That Shoto spam

juri

#1

I can beat most other non shoto’s in the game. But the Shoto’s destroy my Juri. If I get close, I eat a Shoryuken which hits me out of C.MK or pinwheel. When I get close, my opponent ALWAYS flies off with a air Hurricane kick, which knocks me out of dive kicks. A long range, I Counter the fireballs, but eat a SRK as I come out when they throw an EX. Wake up ultras destroy me, because I am not used to having to block whenever My opponent is low health. I AM a good player, but these shoto’s destroy me. Any tips on what to do against these guys?


#2

You could’ve Posted in the strategy/match up thread


#3

Block and punish.


#4

Focus the fireballs full screen to get your ultra. If you’re using the second one. They’ll be more cautious once you J.MP to Ultra or EX Dive Kick to Ultra.

Or if you see a fireball coming, dive kick it. They’ll quickly learn that your foot in their mouth hurts quite a bit.


#5

use the heavy punch counter into dive kick, u can crack them (not ryu… not sure about akuma) before their recovery is over.

charge some fireballs to build meter ( you can throw them out at random if u wish), then chuck an ex lk+mk fireball at em which will travel under their fireball and hit em for 100 damage.


#6

Guys, you don’t understand.

[media=youtube]uaQE37m9Mr4#t=3m40s[/media]

Best bet is to just watch [media=youtube]m4cQ8Iywi2U[/media] tutorial and you’ll be on your way to top 24 at EVO guaranteed. Good luck, buddy.


#7

i cant stand DSP, he whines constantly. but you are correct, those uppercuts do cut through everything, i keep eating them after c.lk c.lk and then foolishly trying to put in a third c.lk.


#8

Kind of surprising to me. Shotos are the easiest matchups (besides gief) for me so far.

All you need to do is

a) focus fireballs at fullscreen
b) lp counter anticipated fireballs and punish
c) dive kick anticipated fireballs (if they dont fb, all you end up doing is jumping over there fb… jump back, and reset)
d) store an HK fb of your own to quickly knockdown any jumpin attempts
e) mp fb war at full screen, if they’re first to jump they either eat a © or a (d)

Another, slightly more complicated plan is to

a) build 2 stocks of EX meter and store a lk fb
and choose between either:
b) EX counter their jumpin at and then EX dive into ultra
OR:
c) watch for their first far-mid jumpin and as they’re landing, jumpin and pull off j.mk->cr.mk->lk fb->ex cancel->crumple->ultra OR hp->pinwheel

This has been really affective against any fb characters and if you do this just once, they’ll freak out about jumping in much at all. As far as a fb war goes, i’d say juri can win if she keeps the others at fullscreen for most of the match… excepting sagat.


#9

Kind of surprising to me. Shotos are the easiest matchups (besides gief) for me so far.

All you need to do is

a) focus fireballs at fullscreen
b) lp counter anticipated fireballs and punish
c) dive kick anticipated fireballs (if they dont fb, all you end up doing is jumping over there fb… jump back, and reset)
d) store an HK fb of your own to quickly knockdown any jumpin attempts
e) mp fb war at full screen, if they’re first to jump they either eat a © or a (d)

Another, slightly more complicated plan is to

a) build 2 stocks of EX meter and store a lk fb
and choose between either:
b) EX counter their jumpin at and then EX dive into ultra
OR:
c) watch for their first far-mid jumpin and as they’re landing, jumpin and pull off j.mk->cr.mk->lk fb->ex cancel->crumple->ultra OR hp->pinwheel

This has been really affective against any fb characters and if you do this just once, they’ll freak out about jumping in much at all. As far as a fb war goes, i’d say juri can win if she keeps the others at fullscreen for most of the match… excepting sagat.


#10

You might be overestimating your skill a bit if you aren’t able to adapt to random tactics. It sounds like you might be suffering from being too predictable. Also, just throwing out pinwheel is a bad move as it is quite unsafe.


#11

best punish to stop shoto scrubs from constantly SRKing is crouching feirce into ex pinwheel or heavy it does so much damage at it stops your opponent from thinking recklessly, also use ur medium fireballs for fireball wars or throw out random neutral jumps from a far so you know when to dive kick through fireballs, use her ex counter to get close if u need to generally its a good thing to use heavy counter on fireballs go up high and dive kick through any fireballs you anticipate.

as for the SRK’S i think the best thing to do is watch your opponent see how he reacts to safe jumps or if he mashes and then anticipate with punishes, lol i been enjoying the ken ryu akuma and sagat match vs my juri one match i really ent liking is rufus


#12

Just thought I’d come here and say, DSP is hilarious… So stupid…

We’ve all had bouts of shouting at our TV like that, but not that bad…

Also on your Shoto problem? Find a Ryu main and spend alot of time fighting him, you’ll learn through trial and error soon enough.


#13

Just thought I’d come here and say, DSP is hilarious… So stupid…

We’ve all had bouts of shouting at our TV like that, but not that bad…

Also on your Shoto problem? Find a Ryu main and spend alot of time fighting him, you’ll learn through trial and error soon enough.


#14

Hello all. Big Nasty Kail here. I just wanted to throw my name in the hat here at the Juri forums as I do plan to be playing as her big time in SSF4. I was a rose player in vanilla, so I’ll try to explain the situation with shoto (that i’ve found), as best as I can.

First off, this is the first time i’ve come to the forums as…I try to play first and learn later. Builds style. My Rose style shines through with my Spider Queen play.

