The New E.Honda Match-up Thread!

e-honda

#1

Two very important notes about playing Honda to keep in mind.

You’re opponent doesn’t lose to E.Honda, he loses to you.

It is not what they profess but what they practice that makes them good

Since the owner of the old thread doesn’t post on our boards anymore I’m taking the opportunity to throw all of the important information on the Front page so we don’t lose anymore information in that word jumble of a thread.

E.Honda Match-ups (Will revise later)
Feel Free to PM me information that you think should be posted up on a certain subject and I’ll get it up there.

E.Honda Videos
If you find good vids also shoot me a line and I’ll make sure their up if I haven’t gotten em already!

E.Honda W/e

08/20/09
Updated Zangief and Akuma Match-up.
Added Fuji vs Akimo Video
Cammy information has been updated.
Boxer information revised

8/21/09
Edited and cleaned out M-Z
Re-worked Sakura and Claw piece.
Cut out the old bullshit from gief and only lets whats somewhat useful.

8/22/09
Added 5 more videos.

8/24/09
Added M.Bison match-up information

8/25/09
Updated Sagat match-up with more current information.

8/26/09
Added Bruce D’s Abel Info. (Douche :D)
Added Telepathic’s Ex-HHS Faq

8/28/09
Added Pieguys Chun Match-up
Added Boxer Match-up

8/31/09
Added Pieguy’s Super Sim and Rufus Match-up.

9/2/09
Added PG’s Guile/Rufus and Ryu Match-ups.
Cleared out Frames due to the lack of space and me not grabbing enough spots. :rofl:


#2

Character Match-Ups A-K

Match-Ups! Will be revised more later

Honda is not beyond repair in this game his normals and specials all do so much damage, try hitting someone with a couple j.HP or headbutts and the game takes a sudden 180. He also has great mixups on wakeup. He can trade with pretty much anyone and still come out on top in the end. All it takes is a little patience. If you want to jump in and kick then trip ryu and ken are more your type.

He does struggle with crossups, but only if they are done perfectly. Otherwise, a well time FA, j.HP, headbutt, ochio, buttslam or even super or ultra can spell disaster for a crossup scrub.

He does struggle a little with fireballs but again only if someone amazing is doing them. If you close the distance with FA and neutral jump + forwardHP rather than jumping straight into anti-airs you will find you have a lot of tools at your disposal.

Plus, there is nothing like imagining what the guy on the other side of the match looks like when he got beaten by a beastly fatso like honda.

Abel:

[details=Spoiler] 6/4 Abel. Lookin for someone are ya? Have you tried talkin to the cops?

  • Roll>>Tornado throw is a popular scrub tactic. Unfortunately tornado>ochio, so you either have to throw him mid-roll, or if you KNOW he is going for it, jump up and hit him as he is whiffing it on the way down.
  • HP and MP headbutt are punishable by rekka combo on block, all headbutts lose to ultra (so dont do one when hes standing there buffering down, forward, down, forward), and I BELIEVE that HP headbutt is punishable by ultra on block (but someone plz confirm)
  • Rekka combo (the 3 hit mixup thing) is punishable by ex-headbutt after you block the 2nd hit, and by ultra if you block the 3rd.
  • Careful about blocking down on wakeup, Abels flip kick is an overhead, and a meaty one will get you a lot of the time. Note that any headbutt can beat the flip kick once its started, but the headbutt is damn slow and a meaty flip will catch you unless you do EX-HB.
  • You can meaty abel to death on wakeup because he doesnt have any good reversals. All he can do is roll. Once you train him to roll, then watch for it and punish accordingly.
  • Dont abuse nj.HP too much here, if he clips you with the end of his elbow (cr.HP) youre eating ultra
  • If you want to know what you SHOULDNT do vs. Abel, search youtube for Mr.SNK vs. Juicebox Abel [/details]

Akuma:

[details=Spoiler] 5/5 You’ve got a great fighting stance! Low center of gravity is the way to go!

  • Akumas super and ultra lose out to headbutt or any jumping attack which you can do on reaction.
  • You can FA the second hit of his Fw :hk: for some nice damage since Honda is a shorter character.[/details]

Balrog Boxer:

[details=Spoiler] 5/5 Between your hooks and your counters, color me impressed! *** I want to say 6/4 because of HHS abuse.***

  1. BLOCK LOW and then WAIT FOR THE OVERHEAD. Overheads have visually discernible animations due to their pursuit property so you can see that shit coming for days. Just keep reminding yourself block low, watch for overhead. Otherwise you’ll get swept with rh and dash lower over and over.
  2. Overhead and Dash Swing Blow are armor breakers along with tap. Overhead is 120 dmg, dash swing blow is 100 (weak shit) and tap is (don’t fuck with it).
  3. This fight is all about life leads and patience. You have life lead, he comes to you. You don’t have life lead, you go to him.
  4. How you fight rog depends on range. Three ranges to be at, c.lp range, s.hk/chop range and outside of his jab dash punch range. I personally hate c.lp range cause I can’t tech throws like japs can.
  5. Do not jump into balrog with down charge. If he’s crouched down, do not jump at all within half a screens range from him cause fp headbutt has retarded horizontal range.
  6. Jab dash punch’s startup is probably close to the limit of human reaction time. If you’re a really sharp person, you can use s.lp to stuff every dash punch clean. Soon as you see him move, you’re pressing the s.lp and getting the counter-hit. But problems with this are ex moves and tap.
  7. Tap has to be punished with s.fp. Soon as you see him do the turn around, press s.fp and you’re guaranteed the counter-hit due to chop’s ridiculously long active frame window
  8. Whiff punish balrogs dash punches with s.fp. Constantly weave in and out of jab dash punch range and get ready to punish the ones that don’t hit you (watch Ii Desu Ketsu Bat vs Aojiru Guile).
  9. Blocked overheads should be always punished with Oicho
  10. On ex rush uppers you duck, late os tech
  11. You can cr.:lp: him out of his Normal Dash Punches.
  12. You can also throw him out of his Dash Punches if timed right
  13. He can punish :mp: and :hp: Torpedo with :lp: Dash punch and can punish your :lp: Torpedo with his Super
  14. Try and bait out Dash punches when your up close with a :lp: Torpedo then punish
  15. After a knock down feel free to Jump in on Boxer, his only option to get out is Ex-Dash punch and if you cross him up he has to block it due to his headbutt starting in 13 frames
    End Story: Get meter and a life lead and kiss the round good-bye. This works for the Boxer and Honda player.
    [/details]

