TAP techniques and strats!

balrog

#1

Now that the game has come out, I think it’d be good to turn this into a TAP strat thread, instead of a “I (personally) don’t know much about this game yet,” thread.
HELP BALROG GET PAID! POST YOUR TAP TECHNIQUES HERE!

(EDIT: 12/11/09 new information from gammon)
KNOWN COMBOS FROM MEATY TAP

  • meaty TAP, 1lp, 1lp, (1lk), 17fp, ultra

Suggested by gootecks

  • typically do not exceed a LVL 1 charge
  • can be used to escape a cross-up if applied correctly
  • best used from maximum range

Suggested by Jay Wang

  • has armour breaking properties (breaks SA/FA). Regular rush punch can not do this.
  • offers Rog a way of moving forward and still maintaining a back charge
  • can be done without having to charge back. In other words it can be used in situations where a rush punch can not be. ie: after: walking or dashing forward.
  • oh yeah and, TAP can GO THROUGH PROJECTILES.
  • can be used on wake up to beat certain pressure attempts
  • good set-up for EX Armor Cancel
    (mix-up, does not combo) max range TAP, EX dash (x) (must absorb a poke for EX Armor Cancel), kara into ultra (will crush any additional moves, may catch opponent in recovery)

Suggested by Teppelin

  • can cancel into super
  • can juggle into ultra after an AA

Suggested by syngin

  • good for high risk/high reward options
  1. (after TAP) EX dash (x) to beat poke attempts (relatively safe)
  2. (after TAP) EX heabutt to beat poke and throw attempts (not safe, yields ultra)

Suggested by gammon

  • easy meaty on opponent’s wake up
  • cancel with a focus dash to thin the disadvantage on a high TAP or to continue pressure
  • can set up for combos upon meaty
  • max range TAP/dash straight into counter-poke TAP/dash straight is unusually effective
  • LVL 1 TAP, c.jab can be used to set up for tick throws/pressure
  • fantastic for breaking M. Bison block strings that end in scissors
  • great for dodging dive spamming Vegas; however, you must do it early in his jump phase to sucessfully dodge

IMPORTANT

  • Reversals in this game are 20x easier to do than another Street Fighter; meaties are somehow not safe. This is as they are waking up; it’s still fine post-connect. Use meaty TAP with caution.

(new info 12/11/09)
PURPOSE

  • Don’t use TAP with the expectation you are to be hitting an opponent after a fireball. That is very unlikely. In most situations you will simply not be able to hit them before they recover (especially if they know their spacing), many situations will actually get you hit. TAP should primarily be used to reposition yourself against an opponent who is attempting to zone you. The fact that they have blocked a TAP, does not mean that you did not achieve a goal. TAP has exceptional chip potential and in conjunction with the ability to close the range on an opponent safely, a blocked hit is still a successful hit, anything beyond that is a bonus.

(new info 12/11/09)
MIND GAMES

  • If timed correctly upon an opponent’s wake-up, TAP can be used to bait reversal attempts due to its abnormal animation and quick recovery. Many players will attempt to punish the (thought to be) whiffed TAP and in turn be punished themselves. If they attempt to reversal a TAP, a well timed EX headbutt can beat every attack in the game, excluding: Bison’s ultra, Sagat’s ultra, Honda’s ultra, and EX dragon punches (it still can, but the timing is bizarre). If they believe they can throw your “whiffed” TAP, then you can meaty them upon their wake-up.

Options after a “whiffed” TAP upon opponent’s wake-up

  1. EX headbutt to beat 90% of possible reversal outcomes in the game
  2. Meaty their throw attempt (preferrably with c.mk)
  3. Back dash to beat most reversal and throw attempts
  4. Throw them (as they may choke in fear of the previous three options)
  5. Block to play it safe and maybe make a late throw attempt/break

WHEN TO NOT USE TAP

  • don’t TAP at close range vs. most characters (you can be very easily hit or thrown out of it)
  • don’t TAP through fireball, against Akuma with ultra/super; you can bait Raging Demon by being purposefully hit with a fireball after a “mistimed” TAP (you will be in hit stun, or recover in time, and demon will not connect)
  • don’t TAP through fireball, against Ryu with super
  • don’t TAP through fireball, mid-screen, against Ken with ultra
  • don’t TAP through fireball, against Sagat beyond half-screen (s.rh, tiger knee, ultra)
  • don’t TAP against Blanka or E. Honda (unless they’ve advanced forward) until you control the match (even so, a bad idea)
  • don’t TAP against Guile’s jab Sonic Boom (typically very unsafe)
  • don’t TAP against Zangief (reaction lariat, jab SPD, EX green hand) until you have control of the match (even so, a horrible idea)
  • don’t TAP upon wake up (ever)

TAP DATA
The information in bold highlights a relatively safe frame count.
SU H R GA HA GR HR PW STU G BL C
Level 1
30 07 13 -02 +02 17 21 130 200 30/40 HL S
Level 2
_ 30 07 16 -05 -01 17 21 150 210 30/40 HL S
Level 3__ 30 08 18 -08 -04 17 21 180 220 30/40 HL S
Level 4__ 30 09 21 -12 -08 17 21 210 230 30/40 HL S
Level 5__ 30 10 22 -14 -10 17 21 250 240 30/40 HL S
Level 6__ 30 11 24 -17 -13 17 21 280 250 30/40 HL S
Level 7__ 30 12 26 -20 -16 17 21 410 260 30/40 HL S
Level 8__ 30 13 29 -24 -20 17 21 460 270 30/40 HL S
Level 9__ 30 15 32 -29 -25 17 21 510 280 30/40 HL S
Final____ 30 16 36 -34 -30 17 21 560 290 30/40 HL S
SU: Startup H: Hit R: Recovery GA: Guard Adv HA: Hit Adv GR: Guard Recovery HR: Hit Recovery PW: Power STU: Stun G: Gauge BL: Block C: Cancel

(previous post)
Sorry if I don’t have all the info on TAP straight, but it seems that anything over a LVL 1 TAP is pretty unsafe to downright stupid.

