YOU’RE ALIVE :o
Thanks! I think the only major thing you may have missed was Caveman’s air grab unblockable setup. Are you getting back into Marvel?
YOU’RE ALIVE :o
^ I honestly haven’t touched Marvel since… February? But since I can’t find people to play SFxT with me, I’m gonna try to get back into Marvel. Not competitively really, but you know… I like hitting buttons. lol
That air grab unblockable seems pretty sick too! If it’s really that reliable, MODOK won’t even need to use meter if he can just go for that all day? MODOK for Phoenix teams perhaps?
Well, it’s certainly nice to have you back working on dok tech
The air grab unblockable is really reliable on most characters in most situations. A couple characters with invincibility on their aerial hypers can get out (Sentinel, Super Skrull). Some assist calls ruin the setup, though that usually just ends up giving you two characters for you to combo. You also can’t grab really small characters when they neutral tech, but usually they have low health anyway (perhaps doing :f::h: at a higher height? But that might allow them to escape with a forward tech). A few characters can beat the follow up j. (like Vergil’s j.:l:)… but if you block that, they get hit by cr. and you can get the combo. But for the most part, it’s really stupid good and underused.
Thank you for putting all of this together LTP. I know how thankless this type of thing can be, but I really appreciate the time and effort you put into it.
Thanks! For better or worse, I’ve had time for it as an unemployed (unfortunately) college student.
Wow, such a fine job, LTP. Are you planning to add more stuff to your guide in the future? Because we could use some extended match-up tips, and I also think that a MODOK guide should definitely have a section dedicated to how to play him as a zoning/defensive character.
Your guide seems to focus on using MODOK as a get-in character, and I feel that the truly successful MODOK players are the ones who exploit both his combos AND his zoning tools. As a long-time zoning MODOK, I could lend a hand with tips for such a section.
Thanks! I wasn’t planning much, but I did notice that I didn’t go over team construction too well and how MODOK fares as point, 2nd, and anchor. As for matchup tips… if you mean specific matchups instead of particular archetypes, I’m trying to avoid that for now since that would probably double the length of this tutorial . But I will still gladly add them if you want to add any :), I just won’t be actively working on it… for now. I tried to capture both MODOK’s zoning and rushdown games, since I too think both are needed, though it is of course weighted by whatever matchup you are facing. Actually, reading back at what I wrote for the neutral game, I don’t think I mentioned his rushdown game more than once (since that is mostly covered in the mixup and blockstring sections) and most of it does seem to be the slow push to the corner style zoning game: you put stuff on screen while slowly advancing (“aggressive” zoning) until they either risk getting close and are at a disavantage (rushdown time) or you push them into the corner (also rushdown time). There aren’t very matchups you want to go all out zoning in, and it’s pretty much the same neutral game as described, just with a lot more zoning and only a little, very safe rushdown pressure when you are given the opportunity. I guess I should have mentioned bomb usage, stopping jump ins with :l: cube (done in a previous section), and perhaps zoning patterns would be helpful, though one should never fall into them and they are usually assist based. The tutorial as a whole will probably always feel like its catering to a more rushdown style, but that’s because it is almost inherently more complicated. You can’t really apply mixups, combos, etc in zoning, or at least not as much as a rushdown game. But if you have any additional suggestions for MODOK’s zoning and/or neutral game, post them and I’ll add them
Wow you Know I thought I knew alot about Dok but this just intimidates me. Good stuff ltp. I do have questions though. Can you just block low during the Caveman unblockable vortex? I left the dummy on block low and it blocked both the slim and overhead? Idk. I don’t think I’m doing it right. Also I can’t seem to convert off throw when the opponent doesn’t tech. Also some rare days when I practice the set up, I keep getting hbr. Maybe I’m doing it too fast? I sometimes just back throw. since the simple bnb I always do will corner carry.
The dummy cheat blocks
The Marvel 3’s A.I can block slime+overhead is only blockable by the computer(perfect frame by frame inputs), not by a true human being. The reason why it’s unblockable is that a human can not actually block a high+low at the same frame.
You should trying testing the unblockable on yourself by recording MODOK performing the unblockable setup, and let MODOK force you to block his high/low unblockable. It much easier to gauge rather or not a human can avoid this setup.
I knew I couldn’t trust the dummy. About how much frames do u have to react to block the overhead. Technically if I got hit with this, then do I must block low first when I hit the ground then high? I just move quickly? Anyways Ill try it out
Technically I think you have to block low first but it will be really difficult since it is a meaty unblockable and 1F blocking would be required most likely. Here is how I understand the setup, which may be false:
After breaking an airthrow in marvel 3 you are invincible to all attacks for a certain amount of frames UNLESS you perform an action (attacking or movement). Because of this, on the way to the ground after the airthrow break the opponent will not get hit out of the air by the slime (or j.M) allowing the slime to hit low and enabling the unblockable setup. Likewise, the slime will hit immediately upon them reaching the ground which is why you cannot hard tag out of this setup and why I think you would have to block low first.