Blanka:

[details=Spoiler] (6/4 Honda) Talk about your way out moves! Show me that again, will ya?
[/details]

C.Viper:

[details=Spoiler] (6/4 Honda) Talk about weird fighting styles, you got gadgets up the whazoo, doncha?
[/details]

Cammy:

[details=Spoiler] (7/3 Honda) You’re one skinny chick! You might wanna look into eating more than once a week
6-4 Honda
After EVO, I thought everybody would stop sleeping on Cammys potential, but it seems like people still underrate her. I dont know why though. Maybe its because they havent played a good Cammy? Well, Ive definitely played against a good Cammy, arguably as good if not better than Sanfords Cammy (although Sanford deserves the respect he gets), and I gotta say, shes one dangerous bitch. The reason shes so dangerous isnt so much about her damage, but more because of her mix-up. Shes like Sakura, but better, and with much safer options.

Cannon Spike: Cammys form of SRK, its invincible (full body) for long enough that you just dont mess. It beats all headbutts pretty clean except for early EX Headbutt and it does a shitload of damage. Also, it has very good push away that makes it unpunishable by a lot of the cast, but not Honda. On block you can usually squeeze in a fp headbutt for a good chunk of life.

Spiral Arrow: Cammys form of blanka ball or headbutt, but it hits low and is highly unsafe on block usually. However, if she hits you with the tip of her foot, shes perfectly safe and can often retaliate or block. It is cancelable on the first hit so Cammys can purposely throw an unsafe arrow and then FADC it into throw or Cannon Spike. It beats all headbutts clean except for the startup of ex headbutt which has full body invulnerability for a few frames. EX goes through fireballs, useless info for Honda match-up.

Spin Knuckle: it sucks

Hooligan Combo: This shit is weird. Its an airborne attack that throws you on contact if youre standing or if you jump. It can be ducked, but not when youre waking up? WTF?!? Apparently, when you wake-up, youre forced to stand so yeah, I still dont know what to do against it if youre waking up w/o meter. Maybe lk splash? If you do have meter, ex headbutt it when its close or you can probably c.mp/c.lp it. If she chooses to, Cammy can also come out of hooligan with a low slide attack. Again, hits LOW and cannot be fast recovered. If she hits you with a meaty slide thats blocked, its safe. If she hits you with it in corner, she gets a free cannon spike (dumb bitch). Ton of mix-up after she hits you with this since you cant mash and get up quickly.

Cannon Strike: Cammys dive kick, this shit takes a ton of work to use but has retarded amounts of mix-up. Because Honda has such a slow jab and short, this thing is hell to deal with because it forces you to guess the tech and can be done tiger kneed to punish tech attempts. This is why I hate the up-close game with Cammy. In general, if you can ex headbutt or lk splash to avoid guessing the tech, Id do it cause if you dont, Cammy can do tiger kneed cannon strike, ex cannon strike, ultra or tiger kneed cannon strike, s.fp xx cannon spike, fadc cannon spike (350 dmg, WTF!)

Things to watch for:
-Cammys jump in of choice is roundhouse. Its a really odd looking jump-in where she spreads her legs (aaahhh yeahhh, no j/k) and kicks you with a really horizontal hitbox. I have ridiculous amounts of trouble AAing this with chop but it can be done if you stick the chop out pretty early. Problem is she can bait chops with cannon strike. After a jump-in roundhouse that connects, she can do throw mix-up or c.lk, c.lp, c.lk xx spiral arrow. Ill explain why eating spiral arrow sucks really badly, shortly.

-Cammys cross-up is j.lk and honestly, it sucks against people with good reversals. Honda however has really shitty cross-up reversals, which is all bad. After a connected or blocked j.lk from Cammy, she can do nothing and bait your lk splash, she can c.lk, c.lp, c.lk xx SA you, she can tick throw you, or she can tiger knee cannon strike to bait your tech. In general, you dont want to get crossed up. Burn meter or FA dash to avoid having to guess. You want to play the mid screen battle against cammy and make her come to you.

OKI options that make Cammy annoying:

-If you just got hit with a Spiral Arrow and got knocked down, sucks for you. Right after getting spiral arrowed, cammy can jump up for a tiger kneed cannon strike that is completely ambiguous to block and looks ridiculously odd. If she spaced it right, you completely cant tell if you will in fact get crossed up and honestly, unless you training mode and test it for yourself, youre pretty much at the mercy of the Cammy player. If you ex headbutt, you get hit in the ass, but at least youre airborne so that she cant do any follow-ups.

-If you get forward thrown, this again, sucks for you. Because you cant fast recovery, just like you cant fast recovery after eating hooligan slide, you now have to deal with another ambiguous cross-up. This cross-up is so ambiguous, most Cammy players cannot even tell which side theyre attacking from. They just tiger knee cannon strike next to you and stick out the meaty and hit confirm to low forward xx SA. Dumb right? Well at least with this OKI setup, you can usually lk splash to trade for some damage if you have charge. If you dont do this, youll probably eat a good 230ish damage combo and once again, have to deal with the ambiguous tiger kneed cannon strike.

Important Notes about this match-up:
-The only way I beat Californias best Cammy, VasAznIon is by jumping around (but not into). I keep her boxed out with nj.fp, jump back roundhouse, headbutts. I burn meter to avoid OKI situations and dont splash much cause Cammy has a ridiculously good FA and dash (both ways, front and back).

