Super Street Fighter II Turbo, in the house


Somebody help me out with beating E. Honda? I use Guile, and Balrog(claw).

What are my best Jump-in options with Guile and Balrog(if that is the thing to do)?

Should I turtle? cause with Guile, I normally play aggressive, I just don’t normally understand this match-up. I’m normallly real good with pressure and flash kick traps and such, but it just seems like a tough match-up for me, seeing as I don’t know many people who play with Honda, and it seems like a 50/50 match-up to I constantly get caught up in the bacbreaker grab into thousand hand slap in the corner. I know he shouldn’t even get that close, but he does psychic headbutts and he makes me whiff flashkicks by doing the lp version of the move. I use the Champion edition version of Guile or the turbo version. Sometimes the ST version.

It seems like an easier match-up for Balrog, considering his pokes and air game, but lately he’s been improving on it. He’s learning not to jump-in as much, and he’s playing alot safer, more turtleing, and stuff like that

Any input?



Guile owns up Honda pretty bad. Just turtle your ass off and meet him with RH or Fierce in the air when he jumps or butt slams over your booms(he will jump because he has no choice). There isn’t much else to be said except don’t come to him. There is absolutely no reason to go on the offense against honda with most characters, period. You should control the whole match, just don’t let him get in because Honda is a fucking tank when he gets close.

I honestly think Honda has an easier time against Balrog.


SaBrE - thanks for the kind words. Too bad we didn’t get to play. :sad: Next time, eh. :tup:

This is not true. I tested it, and Deejay can not duck Boxer’s st.Fierce in the PSX version, just like he can’t in the arcade version.

Whether or not it exists, I dunno, but I’ve never heard of that before.

Anytime you do point-blank scissor kicks, the opponent gets a free throw on you. The only time you get to throw them is if they mess up. You can do it safely (so that you can’t be thrown) by doing it from max range, and the Short version works best.

The only anti-Chun trick with Sim that I know of is the one Cole mentioned (cross-up Forward slide after noogie). O.Sim can’t do it because the slide is counted as a far move, and because you can’t control O.Sim’s normals, he automatically does the close cr.Forward (N.Sim’s D/B+Forward kick). I really see absolutely no reason to ever play O.Sim, because as far as I know, he has no advantages over N.Sim, only disadvantages.

This may not be the answer you want to hear, but to beat Honda, you just have to turtle that ass. Guile is tailor made to beat Honda…that’s probably one of Honda’s worst fights (if not the worst). Honda has no effective way to get around Guile’s Sonic Booms without being countered. All Honda’s jump-ins and butt slams will lose cleanly to Guile’s j.RH.

With Guile, you should never put forth any offense at all against Honda. Claw actually has a hard time with Honda because Honda can out-turtle you by a lot. Honestly, I don’t even know how Claw is supposed to win that match, other than wall dive shenanigans. If you can’t get that started, you pretty much lose.

You can Flash Kick the hands, but if he sees that coming and fakes, then you will be giving him another throw if you whiff the Flash Kick.

Just use cr.Jab to beat his headbutts. That way you can keep your charge, and you don’t take any risks. (Note: not sure if this works for CE/HF Guile, but it works for ST Guile.)



Does anyone want to write an easy mode ST Dhalsim guide for me? I want to pick him up but I haven’t found much basic info on him. Just the basics would be great, thanks in advance.


I can’t wait for the DVD to come out. I been trying to get my buds into ST for a long time now, and there’s just no excuse since PS2 version is out now. Thanks for all the cool threads and info, NKI and A-Dhalsim!


I apologize if this has been handled before but I gotta ask: What are the differences between “arcade perfect” and SF:AE for the PS2?


the most noticeable differences between AE ST only and arcade ST, is the fact that ST new characters cannot tech ST old characters in AE, yet they can in regular ST. which is sillyy, teching throws is an st feature, they should be able to tech all characters. the other major difference is o.sagat got nerfed big time. tiger shots are very, ver slow. im sure theres little things here and there, but im not as hardcore into all the changes since i rarely see an st board these days, except now since cigarbob got one that i can play on all the time now…


I thought the “hold start when selecting game version” gave you arcade perfect settings, including the stored ochio, stored claw flip, stored chun super, and un-nerfed O.Sagat. Does anyone know of any differences between the ‘start selected’ Hyper characters and authentic Super Turbo characters?


