Yes I agree. Although using C LP does have its place.
Neat trick: Guile can corpse hop a downed opponent with bazooka knee (only seems to work on female characters). This is especially useful for a corner escape via cr.rh fadc, knee.
i find seth to be quite annoying, though i can handle most of his pressure, sometimes when he’s in, i think it’s pretty hard for guile to find a way out.
any suggestions to deal with this?
seth can rape guile if he gets a knockdown, but guile can zone seth pretty well.
to get out of pressure you have to guess right, usually multiple times.
you want to play safe, and smart, guile anti airs seth pretty easily. backhand and s.fp are a nightmare for seth. guile’s boom is much better than seth’s too, play the fireball game at a range where you can jump in and seth will get uncomfortable. don’t be afraid to slowly push seth towards the corner with bazooka knee and boom. be ready for wall jumps! air throw does a crap load to seth
I, posted this a while ago on a thread and Nobody was able to back it up. Good thing to know that it works, I did it vs sakura. Post #129 on guile moves and attributes thread.
btw, I just did it on guy and it works on him, does that make him gay?
i would just like to say congratulations to dieminion for making last 32 at seasons beatings. he’s been really solid so far. hopefully he will avoid/beat arturo for once though lol. personally i would’ve put him on the u.s.a team instead of p.r balrog. but oh well. i wonder why sandford didn’t play? wasn’t he supposed to?
one thing i never really understand is that if guile is so overpowered, so godlike as some of these top players keep saying; how comes he’s not getting repped like a top tier character? how come daigo (who’s seems to be struggling with ryu recently by his standards) dropped him entirely…months ago? how come dieminion is like the only guile at the whole tournament? how come there are like only 3-4 major guile players in the socal region too?
i do think the overpowered debate is kinda half myth, half truth, like “oh fuck…guile’s so annoying to play against and he’s good now. lets whine as much as possible and hope he gets nerfed for the arcade release”. i mean it’s absolutely nowhere near sf4 sagat levels. his improvements just stand out because he was so ass in vanilla. there was a certain level guile could get to in tournament play…but no higher. now he’s a viable option. i do think the o.p talk originally stemmed from the masses of crying shoto players who are were used to beating guile and are now getting beat consistently. if guile is o.p, who should guile lose to that he currently beats?
why isn’t the same being said about dhalsim? he only loses to pretty much the exact same players as guile does. he’s just as annoying/boring to play against. going by the latest tier list, dhalsim is 9 points lower than guile. having said that, this list is pretty dubious if you ask me. since when did dhalsim lose 6-4 to vega? and since when did guile beat rose and cammy 6-4? ect. there’s quite a few scores on there that raise eyebrows.
it’s because dhalsim takes skill and guile doesn’t? bullshit. guile takes skill (probably one of the main reasons tournament tier whores haven’t run to him). maybe not as much as dhalsim. but i still think that’s a totally unfair argument. this comparison has nothing to do with dhalsim being guile’s worst match by the way. it’s just a comparison and nothing more. i have total respect for all good dhalsim players like arturo, henry cen, champ ect.
i’m not denying that guile is a tier, he almost definitely is. but overpowered is going too far. also, just because he’s high tier doesn’t automatically mean he needs to be nerfed either. look at balrog. give ryu back some of his damage or something.
imo the only character that i think is near o.p is e.honda, and that’s only because i think some of his really simple stuff just does way too much damage. even he isn’t THAT bad (especially if you’re using a good zoning character). hakan could’ve done with some of that honda damage.
Why Guile is the Least Played High Tier Long Range Zoning Character (By PeteTheBohemian):
No mobility. Rose has some of the best dashes in the game. Sim has teleport. Guile just has a slightly above average walk speed.
High level Guile play consists of strong footsies, intimate knowledge of all his anti-airs, great spacing, an iron will, and extreme patience (on top of match up knowledge of course), all of which are hard to achieve, not flashy at all, and yields nothing but hate from most of the audience.
The same could be said for Rose and Sim with #2, but there are a couple of things that set them apart. Sim and Guile are both great at keeping people out, but Sim’s normals make him a threat from 3/4 of a screen away. At 3/4 of a screen away, Sim can both keep his opponent out AND deal damage, while Guile can only keep 'em out. Rose on the other hand has dash punches, reflect / absorb, and is one of the fastest, if not the fastest meter builders in the game, so she can go on a decent offensive when she needs to. Also, both Sim and Rose have some of the most versatile and interesting Ultras in the game (Rose’s orbs, Sim’s Yoga Catastrophe).