-Spiral Arrow/Ultra punishes FP headbutt only so you can do a mp headbutt which looks like fp headbutt, followed by an ex headbutt for a free counter-hit bait. Cammys SUPER punishes ALL headbutts. Shit is lightning fast.

-Cannon Strike might seem like it has a ton of hitstun and blockstun, but in reality, it has very little block stun. You can backdash sometimes and then jump away to escape but watch for the spiral arrow punishes.

-Her throw range is bad (.75). After c.lk, c.lp she usually has to inch forward a hair before she can throw you so keep that in mind.

-If she ever walks up to you with 2 meters and ultra, shes probably baiting a tech so that she can spike, fadc, ultra you . It does respectable dmg, probably 300-400 depending on meter. I prefer eating the throw rather than guessing the spike, fadc.

-Punish blocked spiral arrows with oicho instead of headbutt due to better startup

-If you are at max screen range, occasionally whiff an oicho to make her come to you, but realize that she can cover ground retardedly fast with hooligan and hk spiral arrow.

Heres some videos, not the Honda match-up unfortunately, where you can see a few oki setups in action. Watch for the mix-up following spiral arrows, throws and hooligans. Shits nasty. VasAznIon (Allen) has a lot of new setups that most of America bit off of so expect more annoying shit after WestCoastWarzone.

[media=youtube]f40AyWUuulY[/media]
[media=youtube]wIGpUUWuxW4[/media] (chois too good. Damn fireballs)
[media=youtube]bVEdz0SrAhk[/media]
[media=youtube]kg9oYsVNf0o[/media]
[/details]

Chun-li

[details=Spoiler] (6/4 Chun) You may be fast, but your kicks feel like mosquito bites to me

  1. Don’t headbutt when she has ultra meter unless you know she has no charge or it’s in combo. She can punish all headbutts, even :lp: and ex on block.
  2. S.:hp:, c.:lp: and s.:hk: all trade with her sweep which leaves u knocked down but it’s a worthy trade
  3. Do not walk into her s.:hk:, it’s difficult as fuck to see and kicks Honda in the face for free
  4. Tech as many throws as you can. Don’t panic, she hits like a little girl but has a pretty good throw range. I’ve seen Akimo tech 8 throws from a chun in a single round.
  5. Do not jump fireballs that have been out for a significant amount of time. She will jumping fierce you as air to air every time. If you have to jump a fireball, do it from nearly full screen or right as its leaving her hands. If you jumped it when it’s leaving her hands and you’re far away from her, stick out j.:hk: early. When you’re jumping it as the fireballs leaving her hands and your close, use j.:mp:, j.:lk: or j.:lp: (I prefer mp but :lk: and :lp: have weird ass hit boxes that she can’t AA correctly).
  6. Use a decent amount of focus attacks outside her jab range but inside her sweep range. Sweep is hard to counter-hit but easy to hit with level 2 FA. She has a lot of counter-hittable normal spamming so don’t be afraid to take risks.
  7. Watch for overhead flips
  8. Do not try to anti-cross up j.lk, only command cross-up done not deep.
  9. If you get hit by 2 c.:lp: x n, s.:hp: combos, stop attacking and let the stun clear
  10. Challenge her wake-up cause it sucks. If you have meter, do a late ex head butt and it’ll beat wake-up EX SBK and back dashes. Stand out of her throw range when doing this so you don’t have to deal with wake-up throw. Worst case scenario is she jumps and you burned meter or she blocked and you burned a meter. Best case scenario is you counter-hit her ass for 200 dmg. After you train her to block or jump on wake-up, use s.:hp:/cl.:mp: (meaty), c.:lp: xx :hp: hhs, :hk: or oicho (meaty). You can also bait out ex sbk and block it, then punish with fp headbutt or ultra (-18 on block).
  11. Don’t whiff shit against Chun unless it’s max range chop that can’t get whiff punished with sweep
  12. If she doesn’t come to you and isn’t throwing kikokens, whiff oicho for meter
  13. Chop is really good AA against chun cause it’s a 175 dmg counter-hit that she almost never beats clean (hard to time against j.:hp: though)
  14. Honda can auto-correct Headbutt/Ultra Chun Li’s OH flip kick
    [/details]

Dan

[details=Spoiler] (6/4 Honda) You can’t just talk the talk, man. One of these days, you gotta learn how to fight.
[/details]

Dhalsim

[details=Spoiler] (6/4 Sim) Fire breathing? Levitation? Is this a fight or a magic show?

Default
Playing against Dhalsim is all about mixing it up and taking calculated risks. Playing textbook simply won’t work because dhalsim is designed to keep people out indefinitely and has an answer to every defensive situation. Before you can beat Dhalsim, you have to understand how sim keeps you out.

Anti Air:

S.rh: Far S.rh is sim’s 3/4 of 1/2 screen distance anti-air. He uses it on reaction to keep you out after jumpin ga fireball that’s at half screen. Why did you get hit by it? You jumped from not full screen against a fireball while dhalsim was not in recovery. To avoid this, don’t jump fireballs while dhalsim is free to position himself and is not in yoga fire recovery. "i dunno if you caught this pie, but if a sim is trying to anti air you with a far rh, you can beat it by hitting rh right around the peak of your jump. a better option even yet is mp around the peak of your jump. it will beat the rh, and if you see him go up for an air to air and you hit it early enough, it stuffs it as well.

not that i would endorse getting in the habit of jumping at sim in the first place, but if you choose to jump from a distance, you have a few options. not like close jumps, where he can shut you out if he chooses the correct option " -HNIC Mike

Air to Air Strong: jumping strong functions simliary to s.rh. Keeps you out for jumping fireballs 1/2 screen to close range. How to avoid it? Don’t jump the fireball while sim is free to move and punish. Just walk.

