T.Hawk Q&A: Ask simple questions here!

t-hawk

#1

As someone suggested, T.Hawk forum really needed a beginner’s thread. This is a great way for newbies to come in and quickly ramp up to speed. It builds the community and adds more knowledge to our forums.

  • NOTE - I’m not the best T.Hawk player but I do maintain another thread in this forum so I do come here often. I will definitely need help from all the veterans to make this thread rich and reliable for newcomers.

Introduction
T.Hawk (Ted) is a great character to pick up. Most will compare him to Zangief. Why shouldn’t they since both are grapplers with high stamina. However, that is the mistake when playing T.Hawk like you would play Gief. This will work with lower quality opponents but once you get higher, you’ll find that T. Hawk has different strengths to overcome this difference. I will all go into detail in this thread so keep on reading!

Strengths

  • High Stamina/Stun (1100/1100)
  • High Damage: normals, specials, ultras
  • Great Wake Up Defense: ex-DP, SPD (MT), specials, U1, U2
  • Decent AA: ex-DP, decent AA normals, U2 (difficult to master)
  • Far reaching command grab: lp.SPD

Weaknesses

  • Unsafe specials: Most of Ted’s specials are very unsafe on blocked and whiffed
  • No easy hit-confirm knock-down: * Can hit-confirm with a normal xx dp but this is more advanced timing
  • Slow movement : * Dash and Condor Spire can cover space quickly but should be used judicially

Normals/Frame Data
http://www.eventhubs.com/guides/2010/may/09/t-hawks-frame-data-super-street-fighter-4/
Useful Input Shortcuts
http://www.eventhubs.com/guides/2009/may/04/shortcut-motions-shoryukens-dragon-punches-street-fighter-4/
Hit-Box Data
http://shoryuken.com/f339/t-hawk-hitboxes-updated-6-7-10-check-page-2-condor-dive-236225/
NickExtreme’s very useful Beginner’s Video
http://shoryuken.com/media.php?do=details&mid=3190

Unique Attacks/Command Moves/Specials/Super/Ultras
Heavy Body Press (Splash) - :d: + hp (after jump forward/backward)
This is your best cross-up attack. It also hits in front and can be used somewhat ambiguously.

Heavy Shoulder (HS) - :d: + mp (after jump forward/backward)
This is only an air-to-air attack. Grounded opponents will not get hit but the hit-box on this movement favors Ted in most situations. Most air throws will still win against this. It does look like a Splash so you could interchange this for a semi-free jump-in throw.

Thrust Peak (TP) - :df: + lp
Thrust Peak has Ted quickly swinging his arm forward. It is an OK AA but will most likely trade against jump-ins. It doesn’t do much damage so you mostly will be losing in the trade. It has a long frame animation and you will be at a major frame disadvantage on block.

Tomahawk Buster (DP) - :dp: + :p:
This is Ted’s Shoryuken move. Normal DPs are decent AAs if performed early when opponent is at the top of their jump arc. If done late, this might trade or lose to opponent’s jump attack. Lp to Hp DPs range from lowest to highest in the following: frame animation, damage, start-up frames (5-8), and space covered vertically and horizontally.
Hp-DP has invincibility frames during start-up and some initial active frames. It is the best choice for AA outside of ex, but can lose or trade depending on your stance.
Ex-DP covers similar ground as hp.DP but is much quicker. It also has more invincibility frames than hp.DP so will never trade or lose to deep jump-ins. You can also perform an ex-Condor Dive only after an ex-DP.
A useful DP shortcut is to do :df::d::df:. This will keep Ted’s hit-box low to minimize hits.
You could use DPs as reversals during wake-up. You can use ex-DP to escape certain frame traps and cross-over wake-ups. This isn’t always a sure thing depending on when you initiate the DP and the attack type but gives you more of a chance. This is similar to how Guile uses ex-Sonic Flash to escape a Gief splash cross-over.
DPs that hit will knock-down.

