Super Turbo DeeJay Question


#1

There’s no thread for this guy that I can find, and I have a question about him.

Does this guy have a dependable anti-air move? I’ve tried s. fierce, c. fierce, s. rh, s. strong, his jackknife maximum, and the machine gun upper. The s. fierce and s. rh traded hits most of the time and the jackknife was outprioritized most of the time. I played against a Ryu and everything I tried was put down by Ryu’s j. rh. It seemed like all I could do was block or try to get out of the way.


#2

i dont play dj so i dont know what its called, or what his normal anti airs are like, but he does have a flash kick… that should work.
And dj can move forward with the slide and keep his flash kick charge, unlike Guile.


#3

Like Brian said, his charge down then up with kick move will be plenty to blast the opponent out of the air. In fact that attack also takes advantage of the volleyball effect in that game, so you can do it twice in a row to get like 4 hits if I’m remembering correctly.

Also that slide kick, c. rh, is good. Not sure if it’ll be Ryu’s jump kick but try it.


#4

Yeah, that’s the jackknife maximum thing. I looked that name up on gamefaqs, maybe it’s not what it’s really called. Anyway, I tried it against Ryu and it was snuffed every time. Maybe I have to time it just right so that one of his kicks directly kicks Ryu? I don’t know.

And yeah, I knew it could get a mini juggle. You can actually get five hits out of it with a couple different combos.

I’m only starting to play with DeeJay so I don’t much know how to use him yet, but it seems as though he gets outprioritized a lot. I’ve played a Cammy, Ryu, Chun Li, and Hawk, and all of them regularly outprioritized my DeeJay’s moves. Maybe you just have to time them a lot more than other characters’ moves? For instance I’ve noticed that instead of throwing out a s. fierce an an anti-air just before the enemy lands, you have to throw it out pretty early so it gets to its full extension.


#5

Either Ryu has INSANE timing on the j.rh… or you’re timing your anti-airs wrong? I don’t know how he’s beating the upkick. I think the short one has some invincibility?? Either way, it should take care of upclose jump-ins… Make sure to do them deep. As soon as you hit the button BANG! it should hit him.

He has a lot of normal anti-airs, but they all have to be used in different situations. s.RH/slide from far out, early s.strong upclose/underneath, close s.rh when they’re right on top of you, etc. And then there’s the high-low stuff like with Guile. You force them to attack high because of your fully extended normals, so you then go low with d.forward/slide

You almost always want full extension on normal anti-airs…


#6

This really shouldn’t happen to you when you’re playing DeeJay. I can see if you’re getting hit by cr.fwds or something equally fast, but you shouldn’t get ourprioritized. Throw out some sitting strongs if you’re just outside of range or anticipate pokes. D+fierce outprioritizes Hawk’s dive, Blanka ball, all Honda flying sumo, and it’ll aa much like s.strong if the opponent is almost vertical with you. You’re right on about the full extension part.


#7

I have a question: Is it me or is it just about impossible for DJ to escape repeated slide-noogie ticks? It’s like if DHali gets him with one slide-noogie he has almost no chance to get out. I think if sim’s using short slide-noogie the upkick would most likely fly over sim and DJ gets noogied again. MGU can’t reverse because it has no invulnerability (i think it hits mid and not really low also). Dread kick might work, but i think the startup time is too slow and dj just gets grabbed anyway.


#8

I’m a deejay veteran, and I will make a claim which I’m sure will be ridiculed: I claim that OLD DeeJay is stronger than the new one! Most people think that DeeJay was the most ‘improved’ character in ST, and most people think that DeeJay sucked in SSF2… wrong.

Old deejay has the following huge advantages:

  1. Short dread kick has low invincibility, allowing for unbeatable close poking & corner traps (psychic dp is the only escape). It pops right over Ryu’s low sweep (or anyone’s low kicks).
  2. MGU has invincibility frames which finally allows Deejay to wake up counter anything, and pass through fireballs to escape corner traps, and escape certain cheap patterns. Although the MGU as an anti air does virtually zero damage, it prevents people from trying to nail Deejay on the wake up, and it prevents Chun-Li from always using her jumping short etc…
  3. Old deejay’s standing strong is almost invincible. It easily snuffs T.Hawk’s air dive which has high priority. If Deejay is walking forward and the opponent jumps (at reasonably close range), standing strong always snuffs it. The combination of standing strong and the occasional MGU or standing far roundhouse gives old deejay incredible anti-air capacity.

Another minor difference is that old deejay’s slide has longer range.

In SSF2 I would get insane win streaks with Deejay, and then when ST came out I couldn’t believe that people thought he was improved. The only way to take advantage of new deejay is by trying to land cross up / super combos, or play against dumb opponents who constantly fall for the jacknife juggle…

Also, in SSF2 you could redizzy with deejay, but it’s gone in ST…

The main strategy with old deejay is to get your opponent in the corner. If you can tick your opponent and throw them in the corner, the round should be yours. Old deejay’s corner traps are almost inescapable, except by characters with additional mobility (i.e. dhalsim etc.)

Just my opinion!

Eric Fattah
BC, Canada


#9

Freediver:

wow, interesting stuff about Old DJ. I think everyone plays new DJ nowadays simply because he looks cooler. I mean come on, upkick combos look too cool. Anyways…

I heard this theory from way back that Old DJ was Old Sagat’s worst matchup. Is this true? If so, how did this matchup go?


