The Claw Matchup Manual

vega

#1

Hey guys,

So i’ve been browsing the forums for many months now, just taking a look here and there.
Writing down notes trying to improve my Vega.
With little match up experience other than like a year of my housemates Ibuki and other randoms, and with the rather overwhelming pressure online rushdown tactics has on a relatively new Vega player, i decided to write up myself a collection of match-up notes, all in one place.
Heavily a collection of information/advice from users here, but also a fair bit of my own notepad.
I’ve decided the best way to go about improving my Claw, is to minimize the amount of holes i have in my play.

The best way to go about that,
Know what to do at any given moment.

So i’m writing up this match-up note/guide/collection of match up notes people have posted here, as a way of quick access to important information all in one place, whether it be during a fight or in training. (original document is a google doc)

Which you can view here, (Most up-to-date version) (Shoryuken post will likely delay as it is alot more effort to update)

It has a table of contents in which you can click to quickly get to the section you want to get to.

Sorry about the formatting, it forces the page split view, unfortunately that causes a few problems, however if you download it as a pdf,or even view it on an iphone/ipad i believe it’s not quite as noticeable.

It contains/ will contain,

Character matchup strats/notes
Reminders of what and what not to do vs character specifics
An all round, “Know what to do at all times” vs each character.

It’s probably my biggest flaw as a Vega atm, doing stupid shit because i forget which setup to use vs which character.
This will help immensely.

And i figured hey! Might as well share the compiled info of both my own notes and stuff taken from here,
Incase any new (or even intermediate) Vega players don’t quite know what to do in certain situations.

And if anyone wants to add things to the gaps i have, you’re more than welcome to leave a post and share that wisdom :slight_smile:

It’s a huge work in progress i only just started it a night or so ago.
It will be constantly updated.
There is alot missing as it is, as i just started and i’ll need to go through each character and write down everything that comes to mind and everything i can find on the matchups, but hopefully, by the end of it, i’ll end up with the ultimate collection of “Shit what do i do VS this guy” guide for all the Claws :slight_smile:


ULTRA SF4
Dance with the Claw: Vega Match-up Guide/Discussion
Dance with the Claw: Vega Match-up Guide/Discussion
Dance with the Claw: Vega Match-up Guide/Discussion
#2

The Vega Match up Manual

Compiled from the help and information of the many helpful users of the Shoryuken Vega forums.
To name a few, thank you,
Niah, ThekingIGNORED, Jozhear, Vegaman, Gross Indecency, TriasNT, Emersion, Haztlan.

                                                  **Match up notes**

Match-ups.
(Number indicates Vega’s Favor out of 10)
*eg. T.hawk 6 indicates the match up is 6-4 in Vega’s Favor

Compiled from Claw Matchup post data on Shoryuken Forums*

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/DqPanaIUhgcder-84zlaYtskwWkSd1uwqdFZLgZcqaGXS1ZOBjM74ERyhCp-rLVdhJ_7wfV8whUk7VXjdNRcL94XRQGJR9VihBwPXodedXzOWvBqZdqQl5HQzA

Poking

If you find your opponent is focusing your pokes, switch it up with faster strings like,

- St.far lk, cr.mp
- Cr.lp, cr.mp
- Cancel pokes into EX FBA to beat focus

If your footsie game is on point, the opponent will likely,

- Attempt to jump in (anti air him)
- Go for an invincible reversal (block and punish)
- Turtle up (go in with overheads and tick throws)

Counter pokes

- Cosmic heel counter pokes for big damage punishes

Grapplers

- Never safe jump grapplers unless no meter / ultra, Seth included

Dive Kicks

- Against dives, bjMP or jbHP are are a good idea if you can react fast enough to land them.
- FA Dive kicks to put pressure back on them and get some breathing room or go in.
- Walk backwards, far.mp knocks dive kicks.