If this is true then the setup will always go like this:
-If they simply try to block, you will get the unblockable. It even works on shorties like wolvie and morrigan that can normal crouch airdash j.m (justice)
-If they try to mash out, with the right normals they can trade with MODOK and you will not get a combo. Or you will hit them airborne super low to the ground which can be difficult to confirm off of.
-Use invincible air supers and fast air ok DPs like chun-li’s to escape.
-Use assists after the tech to mess with the spacing or put hitboxes on the screen to threaten modok.
To eliminate all possibility of escape except for invincible air supers adding an assist will control all of the other options. For example, with DOK/Dorm/Doom you can call dorm+cr.m, airdash, airthrow and if they break the following will happen:
-opponent is invincible to the assist attack so they will still have to land into the slime unblock and cant try to pushblock to stay airborne
-If they mash on attack, they become vulnerable and will get hit by the dark hole before reaching MODOK
-If they call an assist it walks into the dark hole for a happy bday (havent tested them all)
-Be prepared to do your MODOK/Doom bnb after they get hit which will kill everyone.
This works with many assists but try to find some with lots of active frames like eye of agamotto, dark hole, beams, etc that last long enough to catch their mash attempts and assist attempts while being easy to hit confirm off of. With my DDD team doing my typical j.L bnb pre-airthrow I do ~400-500k depending on assists and with the dok/doom follow-up its like 600k before super. With a HBR ender the whole sequence does 1.2-1.3m and you can DHC into ball super(combos if they survived somehow) and tag modok back in for welcome mixups with the ball super or charge spells with dorm and still have a net gain of 1 meter and 1-2 cubes. Please use this technique.
Disclaimer: I dont test stuff on the midgets/ammy so I am not sure what will work on them…fuck rocket raccon.
sorry for the double post, but since Justin3201 brought this up I have been meaning to mention it. To everyone that accidentally gets HBR or whatever when doing the cr.M~flight stuff, do your flight motion qcb,f+s. This makes it much harder to mess up but not foolproof. I dont think it is necessary for this reset (you just doing the motions too fast) but this is essential for some extended combos like (j.L, cr.L, M,)[cr.H, airdash j.M]x3,S, sjMMHS, cr.M, flight j.H, add S, sj.H, L blaster, add j.S. In general MODOK can do some interesting things by buffering his flight commands that are worth noting because his flight is soo fast.
For the unblockable setup I tap the airdash… It will prvent accidental super, bbut is pretty hard on the hands heh
You can also do qcb,f+s, F to get an instant flight~airdash. Its one of the examples of buffering I was talking about
I was wondering how you found that relaunch to be more consistent… I’m going to have to try that flight buffer stuff out now.
I like that bnb because you can land any starter and still get the relaunch. The combos that have raw cr.M, S for the relaunch are affected by hitstun a bit more and may whiff so you have to adjust the combo at times especially when starting with j.L. In the end though, do what you are comfortable hitting in a match because hitting your combos is better than trying to trying to land some swag for BRODOK points. I am not above doing S MMHS otg super if I means i can win.
Same, but I mostly play this game to do obscenely long combos lol and just learning all the random stuff this character can do (and I mostly play online, where I don’t care about winning). And I’m not quite getting that relaunch. Either I fly and get an :h: cube, or I fly and do a battering ram. How are you getting the j.:h: out?
And a quick note about the air throw unblockable setup: with some assists, it seems that you can do a true unblockable air throw (ie. Marlinpie’s incoming air throw setup with Viper and Ammy). With the dummy set to tech throws, I managed to get a throw every now and then using Chun’s LL assist during the unblockable air grab setup.
If you are getting an H cube you may not be ending the flight command with forward. One way to tell the difference is by doing the two different motions while plinking H to note the outcome:
qcb+S~H should be flight mode and an instant H Cube
qcb,f+S~H should just be flight mode with no moves buffered
When you do the latter you dont have to wait for the cube buffer window to go away, only the recovery from flight mode so you can get the fastest possible inputs after flying. I hope I explained that correctly.
I have noticed the throw guard break situation a few times as well during the unblockable reset. It keeps getting better and better the more i use it, lol. Maybe we can add some assist variations to your tutorial to show the full reset in action to give people a better idea of how it works. If not I definitely will add one to my YT channel tomorrow hopefully.
I’m pretty sure that qcb,f+S~H will still give you flight into H-Cube if done fast enough.
The idea is to put in the forward direction to take up more time and allow the qcb window to expire (and to allow for easier command forward dashes I guess), but it doesn’t actually completely prevent you from executing the qcb special after flight. As long as the window is still active and the game remembers a recognized motion, and you hit that button, you’re gonna get that special.
Speaking of overlapping buffer windows, has anyone been able to do [flight~cancel flight] by doing qcb+S~S? I guess a single special move can’t be buffered into itself?