So SBO is this weekend..... only 2 Boxer's?!

balrog

#1

Wong and Maeda Taison are the only 2 players using Boxer?

No rog love in Asia or to weak?


#2

Wong is probably going to use Rufus anyways.

Maeda Tyson is really really good, saw some great matches by him, far better than aoriju guile (sp?).

In japan rog isn’t as popular as in america…there are far more blanka’s at sbo and this should already tell you something about boxer’s popularity


#3

Actually he qualified with Rog so he has to use Rog.


#4

I just really want to see Mizoteru knock Daigo out :looney:


#5

I hear they removed Boxer from the newest version of the SFIV cabinets. SBO has the last 2 cabinets in Japan that still have Boxer. That’s the only way Justin Wong is able to use Boxer in Japan.


#6

are u sure?
why would they remove boxer from the game?


#7

^the user 10 niJliveD also said this!

I heard this is true.


#8

WHY ARE YOU SO DUMB!? :confused:


#9

aw man why did you spoil it :rofl:


#10

OH NOZ :looney:


#11

Boxer isn’t that good. His specials lose to normals. The japanese learned how to keep balrog out so he can’t do anything anymore.


#12

hahahahahahaha wowww
your pretty stupid.


#13

LOL this must be the best joke in this thread


#14

Nah it’s just the fact that the Japanese have more time to spend with the characters that aren’t used much in the US. Balrog is good but he’s not the best either and that can only be shown in an environment where it makes sense to use characters that require a lot of trial and error and not just stick with safer characters that win matches almost on their normals alone. In Japan Balrog is just another decent character since all the characters are used on a very high level regularly there. He just gets lost in the struggle. In America it’s more rare to see anyone use characters outside of shotos, Sagat or Balrog and place highly or win tourneys so Balrog still stands out here. I would also imagine that because of that our highest level Balrogs are probably better than Japan’s since Americans take him as a character more seriously.

Balrog is an easy character to pick up and play and with a bit of execution practice you can be winning matches just because your normals are better than everyone elses. Balrog only needs his specials to help accommodate his ridiculous normals. Balrog probably would be used less in the US if people had more time to train with the characters that require a lot of trial and error to be good with. Like basically all the new characters minus Rufus, Dhalsim, Akuma and half of the console characters.

The only difficult part about playing Rog is the fact that his play style is kinda linear and he doesn’t have quite the damage potential that Sagat, Rufus, Viper and other characters of similar or higher tier have. Which means against better players Balrog can become predictable (which he will at some point) and Rog’s opponents can definitely make a few more mistakes against Rog than against characters with higher damage output. Meaning as time goes on inevitably there will be less and less reason to fear Rog as a character and only the best of the best Rogs will stand out.


#15

If this is a Joke - Mago himself is a great comedian. This is straight from Japan. I’m not making this stuff up.


#16

Yeah thxyoutoo kinda helped my point. Japanese understand the meta game of Rog so well that he’s forced to used only his most basic of attacks to even get anywhere in a fight anymore. It’s like playing 3S Chun without the 2 low forward supers. A strong normal based character with meh specials. A threat but not necessarily scary anymore. Rogs specials do lose to well timed normals and specials all the time. That half screen EX rush punch stuff only works when you have the opponent flustered or just as a straight up gimmick that doesn’t lead into big damage unless you catch the overhead. EX headbutt can be beat or purposely whiffed by long ranged low hitting moves and people generally know just to sit in crouch block once he’s in headbutt range. EX headbutt is hella unsafe on block and as a wake up unless the opponent seriously mistimes their jump in. I’ts easily safe jumped on due to slow start up and that means it’ll get blocked after a jump in by good players. At best Rog can just hope to fly out of a cross up on wake up and if the opponent catches on to that they can hit him as he’s flying away. TAP is easily baited and punished as well.

Like I said his specials do nothing more but support his normal game and are rather risky when used outside of combos (minus well placed lp rush punch). At high level play Rog has to play super on point to make up for the fact that he is a rather predictable character that other characters can make multiple mistakes against and still hope to win.