Condor Dive (CD) - :3p: (in the air after jump neutral/forward)
Condor Dive is an aerial attack dive after Ted performs a neutral or forward jump. The attack angle is about 4:00 o’clock when facing forward, where 3:00 o’clock is forward. Sadly, you can not perform a CD during a backward jump. WARNING: Condor Dive is notoriously unsafe on block and whiff! The best strategy is to react to an opponent while you’re in the air. If opponent fireballs or whiffs an AA, then perform CD. Guile has such a quick recovery from his sonic-boom, that it’s best not to CD on Guile. Blocked CDs will result with a punish of any of the following depending on your opponent: normals, specials, supers, and ultra. Whiffed CDs could “slide land” Ted in front of your opponent to be in range for SPD/U1. Keep in mind that you are still at a frame disadvantage and the higher your opponent’s skill level, the least likely this will succeed. It might work if you pull this out once in a blue moon. Also, CD hit-box is very throw-able so it will lose to most air-throws.
CD can cross-over certain opponents depending on your aim, their stance and their hit-box. Hakan, for example, has a weird enough hit-box for your aimed CD to succeed. When trapping your opponents in the corner, you could blindly aim your CD high so that the corner “pulls” your CD into the opponent’s backside.
Ex-CD can only be performed if you hit an ex-DP to continue your combo. You can also use ex-CD to further escape from a opponent’s wake-up mix-up game. Of course, this takes two meters to perform.
You can continue a CD after connecting a jump.lp attack (also doable on a backwards jump.lp). If opponent is in the air and gets hit by your jump.lp, then your dive will whiff. This isn’t so reliable to hit or mix-up but needed to be mentioned.

Mexican Typhoon (SPD/MT) - 270 Stick Rotation + :p:
Mexican Typhoon is your command grab. This is very similar to Gief’s SPD but has some differences. Lp.SPD does the least damage but places you in range for a cross-over. Each high punch does more damage but places your further away from your fallen opponent. Also, lp.SPD has the farthest range to grab an opponent. Hp.SPD has the least but it’s not as bad as Gief’s Hp.SPD range. You can do a safe jump immediately after lp.SPD animation ends. However, you might land in back or in front of your opponent depending on your match-up. Mp.SPD places you in range and extra time for a frontal safe jump. Hp.SPD places you furthest away to perform two dashes or one Condor Spire safely.
SPD can be used as a wake-up defense if the opponent is grounded and is in range. However, SPD has 2 start-up frames and will lose/whiff to the following: meaty attacks, attacks with less frames, throws, and jumps. If two grapplers perform SPDs at the same time frame, then both will whiff.
Ex-SPD has 4 start-up frames but is invincible. (TBD: ex-SPD Range?) This can be used against meaty attacks.
Tick throws are a combination of a quick attack followed by a throw. Keep in mind that if the opponent is in block stun, your throw will whiff when activated. So in some cases, you’ll have to wait a little before activating your throw.

Condor Spire (CS) - :l::d::db: + :p:
Condor Spire is a Ted’s horizontal attack. He semi-flies towards the opponent but only horizontally. Opponents will most likely whiff if they are doing a sweep attack. The range and frame animation of CS depends on the strength of the punch choice. All normal CS are unsafe if performed too near the opponent. Judge your distance carefully. Also, all normal CS will not knock down your opponent. Only ex-CS will knock down your opponent on hit. Ex-CS also has projectile invincibility and is safe on block. CS is a good mix-up tool, since the opponent cannot tell which strength and range since all start-up animation are the same. The main problem with CS is the reverse DP motion. There is no reverse short-cut DP to perform so you have to execute this perfectly.
CS can be used as wake-up defense against meaty projectiles and specials/ultras that are considered projectiles. Ryu’s super/U1 and Guiles U2 are examples.

Double Typhoon (Super) - 540 Stick Rotation + :p:
Raging Typhoon (Ultra 1/U1) - 540 Stick Rotation + :3p:
Ted’s super can only be performed when all meters are stocked. Of course, you already knew that.
Ted’s U1 is similar to his super and Gief’s U1 but needs revenge meter.
Both are basically command grabs similar to SPD but you need to perform at least 540 degree rotation of your controller. Super/U1 does good damage and has 1 frame start-up. Refer to SPD for strategy. The range is less than lp.SPD.
The 540 motion makes it hard to perform a grounded throw. Beginner’s will most likely have to finish their motion after a jump. You can buffer your rotation with the following: normals, whiffed throws, taunt, or dash. This means you can perform the rotation when you’re in the frame animation of another move. There is a shortcut for true standing 540 but this is for the advanced so I won’t go into details.