Matchups *(Not always up to date, google doc link is always up to date however) *

[details=Spoiler]

Vs Abel

Spoiler

Approach
Punish

  • Can interrupt and punish his grab rekka thing as the combo goes from the kick to the punch, interrupt with cr.lk, cr.mk xx EX FBA, as well as with U2.
  • Nj.hk combo punish his attempts to command grab shenanigans
    Counter
  • Abel’s rolls are throw-able and a kara grab should grab most of them
  • His wheel kick can be countered by ST (if you have charge) cr.hp (with claw) and st.hk (without), or jump forward/back HP/HK (claw/no claw) if hit during his roll, before the feet, practice the spacing and timing on all options.
  • Counter his rekka 2nd hit (overhead backhand) on block with lvl1 FA?
    Wake-up options
    Combos/setups

Vs Adon

Spoiler

Approach
Punish

  • Can punish wall kicks with U2
    Counter
  • Jump back cr.mp to counter his stupid jaguar kicks
  • Counter wall kicks with St.HK and Cr.HP and even air grab (easiest the closer you are to him and his back against the wall)
  • If he ex jaguar kicks at about st.mk range (when you are mid N.jump) and you’re feeling ballsy you can NJ air grab him. Can do it from ground too, but incredibly hard to punish, mostly read only, but when you are already in the air it is considerably easier.
    Wake-up options
    Combos/setups

Vs Akuma

[details=Spoiler]Punishes

- punish teleport with Ex FBA 
- punish back jump air fireball with HK slide trade
- Punish demon flip with N.jump air grab 
- Punish full screen fireball with back wall jump, j.Mp, cr.mp xx EX FBA
- Punish teleport / air fireballs with U2[/details]

Vs Balrog

[details=Spoiler]Strat

Start the match with a backaway, or st.HK if he opens with a dash punch.

(If he’s close enough, whiff punish with st.lk combo to EX FBA.

if you use ST, whiff cr.mp and jump hp, make him pay for whiffing a dash punch.

if you focused him, dash, cl.hp to rcf, or ex rcf)

- Space yourself in the range to lvl 2 FA his charge punch
- Poke him and do not allow him to get in on you.
- Try Nj.mk, cr.mk, cr.mp xx ex FBA, apparently it stuffs alot of his moves.
- Punish dash punch (even ex) with ST or st.HK
- Scarlet Terror and st.HK are your best buddies in this matchup, stay at half screen, mix them up and don't let him get in.
- Focus punish if he gets in with light dash punch[/details]

Vs Blanka
Vs Cammy

[details=Spoiler]Strat

- Stay at her st.hk range, using st.lk to counter her options.
- If you are making her block with your normals during neutral ground, you are too close.
- Cr.mp and cr.mk her attempts at walking forward.
- Space yourself so your s.HK hits her jump ins
- Don't let her in
- FA her drill, HK drill hits twice but only at close range
- ST her hooligan or flip/back dash to avoid.
- Get defensive after an EX CS as she will be going for a throw or a block string, find your window to make some space.
- Bait her moves and punish accordingly[/details]

Vs Chun-li
**Vs Cody **
Vs C.Viper
Vs Dan
Vs Deejay

[details=Spoiler]Strat

- Focus once in a while to test his reactions if he can do his dread kicks. it's risky for him to do that because it's punishable. 
- When poking, stick with cr.mk. his slide kick goes under all your normal poke.
- On his wake up, make sure to lock him down with 4 frame safe jumps and/or cr.mk meaty attacks
- You can't reliably safe jump him when he has ex meter, unless you don't press a button.
- You CAN izuna drop to late mp safe jump, but if you are 1 frame late, it'll get stuffed.
- You can meaty wake up him with cr.mk as it beats all his options other than EX machine gun.
- To anti air, either incredibly quick reactions or jb.MP
- Escape his block string after 2x cr.lp with jb.HP 

(It will beat his jump in and overhead him if he tries to walk forward throw.)

- His forward kick puts him at frame disadvantage so on block, punish mix up between Kara throws and pokes to punish.[/details] 

Vs Dhalsim
Vs Dudley
Vs E.Honda

[details=Spoiler]Strat

- U2 is the definite ultra. You can punish mp and hp headbutts with it.
- Punish mp/hp head butts with st.mk / ex.fba and get your wake up tricks going.
- Punish splash with focus (release the focus as soon as he hits your focus cause another one can come or a command grab.)
- Stay right outside of his lp headbutt range
- When your blocking his hundred hands, be ready for his fadc cancel to command grab
- While doing your safe jump mp after a back throw, it will whiff if he does sumo splash and will be on the your other side. Be ready to CH.
- Other than focus, you can punish splashes with ur neutral jump mp. He will get hit right out of it with no trade.
- CH-lk.ST-EX.st combo will easily work on Honda even if he is standing at zero distance. Do it instead of only hk.ST if you have meter enough.
- You should have enough time to use a level 2 focus on the butt splash. try it out in training room for the timing