His mix up game is nowhere near the level it was in ST and that hurts him big towards being the best character in the game. Low blocking his jabs and teching or neutral jumping out of his throws are two basic things that beat a lot of his offensive gameplan. Then he’s stuck with normals which although very high priority don’t do much damage by themselves and even when comboed into ultra are ridiculously scaled in damage. The only real benefit you get from Rog’s Ultra is instant corner positioning. The problem is fighting characters like Ryu, Sagat, Akuma and Rufus that do more damage and are tough to keep in the corner if they have meter. Doesn’t work in Rog’s favor in the long haul statistically.


#17

well j. wong almost beat daigo using balrog, I don’t think that “the japanese know how to counter him”.

He isn’t in the top 3 of the best characters in the game, but he’s easily a lot better than chun, bison, blanka and even abel, and all those 4 are far more represented at SBO.
Japanese people are kinda “closed” to different cultures (not gonna say they’re racist, but…) that’s why balrog doesn’t see so much play.

He doesn’t have really bad matchups except sagat (and he can still win against him), he’s got above average health and his combos, although not damaging like rufus or akuma’s ones, can still kick some nice 300 damage (no ultra).

Other than that, just because mago said it, it doesn’t have to be the absolute truth.


#18

The Japanese know how to counter Japanese Rogs. That’s almost certain.

If Japanese are closed to certain cultures then that doesn’t explain how 17 years later Rog is still picked pretty heavily in Japanese ST tourneys and is pretty much #2 character in the game to Dhalsim (if you don’t count Old Sagat). He’s just not as fun to play in SFIV and especially not in an environment where becoming very high level with the entire cast (including Vega) is actually feasible. Then on top of having trouble vs. Sagat and arguably Akuma and you just have a character that’s decent until he gets to Japan’s beastly characters. Which in the end Sagat is being played more in Japan than any other character at the highest level and it makes sense why. Rog vs. Sagat is not a fun fight and he takes advantage of all of Rog’s issues. Akuma is probably 2nd most used and then down from there and is another fight that Rog has to work harder than he’d like to win. Akuma never has to deal with most of Rog’s BS and being a more versatile character on top of that makes him a big pick in Japan. Even from there there’s way more variety in characters making top spots in Japan than in the US.

In the end though it’s just a matter of the fact that Balrog isn’t the best character in the game and the Japanese know there are other characters that are more fun and or better to use and are trying to explore them rather than sit on down back and normals with Rog. Maybe in the long run Rog will pick up steam in Japan but when people are an in environment where they know they can explore the whole cast…it just isn’t worth it anymore. Rog just isn’t fun enough for aggressive button pressing Japanese players and the fact that he still loses to Sagat and IMO Akuma keeps him from being picked on the regular in Japan. America picking Rog regularly is just America not really trying to put the effort into learning the other characters and sitting on a character that when played right is relatively safe in most matchups though doesn’t really dominate a lot of matchups either.


#19

Balrog is a simple, stupid character, but he is damn good. I don’t think it’s as simple as keeping him out. He goes even with everyone and loses to Sagat. That has to be respected.
If nothing else, he’s got great normals, great health, and like, what, TEN fucking special moves? Capcom obviously wanted him to be good. They gave him a dash punch for everything.

Anyone who counts out Rog is in for a rude surprise. Even stupid/bad players can do decently well with Balrog. Imagine what Jwong or some Japanese Rog, who are actually considering the best, smartest ways to play the guy are, can do.


#20

Everyone needs to stop basing Balrog’s effectiveness based on their “opinion”. The fact of the matter is he is not as amazing as you guys think. He absolutely does not go even with everyone but Sagat. Check out Mago’s teir list. He put Balrog in the dead center of the cast because nobody in Japan is afraid of him anymore. It is simply that he can’t get in. Stupid/bad players only can do decently well in America because guess what - compared to Japan we are free. In Japan, where the real players are, Balrogs are struggling to compete right now because the character is middle class at best.

How are you people still arguing over how amazing Balrog is when Japanese tournament results tell you otherwise? Are you kids stuck in your own little world and can’t get out?