First off, you’re problem with Shoto characters is not of the character, but rather your inability to grasp how your opponent plays. Let me say this clearly. What you’re encountering is Online players and online gameplay. Don’t take this too seriously. There are a lot of bad players with high points. A few friends of mine hit SG in Vanilla and were shocked at the level of gameplay. The highest BP i’ve seen is 5000, which I beat, and I’m low tier.

So you’re having problems with getting in to the mind of your character. First thing i will say is practice your fireball game. I can stay competitive with Ryu no problem from mid screen. Once I see yellow, i know to chill. I havent tried to counter through that, but if you can free sweep.

What do you do when you KD? Well you gotta learn what your opponent does. Walk up on him, stay outside of throw range and see what he does. Did he block? Did he Srk? Did he go for OS tech? Did he do another unsafe normal? Shotos you have to respect their wake up. Fortunately, juri has a pretty nice answer to this. Close up you can KD with your lk fireball and release it so its meaty. See what they do when you walk forward. Do they random Ultra? Do they srk?

What happens when you cross up? Do you eat Srk? Do they go for tech throw? Do they just mash lp? I suggest doing a really deep lk cross up. This SHOULD beat srks. This is the point where your bnb comes into play. I personally like c.lk, s.lk, c.lk xx mk pinwheel. Get fancy though. Test out a 1 frame link. Did it connect? Was it a full combo or did he try and mash out? If he tried to mash out, you know you can force him to do unsafe shit through block strings. Stop you’re block strings short and watch them fly in the air with SRK.

When you pressure with a ground fireball on their wake up, do they back dash? that usually tells me that they dont know how to block and are very nervous about Juri. They’re afraid of pressure. So…pressure them. With rose, i liked waiting for the SRK, staying outside of the range, and FA, bait it and dash back right as they start it. Should be able to sweep.

Your counter is sick here. Be careful, HK counter acn be SRK’ed on a jump in. I personally like the cross over one, Lp. Do it during fireball wars and go for a sweep. If they Srk, dont do it. Ha. Wonder if you can block after it though.

Most people are scared of juri corner pressure from what i’ve seen. Get em in the corner and just…stay outside of poke range and watch them try and get out. If they tatsu, whatever…But if they try and jump out, c.hp. Keep em in there. Now they’re scared.

I play like I play rose. I like to do unsafe shit like c.mk xx lk pinwheel, c.mk xx mk pinwheel. IF the player isn’t good, they will either mash out or just get caught. Either way, the more you know.

Dont worry about win/losses, but small victories in a match. I beat a dudley the other day 100% of life just doing pinwheel loop. He didn’t learn. I taught him something, hopefully.


#15

Or… You can get the lead by health and time them out. And by trying to time them out they should be baited, and possibly even letting themselves stay open. ;D


#16

I’ve been finding success vs shoto scrubs just by staying in their face, but playing defensively. Put a bit of pressure on them then block and bait the SRK and punish with cr.hp xx ex-senpu. Second they wise up and start turtling you can just get more aggressive and go for crossups / overheads / throws. If you aren’t dead on with your links, your going to get hit with mashed DP’s, and your better off using 2-in-1’s like cr.mk xx lk fuhajin (hold).

At mid range you can neutral jump and punish fireballs on reaction with dive kicks. At far range you can jump forward and dive kick on reaction.

If they are using air-tatsu’s as an anti-dive kick then you can either bait it out with quick lk dive kicks and punish them when they land, or if you get the right angle (above them) you can beat out their air tatsu with j.mp and punish with a juggle.


#17

I find cr.hp to be too risky a punish. It can easily whiff, and if you do it too early, you just put them in air recovery. I find cr.mk xx EX Pinwheel to be a more effective punisher, because of the range of the cr.mk.

Also, can someone explain the benefit of cr.mk xx Fuhajin as a punish? I find that if I get the cr.mk, I’d much rather have the extra damage of the Pinwheel.


#18

It’s about mix up. If I use the fireball as a punish I can maintain pressure because of a meaty attack. I try and do things like c mp xx lk fireball (hold), release meaty fadc. Overhead if block, if hit c mk pinwheel.

Also on a kd you can store it for a nice combo with the lk fireball. I like c mk release focus level 2.

Also, with lk fireball spaced right you can get some really nasty corner pressure. It’s like the guile sonic boom pressure.


#19

you can link c.mk xx pinwheel after connecting with lk Fuhajin. More damage than just c.mk xx pinwheel IIRC.


#20

Personally I’ve had mixed success against shotos (especially akuma) but there is something i’ve found works well.

If they’re spamming fireballs at you, cancel a few with your mk Fuhajin (think that’s the projectile) and slowly work your way forward. When you get just beyond sweep range throw an EX fuhajin and immediately jump and either just dive kick or EX dive kick. The EX fuhajin will allow you to chain into the dive kick and from there it’s either an ultra or standard EX pinwheel followup from the wallbounce.

Alternatively just do the lp counter which dashes you forward and pop ultra, if you are at the right spacing they’ll still be in recovery from the fireball.

I’m still kinda scared of trying to punish ryu/ken too aggressively as my execution is far from perfect, but even something basic like letting a hurricane kick go over your head and punishing with C fp can get in the shoto’s head and make them panic a bit.

While I’m here, I have real issues with akuma players who seriously spam air fireballs. The divekick normally doesn’t go far enough to reach them, and if i get in to punish i tend to eat a DP, throw etc. as i land right infront of them.

If i can get in close and get ready to punish then they also seem to just teleport out and jump backwards spamming fireballs, and i can never catch them, even with the dive kick. I’ve tried lp counter to zone closer to them from the air fireballs but i can never quite seem to get up close and personal.

Any tips on akuma would be GREATLY apreciated, as right now the matchups thread is quite bare.

Many thanks.