Some Suggestions for 2012 Sagat

sagat

#1

moves that i think need to have changes and my reasonings behind them. These are merely suggestions and i don’t think we should get them all. but it does address some of my concerns as a sagat player

close st. jab
at 6 frame start up this move is next to useless unless accompanied by cr. short for some sort of frame advantage. while it is +4 on block there is no way of actually landing the damn thing. and in conjunction with cr short +3 on block it will set you at a neutral advantage if you choose to use it. meaning that a 3 frame jab would trade with it. as such, to increase sagat’s options i suggest the following fix.

fix: either give it a faster start up or a lower hitbox to hit more crouching opponents. in order for sagat to have more frame traps.

st. lk
as a zoning character, Sagat relies mostly on his fireballs to keep his opponents out. However, when someone who easily destroys this aspect of sagat such as guy, sagat lacks a reliable poking tool to keep his opponents out. st. lk used to be very powerful in vanilla thanks to its cancelibility. however in super it has become an essential tool for spacing. however, the priority of this move is easily beaten by many other characters. (guy, gen, bison, to name a few)

**fix: **very slight buff to hitbox (moving hurtbox back perhaps), or perhaps extending cancelbility of fireballs. another possibilty is increase 2nd hit dmg by 5 or 10.

st. RH
The notorious leg of the king has destroyed countless foes since vanilla, even after scaling it down in super it was a notoriously powerful AA move. as of right now i believe the hitbox of the tip of the foot is perfect. not too strong but very usable. However the main problem arises when using it close up. it often whiffs on crouching opponents and not just some but perhaps more than 50% of the cast. (cammy, gen, guy, ibuki, etc)

this problem coupled with the fact that this is perhaps one of the only ways of actually cancelling into angry scar makes angry scar and this cancel ability nearly useless. As fellow sagat players, you know the general uselessness of angry scar.

fix: i propose that st. RH as well as close st RH get a hitbox buff in its **CANCEL FRAMES. **meaning the first hit’s hitbox should be lowered slightly to hit more crouching opponents. meaning we can see more interesting sagat combos such as cr short cr short st rh xx as TU. This would also solve in my opinion, the complaint many sagat players have that his damage out put is too low. meaning short short st rh xx TU will be more common. perhaps they can change the damage distribution of st RH to (70-50) to account of the change.

far st. mp
playing for the last 2 years, i have yet to see a good use for this move. with a 10 frame start up and less range than his fierce this move has essentialy remained unused since vanilla.

fix: **BIG FIX **would be just make close st mp his far st mp. this would serve as a great anti air. much like sim’s i know this is would be huge in some ways effectively stopping many rush down characters so this might be too much. I want your guys’ opinion o n this move.

far mk.
The show stopper. a great poke with some limiting uses. I believe that a change to this move would help sagat’s spacing tremendously.

fix: faster start up, better hitbox whichver. maybe lower damage to balance

**Cr. mk

**this could be just my opinion but i feel like it could be 1 frame faster or have a better hitbox.

Disclaimer: I believe these are all issues that could possibly be addressed that would strengthen Sagat’s game tremendously. I believe many of his specials are already very strong and were improved in AE (TU damage and TK buff) so they don’t require any buffs.

HOwever. as the recent 2012 change was to buff AC, i believe that the developers were going in the wrong direction with it. The damage itself does not make it any more appealing to use because quite simply there are no occasions to use it!

I believe that adding 1 or 2 of these suggestions would make Sagat a extremely balanced character. It would not make any of his good matches any worse while making his bad match ups more competitive


#2

Far standing MP is a very useful tool. Also, although i would love his RH more easily hit crouching characters with a tiny hitbox, lets be real. That is the whole advantage of their tiny hitbox. It is a dynamic of the game that some moves and combos are character specific. All of those would be tremendous buffs, but I think it would do more that just balance him out. Sagat is a top character, so “balance” isn’t the issue. I think most people want him to be more fun to play. A standing short that can be canceled from max range might be enough. That was a cool dynamic of Sagat’s game in vanilla. Either that, or make what they replaced it with (angry scar) worth a shit. Right now it is useless. I only use it to burn meter to prevent me from accidentally imputing a super. That is it.


#3

Having seen most of the (potential) balance changes now, Sagat’s pretty much cemented in Top 6 IMO.

I’d be surprised if he got anything else.


#4

Tbh the changes i would have liked to have seen as a sagat player since vanilla who put up with the crap in super for ages. is the following in this order of importance.
1. Standing Light kick:
this poke was so important to sagat in vanilla.Now i agree his tiger knee blockstrings were just too good but they nerfed tiger knee which in my eyes was fair.But what they didnt realise is they left sagat absolutely defenseless in this range.Now yes stand medium kick can be used at this range somewhat however stand medium kick can’t combo unless its on counterhit.not too mention it doesnt push the enemy back at all.at least with slk - tigershot you push them back or start a fadc combo. this is one way that sagat could avoid being cornered. Sagat is a zoning character this normal really hurt him when it got taken away.And i feel he really needs it speaking from experience i’ve gotten to fight some of the best fighters in the world and competed in some the biggest tournaments i’ve put so much effort into this game and thats one thing i know the character needs back. s
2. Ultra 1 glitch in the corner:
Now in regards to this i have figured out how to auto correct ultra so i can get the full damage if i wish.However this pis rather a frustrating thing to deal with as a sagat player who tries to put on an offense or make a comeback. There is two problems with this. The first issue is i dont get full damage unless i auto correct. The second problem is that even when i do auto correct ultra I’m giving up my corner pressure :frowning: why should only sagat have this happen no other character that fadc’s into ultra has this bullshit happen to them. Whats worse then that is I end being cornered which to me is really unfair. I mean most of the time if i get an uppercut whilst an opponents cornered it means they either tried to jump out or i broke their crouch tech i should be rewarded for this not punished. when sagat gets cornered its the worst position he could possibly be in.And this breaks my offense against certain characters i.e fei long perfect example so fei doesnt give a shit if he gets cornered as long as he has a life lead he can just sit there a crouch tech all day with minimal punishment and if i do go for it with auto correct fei long is more then happy to have me in the corner. seriously this problem should have been fixed in super.
3. Tiger shot juggles:
As a zoner and heavily fireball orientated character sagat is fun to fireball with due to kara shots and a few other things such as juggling roundhouse after high tigershot or kara tiger knees. i really miss the normal tshot juggles this was one of the funnest parts of the character. When sagat is shooting i feel its so much fun when he can juggle the shots into normal ones but i feel that maybe he should get not much damage off it maybe make it scale so its more of a meter build or push back/fun factor. this is just me saying its more of a fun thing he used to be able to do.

thats my three wishes in the order i want em lols. the first two are more important though.


#5

I agree that sagat is a strong character, but that doesn’t mean that he doesn’t have bad match ups.

that being said it seems like the overall consensus here is that we need the standing Lk back!