Anti-Air

- Cr.hp makes marvels at this match as his jump is slow.
B- e ready with your STs too[/details]

Vs El Fuerte
VS E.Ryu

[details=Spoiler]
Blocked hop ex tatsu

    - Cr.mk x2 punish[/details]

VS Fei Long

[details=Spoiler]**Unblockable **

Feilong in the corner, back throw him, immediate wall jump LK. (Follow up with a cr.lp, cr.mp, EX FBA.)[/details]

VS Gen

[details=Spoiler]- Cr.hp works as anti air because he is so low[/details]

Vs Gouken
Vs Guile

[details=Spoiler]- Play the safe-rush down game.
- FADC(with forward dash) and neutral jumps until where his back knuckle or flash kick will reach.
- When you come that close he will feel he should do something to run away to a distance to spam sonic booms again and feel threatened. Use that. Do a neutral jump over his sonic boom, he will think you are jumping in and do a flash kick which will whiff and that thing has terrible recovery.
- If he starts walking forward with light Sonic Boom, EX roll through it, even if he blocks, you're still in.
- Jump in only if you are sure he is doing Sonic Boom.
- Do not ever try to U2 his Sonic Booms, his recovery is too fast unless you have a psychic link to his brain functions.
- Be sure to punish everything whiffing. (This is a match where you score every hit from punishes.)
- Don't just slide a whiffing flash kick.
- Be ready for a jump when you got him in the corner to ST or air-grab him.
- Be good with ex.roll-cr.mp link and connect it whenever you hit with ex.roll.[/details]

Vs Guy

Spoiler
- Fight Guy like you would Cammy.
- Don't give him a window to get in.
- Keep him around his cr.hk distance.
- If he is run stopping alot, go for grabs
- Once he starts run commands, block and punish, either with pokes or ST
- Jump back air throw his overhead?
- When your attacks are blocked, cancel into RCF to push him into the corner.
- If the guy is rushing you down, punish with Cosmic Heel.
- Izuna drop works wonders when he has no meter, don't go for raw izuna's if he does.
- Corner him and go for Kara throw mix ups.
- Bait his reversal and punish accordingly.
- If he is heavily flipping, jump back MP / HP (don't use kicks as those will get grabbed)
- If he goes for the flip very close range, slide underneath and block low. (High chance he will try to catch you with slide)

VS Hakan

[details=Spoiler] - Cr.hp anti air due to him being low

- Punish his oils with FBA and Ultra[/details]

Vs Ibuki

Spoiler
  • Punish EX upkicks with slide or FA
  • If a heavy dasher, punish with FBAs
  • Never sky high claw if she has ultra (or really ever) as she will full punish on block
  • When stuck in the vortex with U2 stocked, you can FA out of a cross up, and you can U2 a front attack, use this to force the Ibuki to respect your wake up.
  • Play the footsie game as you will simply beat out her options, if she tries to counter poke you, fake with lights and go for the counter poke Cosmic heel or St.HK/HP
  • Be careful of her EX reversal on her wake up.
  • If she goes for the EX kunai chip finish, you can either flip it or go for an EX SHC.
  • Be wary of whiffing alot in her face, as ex neck breaker is an incredibly good punish and puts her in great positioning.

VS Juri

[details=Spoiler]Cross up J.HK

- After an Izuna Drop, dash forward, crouch, then immediately ji.HK.

Cross up mixup

- Izuna drop, dash forward, wait a few frames, jump hp.[/details]

Vs Ken
Vs Makoto

[details=Spoiler]- Walkback and crMK are your best friends.
- crMK to zone her and keep her from dashing in your face.
- Walkback is GREAT to use when you are defending (aka stand block).

(This way she can’t keep her pressure for long. Keep in mind that Tsurugis are not dive kicks. Its VERY hard to make one safe on block againt 1f Grabs, which means that most of the time she is negative. stHK whatever she decides to do next.)