Average damage and little comeback potential.
I think in Vanilla, the major reason why he wasn’t popular was that he didn’t have 50/50s, e.g SRK FADC forwards, SRK/throw/combo into big damage. He doesn’t really have a lot of mixups like other characters. His mixups are most AA mixups. And you have to put in your time to really learn him well to be competitive, compared to Sagat or Ryu, which can be 80% learned in a few days if you’re a fast learner. With Guile, charge buffering booms already requires you to spend more than that amount of time to do it well.
Guile may seem like a simple character to use, with his straightforward and practical normals and his 2 specials. However, to play him well, you have to be really familiar with him and his learning curve is really steep even though he looks like the most simple character. I think that’s what makes him dangerous though.
IMO, his learning curve and inability to dish out huge damage in a combo is what deters most people from using him. And it’s also his learning curve that a lot of players who pick him up would give up halfway while learning him. To be really good with Guile, you have to be really familiar with all his little intricacies, like poke/AA distancing, boom hit/block stun and all that. You have to have a lot of experience playing him in order to play him well, which is quite different to the most of the cast.
Indeed, good job to dieminion. Watching that round vs c.viper where he pulled the fadc on a sismo to SH was worth watching 10+ hours of stream. All my friends on msn reacted with WTF at the same time I was typing something similar.
I enjoyed this tournment a lot more than last EVO.
Really fun tournament, I just wish there were more Guiles. Dieminion and Jazz were the only ones that I saw.
My guess as to why Guile isn’t chosen much despite being “high tier”: no advancing attack special. Every character in the game has one except him. That, and comparatively unreliable links that can get mashed through fairly easy. Also, no “safe on block” moves that most other characters have.
Side note: has anyone ever given a good reason why link difficulty was messed with from character to character? Why make something like Bison’s c.lk>scissor kick combo idiot proof then turn around and make Guile’s c.lp>c.mp>fk link something that even high level players drop often? I miss the days back in Alpha when combo execution was more or less even across the board…
Shorten and Simple Guile : A+ Defense grade C- Offense unlike Honda grade A defense A+ Offense, or Ryu A Offense Grade B defense. His offense is lacking compared to others hence he wins by being defensive but once he is broken down he is hard to recuperate at times.
I vote for the fact that his cr.lp > cr.mp link is one frame. Can you imagine guile’s bnb jab jab mp hk fk being brain dead easy to land with plinking? I’m not saying its super hard now and 1 frame is only 1 frame but there is an execution barrier you have to get past if you want to have any comback potential with Guile. You’d see ryu and seth players coming over in droves.
Although I’m very scrubbish and have yet to implement Guile’s c.lp > c.mp link in actual matches it represents a very big milestone between low level Guile play and high level Guile play, and I am glad for this because it is a challenge that I can work towards. Competitive high level fighting games are not meant to be easy or else we’d all be as good as some of the best players in the world, I’m sick to death of people complaining about mechanics that are working perfectly. The game and characters have learning curves:
LEARN THE BLOODY GAME
Rile Guile and you’ll go out in style!
Sooo… basically, the preference is that Guile have more difficult links so that he remains unpopular and you guys can keep feeling cool about using him?
If that’s the case, then why even ask why he’s not repped in tournaments more often? Answer: Guile users don’t want him to be made as competitive on an execution level as other characters because they want to keep their street (fighter) cred…
It’s not any of that. It’s just, you either like Guile or you don’t. Does anybody seriously decide on a character based on link timing? Everybody plays who they want to, for whatever reason. My guess is playing as Guile isn’t as fun for most people, or else maybe they’d just rather play another high tier character who has more dimensions.
I prefer my character’s based on straightforward simplicity like a knife (it’s sharp and does exactly what it looks like its supposed to. It cuts).
Why do ppl who don’t main guile always have the smart-ozz comments to make? Is it because you guys get beat by guile you just have to express your hatred by posting here?
This quote is hilarious in context. So basically your saying everyone’s previous comments and opinions are wrong then you go on to say that everyone plays guile for their own reasons. lol.