#10

Old deejay can go over low tiger shots with his invincible short dread kick. Both new & old deejays have problems against good Dhalsims though.

I’m thinking that in a tournament, old deejay might have a good chance, simply because no one uses him (and thus no one knows how to beat him). Getting past dhalsim would be the problem, and with so many dhalsim experts, old deejay probably wouldn’t get far. Nevertheless, other than Dhalsim, the main strong characters used in tournaments are Ryu, Balrog, Vega and O.Sagat, and old deejay does very well against all four of them.

Eric Fattah
BC, Canada


#11

Freediver,

Are you serious about old deejay? :eek:

I’m not going to ridicule, since I’ve probably played him a grand total of once–never to play him again once I realized he had no upkick. But it looks like I have some testing to do now :slight_smile:


#12

You have 2 opportunities to escape. Against the slide itself, and against the hold. Against the slide = MGU gets hit, upkick whiffs, short dread DOES avoid but I think Sim recovers in time… maybe even quick enough to hit DJ with b+strong? Against the hold = MGU can be thrown, Upkick I guess could work… but eh, risky? i don’t remember it working, short dread gets stuffed. this is all from memory.

i think Counter-throw works on both… My friend plays DJ all the time and this is usually the only way he gets out. He plays Old DJ religiously, and is fucked otherwise.

freediver: best thing about O.DJ IMO is his crossup is much harder to block…


#13

People also think that T.Hawk is bottom tier. I have no idea how to use him, but when I was at UBC some years ago, there was an expert who accumulated a 50+ win streak against all the best players at UBC, and that was while giving his opponents second round (thus 50+ consecutive 3rd round wins).

I played his T.Hawk many times (on that day and others), and I could beat him maybe 1 in 30 only, regardless of which character I used. He would just walk up and start creaming you with carefully planned regular attacks, with a rare psychic dp. Occasionally he would jump straight up or back, and on the early ascent do the air dive, fall short (thus not ticking you), and then do the 360 piledriver. Once you figured that out, you would try to counter it when he lands, only to eat a psychic dp.

The fact that old deejay and T.Hawk can be really effective goes to show that secrets still exist in these old games, and that common ‘tier tables’ are still inaccurate.

Eric Fattah
BC, Canada


#14

I don’t think tier tables are inaccurate… It’s just that people sometimes put too much faith in them, and regard the lower characters as worthless. In a game where every character can pretty much kill you in one combo, everybody has at least a chance.

Like Sim vs Hawk. It’s a pretty bad slaughter IMO… but if Hawk gets a good DP and you don’t block right on getup, it could be over right there. Even if he spends all day eating anti-airs and pokes trying to get in, if he DOES get in and does damage it’s can be HUGE damage and make up for it. If he gets Sim cornered with SPD… Besides reversal super (which won’t work against negative-SPD) and reversal teleport he’s dead.

He can win… hell, he’s a wildcard, oops! you let me in! wha? No reversal? You die! :). But the thing is that a lot of the time he SHOULDN’T win. Which is why we have tiers…

Back to DJ… uh… did’ya know j.jab can be instant overhead? :slight_smile:


#15

I remember several characters having jump-back or jump-forward instant overheads… can’t remember them all though.

Eric Fattah
BC, Canada


#16

Old Deejay huh?

rubs his chin


#17

Just thought I’d correct a few things and post some thoughts:

This hasn’t changed. You can go right through low tiger shots and any low attack.

This also hasn’t changed. DJs standing strong completely owns high priority air attacks (chun’s jump short for example), when done from the correct distance. When you add the upkick that can charge a good 1/3 - 1/2 a meter for free, he’s still got really good anti-air.

I don’t really see anything wrong with trying to bait somebody into jumping at you when you have a charge. If you can, that = free damage and a good chunk of meter. Guile’s been doing it for years. You also get in great position for a crossup, or wake up games.

Most good DJ players that I’ve seen take advantage of his high priority normals (low fierce, that #@$!#@ low forward, low strong, standing strong, etc) and yes, his very good crossup. One he gets you in the corner, you have a hell of a time getting out with his great anti air, dread kick to go over low pokes, those normals again, and (usually by that time) the threat of the super.

Random question: are his normal moves all the same (aside from jump fierce)?

I’m not really seeing the advantage of playing Old DJ vs New DJ. If you’re able to win with him, more power to you. But I don’t think having the invicibility frames on the MGU and maybe a longer a slide really make up for the loss of the super, throw softening, no upkick, and the loss of the crossup.


Where do I even begin?
#18

I agree and think New is better. But Masaka, O.DJ has crossup… Much harder to land, but much harder to block (i think it’s better).

MGU is good anti-air, and has bonus of being able to hit close crossups (unlike upkick). But it has startup, which sucks against deep attacks. Like if ken goes for jump jab after knee bash hold, even if you reverse MGU Ken whill whiff the jump attack, but land and block the MGU. sucks.


#19

Is it a spacing issue that makes it hard to use? One thing that’s nice about New DJ’s crossup is that it actually works vs. Balrog.

Too bad James Romedy doesn’t post here. He’s an absolute well of obscure SF knowledge, and he plays a lot of DJ.


#20

I use to think he didn’t have one either… until my friend starting kicking my ass with it.

The spacing is a lot tighter… you can’t just jump and hit forward like N.DJ. Seems to be really high up… anyhow, I can block N.DJ crossup usually, but have a hard time against Old… xcept with Guile where I always block it like a normal jump-in… (?)