Why would you ever do a FINAL TAP on someone, especially considering how long it takes to charge, when you have -30 frames on HIT? Is it only practical for a killing blow?

So, what advantage does TAP possess aside from the fact it has long hit frames for an easy meaty? Even with a meaty on certain levels you are STILL at disadvantage on hit, why? It doesn’t even do that much damage mid charge and the stun is no better than a far FP. Does it give you a huge frame bonus on counter-hit?

From what I can tell the only uses are…
-easy meaty (though still unsafe above a certain lvl)
-good for disguising a charge (tho’ since the advantage blows, it really doesn’t matter for pressure)
-good for a psychic counter-poke killing blow

I never see anyone use it aside from meter building. What am I missing?
(/previous post)


#2

There are a few things I use TAP for…one is to go throu fireballs. If I fight a person that likes turtle all day long then I might as well hold it down and wait for that opening and score a big blow.

As far as I can tell if you TAP from max distance it is safe on block.


#3

Doesn’t it also go through projectiles? It’s been a while since I played the game, but EX dash moves would absorb some damage via armour, while TAP would go clean through IIRC.

But yeah, typically it doesn’t seem to be used in most uploaded Japanese matches that I’ve watched.


#4

Yup it goes past fireballs.

TAP is also matchup specific, for example it can be used to counter Claws wall dive, but against some other characters there are not many uses for it.


#5

http://forums.shoryuken.com/showpost.php?p=5660427&postcount=68

TAP is a completely different move than the other rush punches that Rog has in his arsenal.

In addition to what Toomeke has already said:

  • TAP has armour breaking properties (breaks SA/FA). Regular rush punch can not do this.
  • TAP offers Rog a way of moving forward and still maintaining a back charge
  • TAP can be done without having to charge back. In other words it can be used in situations where a rush punch can not be. ie: after: walking or dashing forward.
  • oh yeah and, TAP can GO THROUGH PROJECTILES.

The differences of all the moves have been outlined by me in the first post of the Beginner’s Guide Thread.

Feel free to play Rog without TAP tho, let us know how that works out for ya.


#6

What exactly is the difference between holding PPP and KKK?


#7

No difference between punch and kick versions–it’s a matter of convenience–you hold kicks when you want to use punches and hold punches if you want to you kick buttons.

As mentioned earlier, it’s an excellent tool for getting through fireball traps and for punishing turtlers like honda and guile. If you’re playing a keep away/guessing game it can be the perfect punishment. a “final” tap is also really sweet–one punch and a shit load of danage and just might make it through a fireball.

Hope that helps.


#8

Thanks so much Dangmug bud.


#9

Alright! Thanks guys, this is some good info. I didn’t even think about it being safe after push-back on a max distance hit. Can it be Ultra’d or Supered after a max distance hit? Lets say a practical charge of 1-3.

Are there any videos with nice application of TAP? I mean I can theorycraft some shit, but I’d prefer see some in session exhibition. I have seen quite a few of Ronstoppable’s vids, nice Rog action happening there, and a couple other Japanese players. No offensive TAP tho’. I’m really interested in seeing Toki no Tobira; but he seems to play in a bunker 'cuz I can’t find anything on him.


#10

You can cancel super off of it and juggle ultra off of it as well.
I’ve used it a few times after someone jumps backwards from me. They see me walk forward, jump backwards, I let go of TAP, free knockdown with some decent damage.

Safe enough from max range. Most people like to just walk up throw to punish TAP so be prepared to break throws. I sometimes EX rush punch low after TAP since people like to do down something into whatever.

TAP is not a useless move by any means. I still have a lot to learn though so take my advice with a grain of salt and some penicillin.


#11

Whats up John Rog…haven’t seen you at 94 for a while.


#12

OK, I finally managed to read through the whole, beginners guide. I didn’t know how broken up the info was on TAP. The ability to crush FA’s sounds really damn nice, didn’t think about using it on wake-up either. Good shit compiling that Jay, may wanna move some of it to the front post tho’.


#13

i know right… i mean yea i barely come around ever… but MAN it’s been a mad minute… we miss john :frowning:

did you at least say bye to markkkay?


#14

I’ve had overtime this whole week. I don’t get out till like 11:30 or midnight nowadays. It’s killing me!!! I need to be out there! I should be out there a lot more next week.


#15

maybe just dig a little deeper… :wink:


#16

[media=youtube]DR2AceM-RWY[/media]

this video shows some good use of TAP and different uses for it.


#17

Got some pretty sweet business in there. The Ultra after TAP was pretty unexpected. At one point he does a dash punch right after a connected TAP, seems pretty ballsy… wonder how that shit’ll fly.


#18

Who would be the considered the top balrog players right now?


#19

If Tsuji is playing sf4 then its him :pray:


#20

I’m pretty sure Toki no Tobira is the top rated Balrog player, may be wrong. Can’t find vids on ‘em tho. You can find vids of him playing other games tho’ and getting raped in each of 'em. I’m suprised at his great success in SF4. Side from that, I dunno.