- EX ST her jump ins attempts.
- Never be tech or backdash happy against her.[/details]

VS M.Bison

[details=Spoiler]- Punish blocked U1 when in corner with a N.HP, Cl.hp combo (Cl.hp and CH will whiff if used alone) 
- Don't chase him, stay at his max sweep range and punish his 1 of 5 options on getting in

Jump (none of his jump in normals will reach you from that range)
Forward Dash (can punish with pokes and Izuna)
Slide (Neutral jump at max slide range and go for full punish)
Psycho Crusher (nj HK will beat it everytime)
Head Stomp (counter it with J.MP)

- Don't be scared to jump in, his AA isnt great, however don't do anything if he has meter off a blocked jump in, as he is likely to try and EX reversal, punish accordingly. (i believe EX FBA works brilliantly)
- Don't cr.mk as most of his moves beat it out, go for other pokes.
- EX Scarlet Terror beats out his EX PC from full screen (if he tries to get in for pressure) ABUSE THIS
- Slide on his jump ins as he has a very slow jump in, bait a risky catchup.
- At the tip of st.MK range his light scissor will whiff if you do nothing or get stuffed by st.MK if you are throwing it out there.
- Tip of st.MK range, NJ.HK beats everything except sweep.
- Tick throws and frame traps after jump in should be your goto but beware of that ex psycho crusher.
- When you score knockdown with ex fba just run your throw safe jump and frame traps until he is ko'd.
- You have to establish " i know what you want and how to deny it"
- Punish light PC with EX scarlet terror, U1 or U2 or you just NJ the move and crush him on recovery

Cross up J.HK

- After an Izuna Drop, dash forward, wait a split of second, then ji.HK.[/details]

Vs Oni

[details=Spoiler]- Can punish cross up demon slash with U2[/details]

Vs Rose

[details=Spoiler]
- Punish EX. Spiral hard
- Jump soul spark as it’s the slowest projectile in the game
- Treat her non-ex spiral like M.Bisons knee press (don’t go pressing buttons trying to catch her, thats where she frame traps)
- When she activates U2, back away and wait for a fireball, punish with EX Sky Claw.
- Don’t go for raw FBA’s as her df.mk escapes easily.
- Stay slightly out of range of her sliding MK (respond with cr.mk or st.lk, st.lk because it will beat out Spiral, and if you guess wrong and she jumps in, you have air-throw / jump MP / jump HK
- If you notice, they start walking forward to get that slide range, start walking a slight inch and do cr mk for counter hits.[/details]
VS Rufus

[details=Spoiler] - Poke and stay out
- His GT can be punished with st.hp from sweep range mid animation (after the initial twirl, BEFORE the hand)
- Keep him at bay with Nj.HK
- DO NOT allow him to corner you

Cross up mixup

    - Izuna drop, dash forward, wait a few frames, jump hp.[/details]

Vs Ryu

[details=Spoiler]- Don't be jumping in when he has ultra, he will be looking to find windows to DP-Ultra you.[/details]

Vs Sagat

[details=Spoiler]- Block knees high and find a window to get out.
- Patience, punish his fireballs.
- Can't punish whiff DP with cl.HP, cr.mp, go for cl.HP xx rcf instead.[/details]

Vs Sakura
VS Seth

Spoiler
- Can punish wall jump if he goes over you with U2
- Can't punish whiff DP with cl.HP, cr.mp, go for cl.HP xx rcf instead.
- Focus absorb and hit his cr.hp from about half screen.
- Don't neutral jump sonic booms when has ultra 1 stocked in the corner.
- Poke run away poke run away. Obviously everyone is looking for the EX FBA knockdown but my advice would be until he makes that crucial mistake to just make him come after you ... or just walk him into a corner if he is a runner.
- Seth's jumping normals are the best in the game and you will lose all of the air to air trades except if you have taken your chance to air grab him or jf.mp without seeing him jump and he actually jumps by chance. His jf.mp beats any jumping normal flat out. Our jf.mp is the best one we can use, but it also loses %90 of the time.
- Our air game is completely cancelled in this MU.
- If you are gonna jump in the corner, j.mp will be the only normal you will use. 
- Your only AA options will be ST and air grab when he is in the corner. Even if ST trades, he takes bigger damage.
- If he somehow corner jumps to your back, immediately ex.fba to your back wall while he is in the air.

