Something that made me think about Gen seriously

gen

#1

I went to a get together of a gaming group known as Shaolin Crew and as usual I played my Gen an though the matches were close I lost most of my matches with Gen, only by luck I picked Fei long and bodied my last opponent (who kicked my Gen ass to the game point round). I wondered if this shows that tier list really is relevant. Its painful that I have spent the last 2 years plus with Gen and still suck but used Fei that I haven’t played in months and I was on fire. WHY IS THIS SOOOO?! WHHHYYYYYYY!!!


#2

That’s so funny that you mention this. Back in Super I was kinda bummed out with the changes to Gen and randomly picked up Fei who was my secondary in Vanilla. All of a sudden I was blowing people up with just the basics. I was thinking, “Whoah, where did that come from?” Of-course I stuck it out with Gen, but about 4 months later, bam! “Fei is top tier”. I thought to myself, “Ah, that’s why I had such a good run.” It was funny because I remember a lot of Fei Long players predicting he would continue to be lower-mid in Super.


#3

Maybe Gen and Fei are polar opposites but man it sucks


#4

Have you seen this image? It always cracks me up. Tiers aside, there’s so much truth to this just in their playstyles.

http://img560.imageshack.us/img560/1659/1320353678822.png


#5

I saw my game improved by a significant margin when I got used to crane walk -> mantis poke.

Believe it or not I see Gen as a high tier. This, however, is assuming that the player is utilizing 100% of Gen’s potential strength, and I believe Gen is the hardest character in this game to achieve this.


#6

How to win with Gen against anyone:

[LIST=1]
[]Learn every single safe jump, even if they’re not really safe, but stuff reversals.
[
]Learn to ultra/super on reversal whiffs, focus charges, and after landing a focus lvl 1 crumple backdash, all on reaction.
[]Throw the shit out of people.
[
]Frametrap when they start mashing throws.
[]c.mp xx hands must be perfect and never missed.
[
]Piss people off by taking 50-70% of their stamina with super >> ultra.
[]Predict jumps and do crane j.HK to ultra.
[
]Be lame and use crane cr.lk off of empty jumps/crossups into super.
[]Poke only against people who never jump and AA perfectly.
[
]Focus dash throw.
[*]Whiff the shit out of LK Gekiro. Be versatile and unpredictable with it. Let it float for a while to counter a late poke.
[/LIST]
There are a few more things, but this alone will make you win tournaments by itself. You don’t even need to land his bnb.


#7

Eh no surprise there… Some characters are just “easy mode” crap as usually call it. I really hate fighting against Blanka for example. This video was recorded a long time ago for the chuckles but this topic reminded me to upload it today. I struggle quite a bit in the Blanka match up (as Gen), then one day I got into troll-mode and decided to troll this guy out with his own character. Let me just mention that I have never used Blanka before this and have absolutely no idea on his strategies… Just by doing random shits and playing scrubby, I actually won.
Here’s the video, for the lawlz (I’m the Green Blanka):
[media=youtube]5WOVFeUX57s[/media]


#8

Or you can just Rekka lol! ok I will try that


#9

I wish Blanka didn’t exist.


#10

Hahahaaaa, dont forget he is in SFxTK


#11

He’s done nothing wrong. Leave the mutant alone.
Besides, Gen can destroy him.


#12

I don’t have any problems beating Blanka’s after I determine what kind of player they are, that’s not the problem. But if there’s a Blanka present in a match there will always be some unfairness in it, whether against Blanka or other character.

It’s just a stupid character design wise. In terms of both playstyle and art. I think the hitbox on his every single move and stance needs an adjustment. His frame data too!


#13

Even decent Juri players rape me like hardcore online.It’s impossibru to play Gen online in some Environment,I sometimes fear to do basic combos because i will drop them online and i will just eat fuckin dp


#14

Again, you’re just repeating yourself. That’s hate born out of lack of knowledge. Everyone hates a character until they learn how to deal with it.
Unless it’s stupid, like Viper or Seth.