You can fake/whiff a meaty attack on opponent’s wake-up into super/ultra. The motion is:
:r::df::d:+lk/lp:db::l::ub::u::uf::r::df::d::db::l: + :p:/:3p:

Raging Slash (Ultra 2/U2) - :hcb:x2 + :3p:
Raging Slash is Ted’s AA Ultra. Ted thrusts into the air much like his hp.DP’s angle and range. The hit box is not too forgiving and will need some precision to connect. Grounded opponents will not get hit. In all respects, this is like a DP but the motion is very unforgiving. I personally rate this more for the intermediate and advanced players. It is difficult to successfully pull-off due to the unintuitive motion. Some match-ups are better for U2 due to lofty jumps and wall dives/jumps. A tip to better react is by buffering the first :hcb: into your current move’s animation. U2 is invincible up until after it’s active frames. It is also projectile invincible for Akuma/Ibuki air fireball.


#2

The Infamous 50/50 Game
You’ve probably all heard of something called the 50/50 game. It’s a relatively simple philosophy for grappler types. The basic premise is based on the following: Ted has high VITALITY and does high DAMAGE. If you could limit the amount of options that your opponent can do to you with the same amount of options you can do to him, then theoretically you will win the damage scale over time. It’s basically a guessing game but the amount of guesses should be at least 50/50 in favor of you. The reason for this is that if you guessed right, then the damage you do will outdo the damage that is done back to you. If you guessed wrong, then your higher life will outlast your opponent’s lower life total. The goal here is to ensure that you limit your opponents options to less than yours.
Here is a simple example. Assuming your opponent is knocked down and you are standing in range of a SPD but outside his throw range. His options upon wake-up: block, jump (neutral/back), reversal (assuming that he has one). Your options are: SPD, DP, block. As you can see, this is a rock/paper/scissor game but it’s really a 50/50 guessing match. If you win, you simply do more damage. If you lose, you’ll take less damage. Over time, you will win the game.
The major problem to this philosophy is as you face harder opponents, they will not let themselves into such situations. Or if they win, they are proficient enough to execute longer combos and therefore somewhat tip the damage scale back in their favor. This is why grappler types win so easily against noobs.

Anti-Air
Ted has many options for Anti-Air.

DP: The best AA is his DP. Discussed in the specials section.
U2: Not as easy to perform as DP. Discussed in the specials section.

His ground normals aren’t too reliable except for st.mp situations. Most will trade even if timed correctly.
st.hk: For jump-ins that is further in front of T.Hawk. Has long start-up frames.
st.mp (close): Great for when opponent is right on top of you.
df.lp: Will hit/trade with opponents that are in front and on top of you. Quick to come out.
cr.hp: Similar to df.lp but needs to be timed perfectly. Long motion and would trade most of the time.

j.mp/j.mk: Best if you predict the opponent to be in front of you in the air.
j.lp: Quick to come out and high “priority”.
j + elbow drop: Good “priority”.

Focus Attack: Best against heavy attacks. You absorb their meaty attacks and hit while they’re recovering on the ground. This usually fails if the jump-in is empty or a light attack was done, usually, to a throw.

Ground Game/Pokes
Ted has a very effective ground game. A move’s priority is vague definition of how often it succeeds. Overall, it is a combination of hit-box, frame data, opponent’s move priority, spacing and time of initiation. As you can see, it can be very complicated to define but we generalize by saying that a move has higher “priority” than an opponent’s. This is just saying that this has a very high chance of hitting. It should not trade or lose.