Total win setup

Jump over attack (stomach whirlwind), J.HP, Cl.hp, cr.mp, EX FBA
Dash forward, crouch, jump HP (cross up and safe), cr.mk, cr.mp STUN
Raw ultra or most damaging combo
Dead Seth.

Cross up mixup

    - Izuna drop, dash forward, wait a few frames, jump hp.[/details]

Vs T.Hawk

Spoiler
- After Izuna drop, dash forward, jumping (mk?) (cross up), cr.mk, cr.mp xx EX FBA

Vs Vega
Vs Vang
Vs Yun

Spoiler
- Stay in the cr.mk to st.lk range. (Cannot footsie you and you can react to jump ins)
- St.hk to keep them grounded after a block string or empy zone dive kick (risky)
- Cr.lp into frame traps/grabs
- Against dives, bjMP or jbHP are are a good idea if you can react fast enough to land them.
- FA Dive kicks to put pressure back on them and get some breathing room or go in.
- Walk backwards, far.mp knocks dive kicks.
- Don't grab tech as much, do it after light attacks.

Safe jump

- Back throw, Jump in late MP. (follow with cr.mk or grab) (shotos can crouch under mp)
- ST, Back dash, Jump in late MP (follow with cr.mk or grab) (shotos can crouch under mp)

(If they get smart and tech the grab, go for a jump hp, cl hp, rcf frame trap.)

Vs Zangief

Spoiler
- Zangiefs like to jump then grab, back dash and punish (but be on the look out on which aerial he uses. If he uses a light attack its a tick, if its deep though you can back dash and be safe. If its heavy and not deep its most likely a tick or followed by a cr.lp xx lariat/ spd, if its deep then its going to be a block string)
- Poke him here and there and run away. St.MK and Hk are great against Gief. Jump back HP works wonders on his wakeup if the player is blocking or trys to throw out something. You just have to be really patient against a good Gief and don't rush in.
- Far st.hp and st.mp will break his st.mp
- Don't always poke, restrain yourself and expect jumps, knock him out with neutral hk or jump back hp/mp/mk.
watch him trying to get in with st.hk, cr.hk and green hand, it will whiff you ( if you space yourself to be as far as st.mk range) so you can punish with cr.mk combo
- don't ever use rfc unless it's the tip of the lp rfc, or you have super and you know he will spam spd after a rfc
- watch out for his knee attack because neutral hk will whiff and he gets a free grab.
- once you anti aired him with neutral hk, be ready for another jump in, just in case, or you can st.mp when he lands
- after knockdown, you can go for a cr.mk combo or instant overhead. watch out, instant overhead can be countered by him blocking and then ex green hand, if he knows that. if he's smart enough to always block up and you don't want to risk being spd'ed by doing a low, you could just jump back and see he's reaction. if he green handed, you can catch him with j.hk on your way down
- his ex green hand fadc back dash can be punished, but be careful, he can let the focus go, ready your ultra if you have charge, he has no escape. watch out if he has 3 bars, so you can prepare yourself for either an ultra punish or a normal punish, it's -9 on block. if you have go like 1 frame punishes, you can just go for them fancy ex rcf combos
- when he knocks you down with a spd, choose between focus back dash, jump back hp or kara throw. this is how i play gief, you can just block if you want.
- kara grab > greenhand > focus back dash > spd > kara grab
- gief st.mp > everything except focus back dash
- EX FBA Punish his Lariats
- if you going to safe jump him, he can ex spd. you can counter with a low air grab, it stalls you in the air, so his ex grab whiffs. ( i wouldn't want to safe jump him if he has ex, but it's an option if you like to play that way
- Cosmic Heel to instant back jump HP avoids his SPD, however normals will hit you if he knows what you are doing.
- far mk and far hp is usually what i go for. cr.mp is a bit too short for me. i try to stay out of his closing in tactics and staying that far is great. if he's in a bit close where he can counter poke you with st.mp, use cr.mk. beats it 80-90% of the time, and you can go for full combo after that

#3

Wow, could this be the beginning of a new matchup compendiuM? Will def. read it but before I’d like you to add a “the” before my name (and change the “k” into a small letter). Thanks for mentioning me anyway, for what? :wink:

Some things to add out of my head: Ibuki: Block/let it whiff her wake up EX “up jump kick” (you know what I mean) and then focus. Worst case is a blocked focus if she does nothing and best case is a croumple if she throws a kunai mid-air.

