Taking advantage of Onis punishability

oni

#1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9YADCeDukQ

I’ll just leave this here. Show your friends and make sure no one loses to oni EVER again.


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#2

I’m just a beginner, but doesn’t the author assume the Oni will be playing on autopilot? Correct me if I’m wrong, but that’s how it seemed to me. Like every single Oni player will do the exact same things, all the time. For all I know, that might be true online, but still…


#3

I got my brother to make the vid and he wanted to keep the vid short. He didnt wanna get caught up in the whole oni is shit, is not shit arguements and instead showed how to punish onis “mixups” if done in the safest ways. He also wanted to keep the situations consistent instead of all over the place so nobody would call him out on cherry picking things/chars.

for example-I wanted him to show how punishable stomps are if done up close/off resets/off meaties basically anything improperly spaced which is what you see the most online at mid low levels. He argued that no one good will do this and showed the safest way to utilize onis mk and lk stomps can still be punished and beat(not all the ways however you can still mash dp or reversal them, jump air to air normal into ultra them, air throw them etc etc). He chose the safest way to utilize stomps in block strings, anything closer is even more punishable, anything farther wiffs and you get crazy punished on recovery. You could utilize hk stomp instead of the mk and lk ones in strings but that thing is so god damn slow you should be able to back dash punish or focus attack/focus dash on reaction.

I wouldve shown how bad f+hp is on block improperly spaced, too close gets blown up hard, too far and barely wiffing gets blown up hard, perfectly space can still be punished with focus which is what you should be bait and punishing with at the range where f+hp would be spaced correctly. a cut in showing each shoto dp anti airing into ultra meterless, dp anti airing fadcing into ultra and dp fadcing on first hit into ultra or combo. Then show how onis dp cant do any of these things. I wouldve shown how to space out oni so that his stand mk and stand mp are ineffective, thus forcing out the f+hp or risky fireball or step kick(bro argued that not every char can do that either and wanted to keep the vid as universal as possible). I also would have shown why his previously even or advantaged matchups got worse in ultra, and how his disadvantaged matchups got worse. Oh i also would have shown how theres no consequence to getting thrown by oni which further weakens his frametrap game, but thats a problem that everyone besides cammy and ibuki share in ultra so I think it would be unfair to complain about it. But all of that would have been a 20 min long vid he didnt wanna go through the trouble of making so oh well.

fundamentally the core situations stay the same. The two jabs used for blockstrings into kara grab could be interchanged with c.jab into c.lk or 2 cr lk or c.jab into c.mp or 2 b+mps its essentially all the same.

the block string used for the fireball scenario was the max distance I would consider a improperly spaced fireball, anything farther is “safe” unless you start really going into character specifics which was outside the scope of the video. I really wanted to show stand lk into fireball being blown up on block because its one of the more “common” string enders into fireball. I also would have shown ppl blowing up fireball enders edit-with focus at any distance but thats a universal shoto thing that their fireballs arent a true string so i left that out. Any other ender like slash enders and tatsu enders are so unsafe and not seen at higher levels I didnt feel the need to include them as their punishability is self evident(slashes wiffed if spaced too far out in a string or if opponent backdashes, tatsus you are like -13 on block, electric fireballs you get jumped on.

If you have any specific problems with certain scenarios I can address them/explain the reasoning for them.

-edit also he had chars crouch blocking stomps mid screen, he could have made the chars block standing, or in the corner both of which reduces pushback on block greatly and enable much harder punishes. So basically it was the worst case scenario to try to block and punish, but he still showed that punishes are possible even if spaced correctly, midscreen, wrong block and all.

-double edit, he also should have shown people focus punishing the stomps as 4 button tech is a thing to get out of block strings, if a stomped into a focus its a free crumple.


#4

Don’t forget with slashes, that you can hit (mash jab) or throw Oni out of them. I think that last part of the video is very true, and partly explain why Oni is so misunderstood.

In America I think very few really understand Oni. Sanford is awesome but gets away with a ton of stuff (he almost always LK/MK stomps without consequence for example) cause high level Oni players are rare here. However in Asia there are high level Oni (and high level for just about every character) and so players from there are familiar with the matchup. When Gamerbee went up against Sanford, he blew him up cause he didn’t let Sanford get away with just throwing out punishable moves (he punished LK/Mk stomp every time). When Infiltration faced Sanford in fight night, he blew him up and said “Sanford has a lot to learn”. Sanford is better since those days, and I think because of him Americans are learning the match up more. However a lot of players still let him get away with a lot.

Wao’s Oni is seen to be successful in Asia, even Topanga league which is the ultimate test (long sets, you play everyone and everyone is elite). That seems to be the way you have to play Oni…not so much as an offensive rushdown character but as an opportunistic punish/turtle character. Wao’s Oni seems to be the way to play him if you want to beat elite players who also know the match up. Frankly the style is quite boring in comparison to Sanford or OMH (my personal favorite as far as entertainment value).


#5

Pretty much, but did you see how wao shut down haitanis makoto by spamming jab jab mp, and mashing out of everything? shit was hilarious. Its too bad that after waos run in topanga, bonchan and mago both picked up oni just to see what they got beat by, n the other japanese players probably went in super hard on the matchup as well. I dont think Wao won the next time he played daigo, tokido, fuudo, bonchan etc etc. Im really sure about the bonchan part I remember watching the set after that and bonchan was soooo happy he didnt lose to wao again he was pumped.


#6

Thanks TC - very helpful against the army of gimmick Onis online.


#7

Good stuff bro