Not liking Blanka visually is one thing. Claiming he’s a stupid character design-wise is just the anger talking.
Also, since it’s such a difficult character do deal with online, and he acts so “wild” and looks so ugly, there’s this “cult” around him. A hate cult. Everyone hates him, simply because most people haven’t bothered to practise how to deal with everything he does, or study his framedata and hitboxes. Or even develop OSs against his shenanigans.

Really? Every single move? Stance? Frame data?
Definitely the rage talking.

But instead of letting it go, I’ll follow through with a quick explanation.
[LIST=1]
[]Blanka’s hurtbox is as fine as half the cast. From the point where he can be hit by Sako combo (which only a very small “elite” group of characters can), it means his hurtbox is just fine.
[
]The whole drama about him being non-hittable by Ryu’s Far HK at a certain range was absolutely idiotic (as shown in a video on youtube), since no one is gonna attempt that shit at that range, and Blanka needs to be neutral. No blanka is neutral for no reason just for the sake of “making moves whiff on him”.
[]Blanka’s hurtbox is as good, if not better, than Sakura’s. Or Rose. Or Juri. Or Honda. Honda is actually the character with the worst hurtbox in the game. BnBs miss against a vast portion of the cast, and Blanka is simply no exception. Whining about his hurtbox (a very common misconception: that his hurtbox is “unique” in that regard) is pure non-sense.
[
]What’s wrong with his moves? What needs to be adjusted?
[/LIST]
I’ll now list the most common things people whine about when referring to blanka:
[LIST=1]
[]His slide. Blanka has no decent overhead that catches you quick from very far. There’s no reason why you shouldn’t be careful with blocking low. Don’t try to focus it. You’re bound to get hit by a ball (either random, or not, depending on how good the Blanka player is). It’s punishable on block, so stay at midrange where the slide is unsafe.
[
]His balls are hard to punish. No they’re not, not even the jab version. Particularly with Gen, who can Super/Ultra every single one of them, some even on hit.
[]His balls are armor breaking. Stop using focus.
[
]His vertical ball is broken. Only the EX version has invincibility, so he needs bar. Also, it’s punishable even on hit if you get them close to the corner (which is ridiculously easy if you have decent footsies and know your spacing/zoning game). His normal vertical balls are as good as several other anti-airs in regards to stopping you. Except the trade off for being horribly punishable is that they can hit you when you’re neutral jumping from far away (in comparison to, say, Sakura’s cr.HP)
[]You can’t jump in on Blanka. If you’re referring to anything outside of a safe jump: shame on you for being a predictable jumping scrub. Learn to read when they got charge or not. If they move forward, you can pretty much try a jump-in in that precise instance. If it’s on wakeup, practise safejumps in training mode, and learn the simple fact that without EX meter, he’s as free as free can be. A simple crossup with always rape him.
[
]His electricity has a stupid hitbox. Focus backdash or light super if you’re too close. If not, c.mp/mk, or even sweep. Don’t forget to cancel into ultra. Also, crane c.lk tends to work. Depends on the version he used. Training mode. One more thing: electricity has a weakspot on the back too. Which is why it’s so easily beatable by crossups.
[]Hops are stupid and random. No they’re not. They’re punishable by full combos, and if they do it as okizeme, it’s easier to deal with than EX Yoga Fire > Teleport shenanigans (and Seth stuff as well). Much easier to see. It has a shit ton of frames, so look where they’re gonna land. The hop always has the same distance. There’s only one hop forward. Also, hop> vertical ball is not a hard setup to deal with. Vertical ball is as punishable as punishable can be. That’s a shitty gimmick overall, and it works because people don’t know how to do late crouch techs after a hop.
[
]**His EX rainbow is retarded in so many ways. **This deserves it’s own breakdown
[/LIST]
[LIST]
[]If it’s not a reversal, you can simply focus forward dash (never release the focus), and you’re safe, while they just spent meter. Don’t try to punish, it’s risky. It’ll work against idiots, but not 50% of the time if they land as a crossup.
[
]If it’s a reversal, then you’re supposed to be ready for it and do an OS on his wakeup. Something as simple as s.mp on his wakeup will beat it. If not, c.lk+lp > s.mp does.
[/LIST]
Overall, Blanka’s helpless in the corner. Learn to pressure blanka. He has some decent pokes, but none are great in terms of frame advantage. Don’t rage and start jumping like an idiot. Don’t focus unless it’s pretty obvious they wanna do pokes (every poke is pretty much punishable with a focus lvl1, at least, so do FA1 backdash, and be ready to input ultra if it crumpled them). He has no amazing frametraps and no easymode OSs to punish backdashes. I punish backdashes with blanka by prediction only. If I’m wrong, I can get punished. If he has a tendency to do electricity and then press a normal (cr.fierce or sweep are the most common), then be prepared to focus. His strings with c.lk upclose have to be absolutely perfect, otherwise they’re stuffed by a simple throw, or jab. Do not mash EX gekiro against blanka. It’ll whiff very often against characters with great crouching hurtbox, likes twins’ c.lk.