S.rh: the infamous knee, dhalsim uses the knee when you jump in on him predictably from close range. You jumped in while he was barely coming out of the recovery which is fine, but you did it from a bad range if you got AA cleaned. When you jump in on sim while he’s coming out of the recovery of a fireball, you have to jump at two specific ranges. Range 1 is max range j.rh. You stick the roundhouse out early with the intent to trade (125 dmg vs 98ish) and trade or contact sim with the tip of your foot. Any other distance will lead to knee hitting your thigh resulting in a perfect AA. The other range to jump in on sim is from close range, almost the brink of crossing up. You make sure to use j.mp and and time it so that your hand clips dhalsims head while your hand is at the bottom of your character. See akimo vs sabin for j.mp correctly.

S.mp: the raise your hand anti air cleanly beats splash coming down, prevents crossup attempts and AA’s incorrectly timed j.mp. Getting around s.mp is difficult but possible through randoming the timing of splashes. Also, it does pitiful dmg and you’re now much closer to sim, which is where you wanna be.

AA slide: A very weird AA to predict, it’s effective at dealing with Honda’s far j.rh. Fortunately for honda, it puts sim rite next to you and at a fairly close frame advantage. Almost all sims will do either instant jump back fierce overhead or mash the fuck out of throw. To deal with this, make sure you have a back charge and get ready to tech. If he does the overhead, block high and punish the blocked overhead with fp headbutt/ex headbutt/ultra (yes!). If he throws and you tech, get ready to headbutt (ex) any teleport attempts or to punish any jump back overheads once again, but you’ll probably need ex since it’s going to be about max range.

Things to keep in mind:

When you’re watching for teleports (when dhalsim you cornered or he’s cornered), you have three punishment options. lk splash, s.fp or lp headbutt. Akimo likes to lp headbutt but I have a tendency to get oichos cause I hold down a lot. You do this like you’d do anti-crossup headbutts, press the lp late after he’s switched sides. For s.fp, make sure you’re doing it after sim’s switched sides otherwise you just stuck out a laggy fierce in the wrong direction. S.lk imo is the best option because you got a knockdown with decent oki and he took a good amount of dmg. Ex splash has even better oki but I personally like to save meter for ex headbutts.

FA does have applications in this match-up but people often overuse it. If you don’t successfully FA a limb, you didn’t gain much ground cause honda has the chode of all dashes (cept gief). Also, he got a free fierce on you cause he caught you in FA’s recovery. So, be careful with the FA usage.

LK/MK/HK splash does lose to late instant overhead so be careful with the splash usage. EX splash beats overhead easily and sets up fantastic oki.

OKI (situation when he’s getting up):
When you get a successful knockdown on dhalsim, you just gave yourself a big opportunity for some huge damage. Every headbutt you hit on sim is more than 15% of his life meaning you don’t have to guess much in order to kill him. When he’s getting up, he has 4 options.

  1. do nothing but block
  2. jump-back (vertical jump is suicidal for sim)
  3. teleport
  4. back dash

When you play a sim, you’ll usually figure out what type of options he usually turns to. Some sims like to spend a shitload of time in the air which I find dumb while others like to abuse teleports. Very few take the upclose fighting approach and fish for a knockdown before they attempt to retreat.

When fighting sims, I rely on 3 options.

First, I like to use meaties. One I use constantly is meaty xx fp headbutt. If you guessed a jump, a wake-up throw or a backdash, you usually have enough time to punish either of these three options. c.lk, c.lk xx fp headbutt is imo, the best meaty option because you can punish the teleport on reaction pretty easily. If he didn’t teleport, it’s a hit confirm, although difficult. Another meaty option is s.mp, s.hk. It’s a 180 dmg meaty option that punishes jumps and backdashes but not teleports because s.mp takes forever to whiff. Another meaty option is meaty lp headbutt. Punishes throw, backdash and jumps provided you time it right and do it point blank.

Second OKI option is to meaty oicho. You do this if you think he won’t jump but honestly, almost all sims jump. If you’ve trained them by meatying them a few times, you can usually squeeze in an oicho or two (use fp) before they’re afraid again and being to jump or teleport.

Third OKI option is to lk splash. LK splash on wake-up jumpers is a knockdown provided you do it early enough, can crossup, is unpunishable for sim and does decent dmg if it actually hits. Problem is, they can teleport this and possibly backdash it if you’re not right next to them. They could probably FA, backdash as well, but this is punishable by a s.hk. I honestly dislike this option tho cause splash has terrible follow-up if they block it. It’s just another guess but this time, you’re doing the hard guesses since you’re -2 on block.

Fourth OKI option that isn’t really an option, but more of a guess and act of desperation. Late meaty ultra. I’ve caught good sim’s before doing late meaty ultras as its a punish to teleport and backdash. I actually knocked a good sim out of a fairly large win streak before with this option recently at SVGL (norcals best arcade) because it’s just so random and rewards huge damage for relatively little risk (sim hits for shit). Ways to set this up is to be mid-screen and not corner and having meatied the sim a few times or wake-up oichio’d him. They instinctively want to teleport and when they do, bam, big dmg. Another way to set this up is to have a sim cornered. When you’re out of s.hk range and have a sim cornered, they naturally want to get out, so they have a tendency to teleport. If you can set up a telegraphed teleport (you wait for him to throw a fireball and walk forward since he wants to get behind you), you can flip the ultra like you do an anti-crossup headbutt, but with your ultra. I forgot where I saw this done, maybe it was akimo.

Other interesting things to note about this match-up are s.lk beats far fierce/crouching fierce from sim, but it’s a guess. S.fp (chop) beats instant overhead (hard to time), ULTRA PUNISHES POINT BLANK YOGA CATASTROPHE. If a sim is ever stupid enough to desperately throw out a yoga catastrophe, mash ultra and just smoke him in the face with it. Sim is in quite a bit of recovery after he throws the ultra so make him pay (25 frame recovery).