I’ll define his pokes from farthest to nearest.

st.hk - This hits furthest away and high. It can be used for anti-air if the opponent is jumping somewhat in front of you. Be careful as this move has much recovery frames and can be punished easily. Opponents can fadc or react easily with a far-reaching special.

st.hp - This isn’t as unsafe st.hk but is not as effective. St.mk/cr.mk are safer and better options.

st.mk/cr.mk - Both are great and safe poking options for the distance they provide. Cr.mk could almost be compared to shoto’s poking cr.mk, however, there are no OS(option-select) combos.

st.mp/cr.mp - St.mp does 20 damage more than st.mk but is 1-frame less on block and hit. This means that it is a bit more unsafe than st.mk. Cr.mp is relative the same as cr.mk but cr.mk has the lower hit detection.

st.lp (far/close), - This is your best poke at close range as it only has 3 start-up frames and huge frame advantage on block/hit.

cr.lp/cr.lk - Both are decent poking options as they have better hit-boxes than st.lp but the frame data aren’t nearly as good.

Against Fireball Spammers
The goal against all fireball spammers is to corner them. If you force them into a close-medium range then you take away half of their safe/reliable game. The trick is to reliably get in on them. Once you corner them, I usually don’t cross-up so I can keep them in the corner. If you let them out of the corner then it resets the match and they start another fireball fest.

Jumping/CD - Again, the key here is to react while you’re in the air. Guile has the least recovery so you’ll have to be extra judicious here. This won’t work against diagonal fireballs like Gouken and Juri. Concerning jumping, don’t forget that you can jump neutral. At close to medium range, your opponent should stop spamming fireballs. At this point, you’ll go into your footsies game but you could also random a jump. Mix it up. Don’t always do a j.foward since your could also do a j.neutral. Mix it up between the follow: j.f, j.n, j.f + CD, j.n + CD. The CD temporarily holds you in place in the air before diving. This and the different spacing between forward and neutral jumping will make it hard on the opponent to know which AA to use. Some opponents have simple one normal or one special AAs to use in all situations. Other opponents like Chun or Sagat has specific AAs to user for different situations. Similar to Gief, Ted has a far reaching jumping poke with j.mk. The sooner you can hit a projectile spammer, the less chance of them pulling out an AA.

EX-CS - This is a great option against projectiles, however, you obviously need meter so it’s a limited option. At medium/far range, this will either pass-thru or will place you in range for an SPD. At medium/close range, you will be in range for SPD or will knock them down.

FADC (Focus Attack Dash Cancel) - Use hyper armor to absorb one projectile and instantly dashing afterward. The key here is to time your FADC at the moment before the fireball hits you. If you start your FADC too soon, you’re giving your opponent time to predict the follow-up dash. Keep in mind, this will not work against ex-projectiles as they usually hit twice. A common rule is you never want to absorb more than one hit before letting the initial hit recuperate. So following up with a block or jump-f,n after your initial FADC. At close/medium range, you can follow up with a SPD.

Walk Forward/Block - Yes! It’s that simple some times. Just walk forward and block. Slowly creep your fat-ass in.

The key to all of this is patience. Sometimes you’ll only have one chance to corner a fireball spammer so you have to make the best of it. If you can’t avoid getting hit by a fireball, then simply block it. Don’t let the hits add up. Also, for some follow-ups where I mentioned SPD, of course, you could also follow-up with special or U1.

Mix-up after knockdown

Useful Combos
j.attack -> st.lp -> st.lk xx DP - This does not work on crouching cammy/ibuki. it does not work after cross-up splash. However, is your your best hit-confirm combo into a knockdown.

j.attack (hard) -> st.mp (close) -> DP - This is considered a hit-confirm combo into a knockdown but you have less time to confirm. Use a hard hitting jump attack and time the st.mp to maximize your hit-confirm window.

j.attack -> st.mp (close) -> lk.CS - This is a mix-up combo that shouldn’t be used too often. It is often followed up by a SPD.

j.attack -> cr/st.lp (x2/x3/x4) -> If opponent blocks, the two lps put you in range for a follow-up SPD. If it hits, then continue your lp string for minimum damage however.

j.attack -> cr.lp -> st.lp -> st.mp - This is the hardest combo listed here since st.mp is a 1-frame link. However, this is the most damaging combo that works on all opponents. To better link your combo, plink the st.mp.

  • There many other combos but they are more restricted to timing, spacing, and opponents.

:chainsaw:IN PROGRESS:blah:


#3

Reserved2


#4

Thanks for the post suncowiam, I’ve been looking around for a bit of help and this defiantly does that. I’ve heard form several people that lp.spd is almost always the best option but, I’ve been holding off on using it due to the fact I’m just about lost on what to do after.