Edit: not to derail the thread already: what Haztlan (as always :wink: said sounds like a better advise. I wait and see what else you already have wrote up before making more suggestions. But so far: good work!

Juri/Seth/Rufus post FBA cross-ups: replace “wait a few frames” with "crouch ". the visual indicator of the animation helps (me anyway) with the correct timing.

Against Balrog, play with sound one. His “one” turnpunch is safe, the other ones, most likely “two” are not. From the shouted number you have enough time to prepare yourself accordingly


#4

Good Ibukis will generally mash backdash after the EX Kazegiri and then ultra your focus whiff… slide under the kunai and punishing with crMK crMP FBA in case of kunai is safer. If she doesn’t throw the kunai… well, you got that 110/121 damage and a shitty knockdown.


#5

@ star
If i could, I’d like to compile all Claw match ups, for a total catchup compendium yes :slight_smile:
That would be awesome.
I’ve been talking with Niah a lot lately and apparently there aren’t many ‘all in one place’ match ups for Vega, and i really need to learn a lot of match ups and what to do/not to do, so this definitely seems like the best way, and a bonus, share that information around :slight_smile:
Oh and sorry, i’ll get right on changing that name error, i’ve just been calling you kingignored for short with my housemate haha (although it might be a bit more effort to change the name on the matchup chart)
Oh and the thanks is for the information you (and others) have shared over time here, without information like that, the time to learn things would be years instead of weeks/months :slight_smile:

@ Haztlan and the ibuki stuff,
Yeah i know that matchup really really well haha
She is pretty much all i ever play against day to day :slight_smile:
I generally go for the slide as everything else gets punished and he doesn’t throw the kunai anymore as he knows that is not safe.

@FBA setups,
Ohh awesome, the crouch works with those ‘wait a few frames’ setups? definitely putting that down.

@ Balrog,
What’s this about “one” “two”? I play with japanese voices. He shouts numbers? haha


#6

He does, so you know the level of charge of his TAP. As you know, TAP does charge by keeping a button pressed during a certain time. Levels one or two don’t do much more damage than regular dash punches, but the last ones (final level is 10 i think, with around 50 sec charge) can deal as much as 560 dmg in a single blow…

I’ll add that it’s a good idea to summary MU knowledge in one single point, indeed. =)

But that work is huge, what you have done is to be seen as the starting point of it. At the end, it would be nice if one could find, for each character :
— General approach/effective footsies
— Punishable moves
— Counters (move that you can counter without blocking)
— Wake-up options
— Character specific combos/setups

If each one of us shares knowledge (you can gather it just by reading daily posts actually), I believe with time this could be achieved. =)


#7

@ TriasNT
Absolutely, that is most certainly the ideal outcome of this.

I wonder, given a few Vega’s like Emersion have put their guides on hold, would the same reasoning behind it also be perhaps a reason not to do this matchup guide just yet, or would you think that matchups mostly don’t change?
I was thinking about it, your list of what you’d like at the end of this is, is actually exactly what i want to have for each character in their matchup section.
Thinking about SF4 and earlier versions of SSF4, little things change here and there, some tools become less useful and others more, but all in all the play style stays quite similar.
I think if there were serious attention paid to the patch notes when USF4 is released, it would be rather simple to go by character to character and fix the changes that affect this match up guide.

What do you think?

(ps. i think i may steal your,

  • Approach
  • Punish
  • Counter
  • Wake-up options
  • Combos/setups
    For what to look for to fill under each character tab ^_^, it fits so perfectly)

#8

for the dash crouch setup on juri/seth and rufus, i don’t like to crouch because that’s giving it away that it will crossup. i rather to not know if it did or not. cause if you don’t how will your opponent? if you want to change the timing to not crossup, your opponent can see that setup and saw you change something.


#9

You are right Niah, but I thought you should mention a real cross up also if there is one (and not just an ambiguous one). Esp. since the cross-up is srk-proof.

Also I think there is a lot of work here to do for you, Daijo, if you really want to cover all match ups. I guess that is the reason why francis, pedovedjo, jozhear, and maybe emersion all stopped after the general Vega information. So before you go into that structured path Trias mentioned, maybe it would be good to gather all information in the spoiler brackets first. To have them all in one place. If you still have energy after that, you can filter.