Sim’s slides are all pretty negative, although hitting you with the tip of the slide is considerably safer. You can usually get away with a reversal ex headbutt or reversal oicho to thwart his throw attempts.

Sim has no true block strings. If he’s looking to push you with with db+fp, s.lk, s.lk, just reversal ex headbutt for some counter-hit dmg. On block nothing links with sim so don’t play into his tricks.
[/details]


#3

Character Match-Ups E-K

E-Honda:

[details=Spoiler] (5/5) It’s hard to beat and opponent who can read every move you’ve got!

  • Blocked HP/MP headbutt can be punished on block w/ standing HK (If you blocked it standing up, not crouching), or ultra (perfect counter timing needed). Obviously ultra reverses it too so don’t go headbutting on wakeup.
  • Ochio vs. Ochio mechanics: Ochio throws I’ve found are 50/50 if both parties go for it, so do it at unexpected times, or train yourself to jump straight up any time you think you should do an ochio, and then nail the other guy who DID ochio on the way down.
  • Buttslam vs. Buttslam mechanics: who ever is on the way down has the most priority, so time the wakeup slams early rather than late.
  • Headbutt vs. Headbutt mechanics: Usually a trade, but if you time an LP/EX headbutt properly (i.e. hit them at the very very start of the move) you can do a reversal. Use sparingly though because sometimes you will just eat it.
  • Headbutt vs. Buttslam mechanics: Buttslam wins flawless victory
    [/details]

El-Fuerte:

[details=Spoiler] (6/4 Honda) Next time, we’ll fight in the kitchen. My chanko stew is unbeatable!

  • This matchup can go either way, all depends on who can pull the most effective mindgames IMO
  • When el-fuerte goes off the wall, jump straight up and HP to hit him. A counter w/ headbutt is possible, but it has lead me to eat damage when mistimed. j.HP is more reliable.
  • When el-fuerte starts running at you, I like to do LP/EX headbutt early. Unless he goes for a deep crossup body splash and hit’s your legs, you will nail him as he tries to roll away. Even with the deep splash, he will usually eat the headbutt before he jumps as it requires late timing.
  • When you’re on your back and fuerte is running: You have a few options. The worst one is to try to block. Too many mixups, I would say you have about 1/3 chance of blocking properly. The safest bet is to jump away and HP. Worst case, you eat a splash and go flying away, then you tech get up and are free from the wake up games. Best case, you catch him trying to do the tornado throw and hit a jumping HP.
  • When fuerte is on his back: the tables are turned. You can do a couple buttslams, bait antiair then ochio or combo, crossup mk, you can even jump right in (well timed) to set up an ochio tick.
  • End game stalemates: Do NOT use HP/MP headbutt to try and get a chip-death or life lead, fuerte can counter them with a FREE ultra. You CAN however use EX HB to bait the ultra, jump immediately after you land then punish (although, I believe even EX-HB can be punished w/ ultra on counter-timing? Someone who knows should please share).[/details]

Fei-Long:

[details=Spoiler] (6/4 Honda) Whatta voice! My ears will be ringing for weeks!
[/details]

Gen:

[details=Spoiler] (?/?) For an old timer, you sure move quick! I guess I underestimated you.
Gen: Use your fast aerial chops. In addition to the normal WALL (aka Jumping Fierce) also utilize…

neutral jumping: Jab (fast chop)

forward/backward jumping: Strong (fast chop), and jab (downward angle palm).

those chops really kill Gens cross up game if he’s trying to get in. After you hit with those you’ll land right next to him (in fp. oicho range). don’t butt slam cause if he does his upward kick it’ll beat it. you can wait out the first aerial punish to see what he does. a cr. jab usually works well and sets up for oicho.

One BnB combo gen players use is their s.mk xx hands. some can even link another set afterwards. It isnt a bad idea after the first set to try and ex-headbutt. if they’re too slow on the link the ex-headbutt will punish.

EX-Heabutt does NOT beat out his diagonal wall dive if you do it too late. VERY STRICT timing to punish that dive with ex, you have to make use of those invinceability frames.

Random butt slams are NOT good as he can get in fast and use your recovery time to start his cross-up game.

chingchong that chingchong to death~!
[/details]

Gouken:

[details=Spoiler] (?/?) Say, have I met you before?
Gouken:

  • A matchup I believe is in Honda’s favor, since gouken is always on the guessing end.
  • Scrubby Gouken players shoot fireballs in patterns (something like normal, normal, upwards). Figure this out, and hit them hard with a headbutt when you think the upwards fireball is coming out.
  • I’m pretty sure gouken can’t punish a headbutt at all, and it breaks through his counter move (which is really just a command FA). So spam away.
  • Some gutsy goukens will try to command-FA jump ins. In this case, do a blank jump in to ochio if you can predict it.
  • If you see gouken doing a charged 2-hit hadouken when you have a backcharge, think of it as an invitation to ultra through it.
  • Just be careful with throws and ochios, because if you do it from to far, he can backthrow you into that damn ultra.
  • Also, when he does the command jump, if you want to counter it w/ headbutt, do it early or you might eat a combo.
    [/details]

Guile:

[details=Spoiler] (6/4 Guile) You’ve got skills, but it doesn’t look like you’re enjoying yourself much.
Despite guile being shit tier in SF4, he still gives certain characters a bit of trouble. One of these characters is E.Honda and the reason is because he turtles like Honda, but he?s better at it. Sonic Boom has nearly instant recovery upon leaving his hands, c.fp is an AA wall and rh, b+fp, f+fp and c.mk are like spikes on the side of a fort gate. You just can?t get in.