#5

Good stuff Suncowiam. On the DP bit, HP DP also has some invincibility on the start up and first active frames. You can use it late from crouching or standing (but his big old hitbox means you can get into trouble from standing and gives you less time) and it will stuff just about everything, so no need to burn that meter. It is the best option anti air as his others normal DPs, if he is still grounded, will trade. Also worht noting LP - HP has more start up 5-8 frames. EX DP has the same start up as LP. EX Dive is your get out of jail card if EX DP is blocked - lots of people forget that and it is Hawks version of DP FADC really!


#6

VERY NICELY DONE!
I may post some useful combos later when I get off of work.


#7

looking forward to that

generally, what kind of strategies am I using as Hawk? When and how should I be using CS? As an actual move, or as an SPD setup?


#8

correction: ultra 2 is two half circles back not forward.
addition: condor dive can be canceled into from j.jab–even if you are jumping backwards.

after lp spd you basically have two options: shenanigans or safe jump.
shenanigans include: hp spire to crossup downed opponent, mp spire to look like it but doesn’t, tomahawk to crossup downed opponent, jump early dive to crossup, take a step back and neutral jump just outside of reversal range (character specific).
safe jump is: ambiguous crossup splash that stuffs most every opponent’s options or leaves you safe with your choice of spire/tomahawk/spd/or sweep option selected for different anticipated situations or straight into combos that either knockdown with tomahawk or have a buffered (ex) spire at the end to continue mixup. there are actually a lot of options in the combo thread.


#9

@TAMANAPANT - Thanks for the DP update. Will update when I have time.

@gandalfrockman - Looking forward to your combo list, but keep in mind that this is a beginner’s thread so I personally would like to keep the list short. I usually only list BnB combos that should work on all characters. I’m still definitely interested in your list. Thanks!

@komradekraig - I knew it was half-circle back, brain is farting on me. Thanks. I will include your after lp.SPD options in another section called mix-up or shenanigans which is TBD.

Thanks everyone for you input!


#10

I think hawks best bnb is splash to clk to hp dp or ex dp/ex condor dive. If you have three bars I think it’s worth going for splash close mp ex cs to exdp to ex cd. Other bnb is clpx4 x mp. Also you can use non ex condor spire as an anti air and if it hits them and they are falling close enough to you you can exdp/excd. Also spd is 2 frames ex spd is 4. You might also explain why the ambiguious hawk meaty splash cross up is so good for those non gief users who don’t know the power of the cross-up splash.


#11

If you want I can give some strategies to help out, I was in class today and wrote some stuff on dive (but you already covered that.) spire uses and his wakeup game.


#12

how should I try to get in on people? I find that I am getting SLAUGHTERED by characters who can turtle well (Guile, Chun Li, Balrog, etc)


#13

i don’t think there is a universal tactic for beating turtle characters beside be patient, build meter, find an opportunity (going to be character specific), use lots of normals, and get a life lead to make them come to you. Otherwise, you should peep the revised matchup thread for specific information.


#14

Ultra II goes through projectiles; very useful against Akuma and Ibuki in particular.

With that, T. Hawk pretty much is invincible during the active frames of Ultra II. Just saying.


#15

Thanks

[Edit]: What other sections should I add to this?


#16

The T. Hawk Tutorial video I promised to put up finally decided to upload properly.

Shoryuken - SSF4 : Sacred Prayer - The T. Hawk Video Tutorial

Might be useful to put here; let me know what you guys think, I need input from fellow T. Hawk players :stuck_out_tongue:


#17

Very nice Nick…very, very nice.


#18

there’s a lack of basic combos in the reserved posts. stuff like combos you can do after a splash, like J.splash, st.mp xx lp.TB and what not. T.hawk needs a bit of combos


#19

@ blackgenma
been busy with work. will add a combo section. there’s also a discussion concerning a possible hit-confirm combo.

will update when i have more time.


#20

You can do an almost instant Condor dive using :uf::r::df::3p:
Press the 3punch after :df:
Its not that hard, and can be used to get 360’s off

EX MT has the same range as LP MT