsim when you land, but are still too far away for Dhalsim to anti-air you with Back + Strong. Also, from that distance, you can still hit him with Jumping Fierce (not Down + Fierce). So it’s a good distance. Learn it.

The only good trick for 'Sim is that if you jump over a Fireball, 'Sim can nail you with a Jumping Strong, and that’ll beat Down + Fierce. If you know 'Sim is gonna try that, jump with Jab or Short, and it’ll beat all of 'Sim’s Jumping Strongs.

Hope that helps.


#20

Posted by jchensor on 06:04:2001 06:39 AM:

Well, that’s why one of the things I state is getting a screen away on purpose, first. From there, it’s MUCH harder for Dhalsim to kick you out of your jump on it’s way up, 'cause you’re a screen away. Anytime I get to the point where I’m about 3/4 a screen away from Dhalsim (like, he pushed me there with a Crouch Fierce into Fireball that I block), I automatically jump backwards into the corner and wait there for a Fireball. Is he doesn’t throw it, then I begin my approach with a ready trigger finger on the Kick Lariat. But I always try to preface it with a jump from a screen away.

  • James