Now before people start going on and on about how you beat Guile, realize that most Guile?s in the US blow. But there are a few good ones like DaggerG, Gilley, Dieminion and Lamerboi (always room for up and comers to). These Guiles are all thorns in your side that are content with throwing sonic booms like a machine gun, all day. You jump; you eat a fist in your ass. You FA dash; he shoves his fist in your face. There?s a lot more to these Guiles than your average scrub, sonic boom, sweep, wait, FLASH KICK!!!

Understanding Sonic Boom
Sonic boom is not a damage tool. You might think it?s a damage tool, it was a damage tool in ST, it looks like a damage tool, but really, it?s not. In fact, sonic boom damage is straight up awful. I could eat and block sonic booms all day and not give a shit because the things do 50 damage. That?s only 10 damage more than Honda?s crouching jab! So if SB isn?t a damage tool, what is it? Well it?s a spacing tool of course. Guile uses it to start his safe (and extremely shitty) offense so that you can?t just spam some safe reversal and kick his ass. His offense is literally 3 or 4 normals: forward/back fierce, c.mk, f+rh and sweep (which sucks).

As soon as the round starts and you face off against Guile, you?re main enemy is pretty much the timer because in this match-up, Guile does nothing but charge for a SB, throw it, and wait for your reaction. You jump it incorrectly; you eat an air throw, either of the fierces or a j.rh. You FA, bam, f+rh or f+fp. You do nothing, he throws another one.

So you?re probably wondering right now, how do you beat guile? The answer is, you be random. Guile is fundamentally the same as Dhalsim, which is why Capcom has a hard time balancing them. They?re made to keep you out and force your move so the only way you can get around his defense is to be unpredictable.

Offensive Tools:

BEST TOOL: WALK. Wait what? Yes, you walk. You stop jumping, you stop doing fancy focus attack shit, you stomp splashing like a stupid kid in a pool and you stop headbutting like a dumb boxer and just walk forward. If you get into Guile?s poke range, you walk and you block more. Fundamentally, if you?re doing nothing but blocking, guile can?t really hurt you. It?s only when you do stupid things like jump predictably that you open yourself up to damage. If you watch Akimo vs Guile, you?ll see that whenever he jumps in stupidly, he loses and whenever he spends of the round walking about, blocking, he wins. Ironically, even though Akimo?s the best, he sucks at fighting guile because half the time he?s patient and half the time, he just doesn?t care.

Even though you shouldn?t jump, sometimes it?s still advantageous to do so because there is a range where jumping works well. It?s slightly farther than guile?s f+rh range and you only do it after the boom has been thrown. Soon as the boom?s thrown, you have to be already in the air. The reason for this is because c.fp has startup and at the range where you?re jumping in, guile can only get a piece of honda?s j.rh?s foot. So you?re most like to win or trade. He has no charge to flash kick you, back fierce won?t work cause the of the angle, it?s too late for air throw and any attempts to jump roundhouse. The other range you can jump is within Guile?s sweep range. It has to be fairly unpredictable but the way to do it is to jump and stick out an early strong. You?ll clip Guile in the head and be able to link a c.lp xx hhs, rh.

One last situation to jump is when Guile is following behind his boom, coming in to poke you. If you neutral jump and then fierce really late, you?ll usually be able to trade his c.fp that he?ll attempt to throw out underneath you. Sometimes what?ll happen is you?ll fall on the boom, but that?s ok, 50 damage taken and no follow up.

Now that you know when to jump and when to walk, you whole purpose now should be keeping guile in the corner. You spend of the time walking, and of the time poking and handslapping the shit out of him. You watch the guile for his patterns and when you can figure out a good opening, take some time to poke him. Use s.fp (chop), s.hk (good for hitting boom startup), s.mp (also good for hitting boom startup) and an occasional headbutt. If the guile tries to jump out, jump back roundhouse or nj.fp. Don?t get knocked down cause then guile gets out of the corner. If you can keep guile cornered, counter-poke him a bit, throw in some hand slap pressure and make sure to AA his jump-ins with lp/ex headbutt, you have a very high chance of winning.

Sometimes, throwing in some FA?s helps because guile has no good armor break after boom. Just make sure you?re close range and that after the boom absorb, you let go cause his pokes are all fast (5 or more frames). Also, walk up Oicho is another good trick because if they do nothing, they get thrown and if they jump back, you can punish with cl.fp. It?s hard timing but go into training mode and try it. Guile has no jumping normals with vertical hitboxes, only horizontal ones so sticking your hand on his ass and attempting to grab it (close fierce animation is weiiirddd?) works wonders.

Splashing is something that?s a bit risky at times for Honda to attempt for a few reasons in this match-up. First off, c.hp beats it clean. If you attempt to throw off his timing by using different strengths of splash, it does work, but if you get a cross-up, he?s now out of the corner. Make sure to cross him up with mk in order to switch back sides. Same thing with Oicho. If you get him with an oicho, you now have to cross back over to prevent him from escaping.

Other things that work well against guile are meaty Oicho, meaty s.fp, meaty c.mk xx headbutt, meaty s.mp, meaty c.lp xx hhs and cross-up mk into c.lk, etc. In general, guiles like to jump away so don?t let him. If he becomes really obvious, knock him down and as soon as you can visually see him jump back, ultra. Guile has a very high arcing jump so the ultra will literally catch him before he can land, and it?s hilarious.

Overall, don?t be afraid to take risks against guile since his damage is awful, but don?t rush in stupidly and blindly so that you get counter-hit and poked to shit. Take the match-up slow even if you hate it.
[/details]

Ken

[details=Spoiler] (6/4 Ken) You’re one aggressive fighter, I like your style!

Stay on the ground if all possible. Only jump if you are going to nj.f and smash his pretty blonde face if you predict a jump in attack. If you stay on the ground and just pressure him with cr.jab + HHS and also EX HB, then you will notice Ken players quiver. Only do this technique for upper level Kens that rely a lot on standing.medium kicks to pressure you. As soon as you take that away from him with a few EX HBs and cr. jab + hands, most players divert back to fireballs and a Ryu style of playing, which in my opinion favors Honda.

