ST Throws v. IV Throws


#1

Could you guys explain some of the differences between timing of throws in ST and IV? My throw landing and teching I way better in IV than ST, any obvious reasons why this might be?

And btw, how do I avoid/escape throw loops in ST?


#2

There is no specific timing for a throw in ST, just get in range and toss them with f or b+hp or mp… they come out in zero frames(think Zangiefs spd), as for getting out of throw loops, you can either go for a reversal(window for a reversal is quite small, use piano method) or go for a reversal throw of your own(mash out a throw), at least if you go for the second option you will most likely get a throw tech animation(you still take a bit of damage even if you tech it) or your opponent will get thrown.

However if your opponent does not repeat the throw loop and goes for a normal crouching move(if you went for the second option), you will lose out because you cant throw while crouching and you cant tech throw a throw while crouching… lots of mind games lol…

Maybe someone else can give a better answer but this is as much as I know.


#3
  • ST throws come out instantly (0 frames, not counting the frame on which you input the move); SF4 throws come out in 3 frames (2 frames startup, ‘hit’ on the 3rd).
  • SF4 throws can be ‘teched’ to avoid all damage and be placed at neutral frames, ST throws can only be ‘softened’ for half damage and the softener placed at negative frames.
  • SF4 throws can be teched crouching; you must stand up to soften ST throws.
  • SF4 throws have a 7 frame tech window; ST throws have a 13 frame soften window.
  • In SF4 you have 1 (I think?) frame of throw invincibility on wakeup; in ST you have 13 frames on throw invincibility on wakeup (which you lose if you’re put into a non-neutral state within that time).
  • In SF4, you cannot be thrown out of jump startup; in ST you can be thrown out of jump startup, meaning you can’t jump out of a perfectly-timed tick throw.
  • In SF4 you can’t tech if you’re thrown out of a non-neutral state; in ST you can ALWAYS soften a throw, unless that throw would kill you.
  • In ST any of the following buttons: Strong, Fierce, Forward, Roundhouse, can be used to soften a throw even if your character does not have throws with some of those buttons.

Generally the best/easiest way to deal with tick throws in ST is to reversal throw by pianoing at least 2 throws (I use Strong~Fierce if it’s available) or double tapping if your character only has one throw button. I usually try to time the initial reversal then just keep mashing for the next half second to at least get the soften if I missed the reversal. Only problem is when your opponent has bigger throw range than you and does tick strings that put them out of your throw range but within theirs. In such cases your only option is reversal. If you don’t have a reversal… well, you should be trying your hardest to not get put in those situations in the first place.


#4

I hate ST throws, I love the new system.

But, that’s just me.


#5

Thanks for your contribution


#6

The “new” system is 12 years old (two-button throws/tech were in Alpha 3)


#7

a3 didnt have no-damage, no-disadvantage techs and i think you had to stand up to do it. the sf4 system is basically the same as 3s so you’re off by a year


#8

The 3rd Strike system is basically a half-assed version of 3D fighters, so you’re off by who gives a damn.

Pretty sure there’s no throw invulnerability at all after knockdown in SFIV, since you can just tech or hold up. Throwing people into a corner can actually put the thrower at massive frame disadvantage if it gets teched in ST in some cases. Chun Li absolutely should not throw people into the corner unless it KOs unless she likes eating absolutely anything for free in retaliation.


#9

speaking of throws: in st, if both players initiate the throw on the same frame, it’s random for whoever gets it. Is it the same thing for a2?

Oh, and to stay on topic, St also has multi hit throws called grabs that can be mashed for extra damage, and leads into a mixup.


#10

It would be. There’s no other way to handle it.


#11

Wow, awesome posts guys, and I’m glad other people might be getting something out of this thread.

One area I’m having trouble with is online I’ve played Kens who throw out random supers; I then walk in and go for the throw, but they get it. Is this just down to lag or randomness?


#12

Super has really quick recovery time, try not to wait until ken hits the ground to punish or you will get fucked up… also why do weak players run to ken or akuma(broken)?


#13

Both look cool.

With the recovery time, that’s what I thought. In ST can I throw them as they recover from a move when they haven’t actually touched the ground?


#14

Just sweep them instead if you want a knockdown. They can still soften anyways.


#15

…you’re right, this is just a habit from SFIV now that I think about it.


#16

just so people know you can tech throws crouching in st also (and every other sf game)


#17

I meant it as SF2 being old and SF4 being new for ease of conversation.

Clearly it only sparked more rage and made the conversation no easier.


#18

i couldve sworn i’d done this previously and i was assured it wasnt possible. after testing you’re right though.