If you were wondering, my name is Bryce or ‘smilie’, I play at gunthers a lot when I can, just ask Josh, he knows me, he can tell you about me.


Nope. You can pick SSF2 and SSF2 Turbo characters with the glitches but the some characters are still nerfed and hit boxes for many characters are fubar.


i havnt played ae for a while, i got it on xbox and i think you need to hold select (back) on super mode to get old characters,
so would this mean you have to press start + select to get an arcade perfect o.sagat, and do you hear a sound or chime if it worked?


let me break this down

in ST, st old characters are hardly similar to ssf2 characters. that is a major misconception with people. st old characters are NOT like ssf2 characters. a basic example (not talking ae here only arcade st and ssf2) is fei long, in ssf2, only normals he can buffer are close s.fierce, jabs, shorts, and up close strong i believe. in ST, when you pick old fei, almost every normal he has, buffers. c.forward, c.strong, s.fierce far, etc. pretty large difference between st old and ssf2 characters.

so back to AE. when you pick super mode, you are getting the legitimate ssf2 version of that character. when you hold mode or start (depending on if you use xbox or ps2) when selecting super, you will get the ST old characters, hence the different icon during the fight.

this is a big confusion that most people have.

when you legitimately pick old sagat, hes been fucking nerfed to death. hes so slow. in ae, for the most part, they made old sagat basically the same as ssf2 sagat from what it feels like. if you want a sagat thats effective as hell, you have to pick hf sagat or ce sagat. and that shit aint gonna cut it if someone wants to use AE as an st only version, since hf/ce sagat will carry over the retarded dizzy properties.

hope this clears up a lot of confusion


oh so you cant get an arcade perfect o.sagat on AE?



[“he got nerfed”]xN



Can’t we just end the whole HSF2 AE-ST arcade perfect argument by saying that AE is not ST and is just supposed to be its own crazy game?

P.S. Anybody got any good crossups with Claw? :smiley:


agreed. ae is just its own game.

anyway, back on topic. vega dive = crossup of ownage. other than that, not really


Ok, that’s what I figured anyway, the wall dive shenanigans are more than enough.


How much do you think using the psx version affected the outcome of evo this year? And do you think that it would have been the same with the DC version?

Also, were these differences a surprise to the players? It has been announced for some time that the psx version was the one to be used, right?

Just curious.


i guaruntee the outcome woulda been drastically different if it was arcade. seeing cole as the only og st player in final 8 is beyond weird. watson, choi getting eliminated rather early is really funky. that NEVER happens. choi’s sagat was not on par at all, watch him on arcade later that day and super choi came back full force, owning everyone up in the 3on3 tourney except gian. all his uppercuts were coming out and he was feeling the tiger speeds. on ps1, he clearly was not. watson was frustrated with bisons psycho crusher not going full screen like it should and various other things. kuni was also outraged with ps1 and how it recognizes pp for ppp attacks. so he got a lot of lariats when he wanted spd’s. its really frustrating for the players.

when things dont work the way you are used to having it work, it gets really frustrating and discouraging. especially when you been playing on the arcade version almost exclusively for 11 years.

also, not taking away from players like nki and dsp. they are very strong players, who can manage top 8 anyways. but i think even buk was suprised at how high he ranked i would think. even tho he was playing well regardless.

hell, dc is a shit version too. i think the outcome woulda been different, but still not in a good way. when changing to dc, a whole other slew of problems arise. the biggest problem is sprite sizes are way too small. so that means more empty space on the screen which dramatically changes zoning tactics. plus some combos dont work right with the smaller sprites as well.

its just a no win situation. but its a process that needs to be adapted to since thats where the whole scene is headed, to shitty console


The fact that players complained about “differences” that ended up NOT being different makes me think the versions didn’t affect much at all, or they did but not in the way people think.

Not to pick on people, but if someone is saying “WTF, in the arcade you can’t duck that!” or “OMG, in the arcade this does way more damage!” and that turns out to be bogus, it doesn’t seem to me they are all that detail-oriented to begin with. If they can’t tell the difference and can only spot bogus differences, it’s hard to believe it had much effect.

We aren’t talking like A3 PSX or A2 Gold vs. Normal where there are pretty immediately obvious, game-changing differences.