#15

wow, nice info. but when did my poor cry thread turn to blanka pub zone lol!


#16

I’m sure some ppl will always feel unfair when they get hit by a cross-up Oga -> Super -> Ultra. We’re not the ones to complain about others.


#17

I have come to one truth and conclusion, Gen is not the best character in the game, his health is shitty, his stun is hilarious and instead of spinning when falling he floats down because of his weak state, yes this all is true, he may have his shenanigans and huge risky maneuvers and may have ridiculous damage on super and ultra but still he is not known.

All that matters now is not Amiyu, not Yeb, not Xian and not all the geat Gen players out there, all that matters is my style of playing Gen, my signature style. I may not win any tournament, fuck I may never win EVO but by God I am going to have fun with Gen, am gonna style on my opponents to the best of my ability, am gonna wreak havoc in their minds and make them not forget the day the came across the man who no longer fears death. And no matter how many times I get bodied, I will not stay down, no matte how many hate mails I get I will not back up.

that is what I have decided. and though Fei is still better for me to use, Gen and I have a bond, the underdogs, and together we will prove them wrong. Thanks everyone here, I appreciate you guys.


#18

Yeah man! I totally agree with your philosophy!


#19

Wow thanks for the long reply. I was expecting to be treated like a whining brat but it was my mistake not stating clearly the problems I have with Blanka. Again, I’m not talking about getting helplessly beaten due to jumping recklessly or anything like that in fact I mostly play endless with my friends none of which mains Blanka so none of my statements are results of rage. My main concerns are the unfairness of Blanka matches and how easy to use him. So let me go through your points:

  1. His Slide: It has good startup, range and crazy good hitbox. It’s also hard to punish when used correctly, since it has many active frames.

  2. His balls are hard to punish: They are not yeah, especially with my mains, Gen and Seth (also thousand kick and stretch punch) but most of the cast cannot punish them, I think that’s ridiculous. Gen can punish it for 400 damage but Sakura have to take it? Unfair. Also, about forward ball, it doesn’t have a “solid” hitbox (not sure what pathing boxes are called) so let’s say your reaction ultra will pass through Blanka instead of beating it unless you do it very early, which requires guessing. His balls should have more recovery on ground. Also I’m not okay how Blanka is restricted to use forward ball, even for punishing shoryukens etc. when the opponent has super/ultra (depending on character)

It should land close and have more recovery on ground instead of air, and should be completely safe on hit.

  1. No problem here.

  2. Vertical ball covers so much space it’s not even funny and due to It’s arc it will allow Blanka to dodge from specials that it cannot beat. you don’t have to time it when anti airing against crossups either. Both are points towards Blanka being a character that doesn’t require thinking and practice.

  3. Well you can’t jump in on anybody, anyway. Yet, Blanka (Yes, electricity) and Zangief has easier time anti airing compared to rest of the cast.

  4. Electricity. It’s hitbox is huge, and it hits in every direction. That’s just wrong in my opinion, people should be thinking what move to use for what situation. For instance in a air to air clash while using Gen you have to consider opponents height and the time you have to start an attack depending on where you’ll trade hits. But with Vega you can just hit HP or HK. I hate cover-every-situation moves. Another thing is that it has huge block hit box, that prevent you from adjusting your range for a poke that beats it. But when you backdash and move forward it’s already too late.