Just watch out for some Ken trickery with his j.EX Hurricane kick crossovers. Just block them as you do his normal crossovers, but you can spot them easily as they don’t engage the hurricane kick until they are almost over you.

cr.jab + HHS should be mixed up with cr.jab + jab.ochio. Also, I have noticed if you randomly nj.f into HHS when you land, it often catches them doing that stupid standing.mk if spacing is correct. Lastly and most importantly, I just always try to nj.f predict those jump-ins and I always try to block if they are deep crossovers. Eat the throw after crossup if you have to, cuz’ its better than taking a shoryuken in the jaw. If you keep Ken in front of you at all times, that usually helps your fight in your favor.
[/details]


#4

M-Z Match ups

M.Bison (Dic):

[details=Spoiler] 5/5

  • Bicycle kick can Punish both :mp: and :hp: head butt
  • With proper spacing you can hit the tip of his standing :hk: (AA) with N.J. Fierce
  • If his slide whiffs it is punishable by death. (Big Damage)
  • When he whiffs a deep :mk: or :hk: Bicycle kick you can either Oicho for the mix-up or just give him a HHS Job
  • If the Dic player is stupid enough to head stomp into his punch attack feel free to ultra. (Just make sure you time it right)
  • Get greedy with those Hands, he really can’t do much against them in the first place but eat the chip. Just don’t be stupid and eat a Ex-move.
  • Bison is a poking machine so anything you whiff will lead in a BnB from him and then you’ll have to hope and pray on his cross-up game is lacking.
  • Good Bison players will Jerk you for your charge after a knockdown with Devil’s reverse so you’ll have to block his attack on the way down.
  • Bison is has a huge hit box if you cross-him up while he’s crouching. If you’re lucky enough to cross him up while he’s down there you can link cr.:mk: xx :hp: HHS Cr.:mk: :hp: head butt for massive damage. (If your the shit with Ex-HHS feel free to add one on before you start the combo.
  • Be careful of his Slide spacing, if done right it’s a potential Ultra bait and that’s not something you want to eat from him.
  • Don’t get to jump happy after he has Ultra meter, one screw up and you’ll eat the old ST combo into Ultra.
  • Try and force the teleport and punish with either Hands or Oicho throw.
  • Ex-Headstomp will get Bison out of trouble almost every time. It also beats Sumo Splash.
  • Watch out for a sneaking FADC into throw after a blocked bicycle kick, it’s a nice mix-up that you’ll see once in a while to make sure your on point.
  • If you have the life lead and become uncomfortable just kick back and wait it out. As hard as it is for you to attack Bison is as hard as it is for him to do the same.
    -Over all this is a get good quick damage and run away match from what I’ve learned. Sneak in your HHS build meter and watch out for his cross-ups. Bison really can’t do good damage unless you give him the chance to.
    [/details]

Rose:

Spoiler

Ryu:

[details=Spoiler]Ryu:
Despite some arguing here and there, I still think Honda vs Ryu is 4-6 or 4.5-5.5 Honda. Ryu is just solid in this game and getting in on him compared to most of the other cast is just difficult as hell. Not as bad as Sagat, but still hard. The biggest annoyance about fighting Ryu is his retarded amount of good AA?s. He has jab SRK, fierce SRK, s.rh, j.mp (L:DFJ:LSJKFO:SJFOWEJFWOJF) and a very good focus attack. Depending on his meter management, trading AA?s or eating any of these AA?s can often lead to 1/3 of your life disappearing so jumping is never a great idea.

So because of Ryu?s incredibly annoying AA defense, you?re kind of forced to approach Ryu from the ground. Hadouken isn?t as good as SB or TS so if you?re going to jump them, make sure to do it out of AA range (3/4 to full screen). Also, nj.fp is a great tool for jumping fireballs but don?t do them predictably because good Ryu?s can dash and srk punish (yes, my friend does this to me all the time). Once you?re at about a half screen distance from Ryu, stop doing laggy things that leave you open to getting jumped in on. Most shotos wait for you to lose charge and then hope in on you with fp or rh so keep out of sweep range and try to stay at a range where you can reliably nj.fp/s.fp/lp headbutt for AA.

If the Ryu is pretty solid, he?ll also have a good understanding of proper fireball zoning which makes your life considerably harder. He?ll be throwing fast fireballs in your face (yes, right outside your s.hk range) and will be throwing slow fireballs from far away to force you to jump fb?s while he?s free to move around. Don?t play into this trap and jump a bad fireball. Focus attack fireballs outside your s.hk range (hold f, hit fa+f) and then punish him with s.hk. For farther away fireballs, block or nj.fp unpredictably to avoid getting jumped in on unexpectedly.
Another thing that Ryu?s like to abuse, is Ryu?s ridiculously good c.mk. C.mk has a few properties that makes Honda?s life miserable. 1) it?s about the same range as s.hk, 2) it ducks nj.fp (:KJ:SDJKF:SLDKJF:SLJF), 3) it cancels into hadouken, super and srk->ultra. If a Ryu sees that you like to focus close range fireballs, he?ll start inching in on you and throwing c.mk xx hadouken to combat this. Keep in mind that max range c.mk xx hadouken on block has a hole between the kick and the fireball so you can ex splash and ultra between the two for free damage. If he?s doing this, keep walking outside of the c.mk range when he walks forward and whiff punish c.mk with s.fp. The c.mk makes Ryu?s upper body inch forward a hair so that it can be counter-hit with s.fp. 175 damage against a whiffed c.mk is an amazing trade. You can also try FAing the c.mk so that you counter-hit the hadouken in startup leading to a free oicho or c.lp xx hhs, s.rh (ideal).