Also I would ignore the fact that Ultra is near as of now. If information will be obsolete then it is easier to update the existing information rather than wait and start from scratch.

Good luck :slight_smile:

Edit (as always :wink: I’d like to change the MU number in my chart to Abel: 4,5, Viper: 5, Dudley: 6, Sagat: 5 please. After al lot more (online) matches since I posted these the remaining ones are still pretty much true for me.


#10

@ Niah and Star
About the cross up, perhaps i should put down both something like
’Crouch for cross-up setup, wait frames instead for ambiguous’

@ Star
Yeah there is definitely alot of work ahead, however it’s kind of fun :slight_smile:
I’m not writing down a guide or anything, i’m just analyzing vega vs characters, that makes it alot simpler.
I look for components in the match up i’m missing (through the format trias suggested), and see what i’m missing.
I think personally i’d rather do it that way, as all in one big mess as some of it is, makes it difficult to sort through and unappealing to browse through.
Where as this way, i can see exactly what’s missing, as can anyone who browses through.

The main problem i’m facing atm is, my google docs is clean and going good, but transferring it to the shoryuken post is a lot more effort for something that may not be worth it?

Either way though, this is as much a learning tool for myself as it is a teaching tool for others / reminder tool.
If i want to get better as Vega, i need to take notes anyway haha
Google docs is easy enough for that :slight_smile:

EDIT: Oh and yes, i’ll get on re-doing the chart to update your name (if i can get it to fit) as well as your matchup changes :slight_smile:


#11

I just browsed through the google doc and I think this format is even better. You can always update this thread at a later date.

Keep up the good work!


#12

Does anybody know the C.Viper matchup? I just saw a video of Jozhear having quite the tough time against Latif.
The video was perhaps a little old, but i can’t be sure.
From what i could gather it seems your defense needs to be really spot on.
Obviously with such a high level match, it was a bit hard to read what to punish/approach due to the general lack of huge mistakes.

I’m currently going through the matchup forums that have been previously posted, but just thought i’d pop the question here incase i don’t come across Viper :slight_smile:

@ Star
Oh and thanks :slight_smile:
I’m really happy with the way it’s turning out, i think this will be super easy to read as a user, and also easy to edit for myself :slight_smile:


#13

Right now I would say Haztlan has the best Vega from all the active members on this board and more importantly the most knowledge in theory (sorry Trias :wink: So your best bet for specific questions is him. Ask him directly. Would also drag him away from arguing with scrubs in other threads about the viability of Vega in low level play :wink:


#14

Don’t be. Meteo2, Haztlan, Niah, Galahand, Golfguden, Emersion and yourself… the list of experts is too long to consider myself as one of those. I’m far for being the most knowledgeable here. =)


#15

Well i guess you’re the most creative information supplier Vega board member here with your very well done Vega tut videos on youtube with good catchy music along with the funny Vega faces that I do enjoy. It’s nice to have someone show and tell you something at the same time in a visual aspect.


#16

@ TriasNT and Th3 JoK3R J
Absolutely, tbh all valid input is just as appreciated and respected as any others.
Especially when put in such digestible format as Trias has done with his videos :slight_smile:
It has all been ridiculously helpful.

Btw if anyone finds any errors or more useful information/setups/etc in any of the information in the google doc, you’re more than welcome to let me know.


#17

T

Thx guys. That kind of appreciation is always encouraging. ^^


#18

The crossup setup Izuna > dash >wait split sec > J.hp works fine on Adon also. If you time it perfectly it hits him if he wakes up crouching or jumping too.
Reversal uppercut goes opposite side but a delayed auto correct one will hit Vega.


#19

nope, not good on adon, if he blocks crossup, it’s a free grab for him. walk back 3 squares or so will break his reversal dp but loses to delayed dp. for adon, i just go for the usual 4 frame setup

thing is, it crosses up on a few, but out of the few, those that can’t make the crossup whiff are the best ones. currently are juri, seth and rufus. i also forgot to mention el furete. he also can’t walk under it.


#20

If Adon blocks crossup the j.hp gets blocked doesn’t whiff for him to grab. J.hp has to be pressed with a bit of tight timing to shut down all his options though (crouch, walk forward).