No problems with the rest.

Blanka requires no practice, and anyone can pick him up and play, as shown in the video above. Anyone can pick up Sagat and play with him too, but he will be really bad compared to a decent Sagat because a decent Sagat needs to know how and when to kara Tiger and be able to do cr.lk strings etc. But in case of Blanka a new Blanka player is pretty much at the same level as a decent Blanka player. Since it doesn’t require any lab work. You will also have high BP Blankas online that have really low BPs with other characters they play with. He requires almost no thinking. I have no idea what Blanka’s gameplan is, hold down back and throw a ball when it’s appropriate? Hop and throw? No Blanka’s do anything smart online, they don’t even hit confirm. Then why do I have to do option select to play decent against such a character? I think I should stop here since I tend to repeat stuff I already said… Bad character design overall. Not to mention his looks and voice.

Note that most of these are opinions so you don’t have to accuse me for not practicing. My opinions are formed by practice mostly.


#20

None of the reasons you gave are true. Which is amazing to say the least.

a) His slide is only safe at maximum range. Any other range and it’s punishable. As I mentioned: you’re supposed to be at medium range against blanka. If you’re far away, it’s your fault for getting hit. Learn spacing. You’re going to read this a lot.

b) Sakura can punish balls. Actually, almost every single character in the game can punish the balls. I can’t really recall one who can’t. If you had read each characters’ thread like I have, you’d know. Watch Uryo vs Taku, and see how Taku gets punished for using balls. Again, this is pure ignorance on your part.

c) Vertical ball is highly punishable and requires timing to be used. If used too early against crossups, it’ll go below the character and to the other side, whiffing and being punishable by any fullscreen move, whilst spending a meter. Once more, lack of knowledge. Also, it’s increadibly difficult to time against certain crossups because of something called execution delay. Which in blanka’s case is the real delay where your fingers move from a blocking position (crouched) to the upwards position + KK button. That small period, even if just equivalent to 1frame, is enough to mistime something as simple as an EX vert ball. Again, watch proper blankas and you’ll see the only time they hit EX vertical balls is against people who fail safe jumps, or jump carelessly.

d) Jab electricity is the only electricity which can come out fast enough (more than 5f, since you have to be whiffing jabs or piano from a jab) for it to anti-air. Even then, it has 4f gaps in between each hit. No one uses jab elec as an anti-air when vertical ball is 100x more useful. And if you’re getting hit by vertical ball, you’re jumping when you shouldn’t. Same rule applies to getting hit by “anti-air” elec. That’s just being a complete scrub.

e) Seriously? I just said it has a gap on the back and you come out and say it hits in every direction? “That’s just wrong in my opinion”? Dude, it’s just wrong in my opinion for you to be writing gibberish. Not even Claw can use HK in every situation. You’re literally whining like a scrub now. You’re spouting things based on complete lack of knowledge. That’s what people do when they’ve never even bored to record shit in training mode and test timings.

Blanka requires no practice?

Instead of just having me go on a rage and start insulting you in the worst manner (which is honestly what I feel like doing), I’ll tell you this:

RECORD DUMMY.
TEST SHIT. PRACTICE.

Stop whining about things just for the sake of whining because you believe they’re true. Otherwise, if you have a PS3 and live in europe, then play a ft20 with me where you use blanka and I’ll use whatever other character you want. A random one. And we’ll see how far you go.
No decent player will lose against a scrub blanka. Not a single one. Every single scrub blanka is just that, a scrub. Even I, with my very average blanka have been raped by people who are pretty average themselves, because they know full well how limited the character is in terms of defensive options. Like Rufus. Except Rufus can use 3 bars to cancel into ultra, and even his main reversal either recovers too fast on whiff, or has a variety of enders (where two of them are safe but punishable between hits, and the other is -18, but not punishable between hits (as far as I can recall)).

Please, refrain from typing shit about Blanka again. I might as well call Veserius to come over here and post his own reply. Even I who don’t main Blanka feel insulted by this sort of shit. Blatant lack of knowledge.