A few things to keep in mind while working out your spacing. Nj.fp can move while airborne so a clever trick I saw a Korean Honda do was purposely bait c.mk?s with it. He?d nj.fp right outside the forward?s range and then whiff punish when he landed with s.hk. It worked pretty well. Also, if Ryu gets in on your or knocks you down and likes to meaty, keep in mind that Ryu has no safe block strings outside of light attacks. Strong, strong or strong, forward or forward+fierce, strong or even overhead, crouching forward all have holes and are free ex headbutt counter-hits. Don?t let him spam these untight block strings on you cause they?re clever frame traps.

A big craze a while back was to punish fireballs with ultra and while viable, it?s a really difficult thing to pull off consistently. You have to find ways to bait the hadouken and then have to watch out for ex hadouken?s and ultra baits (ryu?s will start to whiff normals, etc.). EX hadouken recovers faster than regular hadouken so it?s a bit harder to eagle eye (punish w/ fireball) but still doable. The best method I?ve found to landing eagle eyes is to whiff laggy normals. Whiffing lagging normals gives people the impression you?re not holding charge for some reason and they have a tendency to fireball. Also, people tend to fireball twice. I don?t know why, but after you fail to punish the first one, they often think, ?fuck this guy, Ima throw another one because I can.? That?s when you?re free to punish. Honestly, you?ll know if a Ryu is used to fighting Honda or not right when you get ultra meter because Ryu?s who know the match-up are REALLY careful about careless hadoukens. Nobody in Davis, CA where I play throws bad fireballs anymore /sad.

Another thing I?d like to talk about when fighting Ryu is trip guard and jumping with fierce. If you jump in on Ryu at the right range, about of a screen and stick out a fierce (the big slap), you will hit ryu or eat a traded SRK. If you don?t stick out the fierce, you?ll land and be able to block the late SRK cause your tripguard is still up. This range is the best range to jump because it makes the Ryu panic about whether or not you can be successfully AA?d so you get free jump-ins. Also, if you don?t jump at this range and magically still get a blocked jump-in, don?t waste it. Do a c.lp xx fp, hhs if it?s blocked or oicho for 50/50 mix-up. Wasting jump-ins is one of the biggest mistakes Honda?s make.

Other random notes on this match-up:

  • ryu?s c.hk is -9000 on block (actually, -14). That means you can reversal ANYTHING. You can block it, go rub one off, bake cookies, mow your lawn, and then come back and still reversal ultra it. I kid you not. If a ryu is dumb enough to get a c.hk blocked, make him pay.

-When a Ryu has ultra meter, you have to pay close attention to his super bar. 1) If he?s pushed you to the corner, he?s fishing for ex fireball into ultra. 2) If he has 2 bars and is attempting to cross you up, either back dash after blocking the cross-up or just eat the throw. DO NOT TECH CAUSE YOU WILL GET POPPED UP. 3) If he whiffs the cross-up, do not instinctively tech either. Just stay away from the guy when he has 2 bars + ultra. 4) When he has 3 bars plus ultra, he?s going to fish for c.mk xx ex hadouken, fadc, ultra. Block low or run away. Don?t try to counter-poke in this situation. 5) If he?s going for the ambiguous cross-ups without knocking you down, jump back roundhouse and don?t do dumb things like attempt to anti-crossup ex headbutt. 6) STOP JUMPING, Y U JUMPING??? 7) In corner if he walks up to throw you, he?s not throwing you. He?s going to ex tatsu you for a free ultra. DON?T TECH, Y U TECHING!!! I TOLD U NOT TO TECH!!!

-Super punishes all headbutts on block and if a Ryu has full super meter, don?t use nj.fp too much to jump fireballs. Jump the fireball neutrally so that you land right behind it to bait the super canceled off the hadouken.

-Tatsu?s an armor break, don?t FA too much or else he?ll pick up on it and randomly tatsu you. Tatsu on block is -6/-2/-1 so don?t bother trying to punish anything but short tatsu on block.
[/details]

Rufus:

[details=Spoiler]Honestly, everybody hates rufus, just like everybody hates blanka. They’re just annoying to play against and make weird noises as they jump up and down stupidly.

Rufus imo is one of the most annoying characters imaginable since dive kick is ridiculously good, throws are very good in this game, ex messiah kick (JEBUS KICK!) is ridiculously overpowered and rufus has like 1000 ways to land his ultra.

Inherent weaknesses rufus has are he’s really shitty without meter. There’s no fear when he doesn’t have ultra or ex messiah (250 dmg!!!). Also, his normals are relatively awful at not point blank range meaning s.fp/s.hk/s.mp and c.lp mess him up pretty badly. His FA also really blows.

In general, big things people do wrong against rufus are, they try to tech, they jump too much (im guilty of this too), and they don’t pay attention to their spacing. Honda has very poor option selects because c.lk is a 5 framer. It leads to unnecessary counter-hits and throws because if you don’t tech late enough, you get a startup lk which gets you messed up. To avoid having to tech, learn to jump back rh to box rufus out and to ex headbutt reversal very well.

Also, DO NOT STAND UP. YOU DO NOT NEED TO STAND THE F*CK UP. STOP STANDING UP DAMN IT. WHY YOU STANDING DOG? Target combo can only launch people standing up. That means as soon as you do something stupid like STAND UP TO TECH, you eat a target combo linked off a dive kick. Also, DIVE KICKS CAN BE BLOCKED CROUCHING. You also need to crouch to splash bitches.

Rufus’s combos work like this. Galactic tornado can only combo off of cl.fp. Cl.fp xx fp galactic is only safe on hit (there’s a hole between fierce and tornado). The only good link to cl.fp is s.lk and it’s a one frame link that does not link on block. Watch for holes and then punish attempts to do s.lk, s.fp on block with ex headbutt/splash.

Dive kick is a good jump-in that can link to target combo so again, don’t stand up. If you are not in corner, back dash, jump back rh, ex headbutt, ex splash, lk splash, fa backdash, do anything to avoid the damn throw tech baits.

The trick to fighting rufus is to be unpredictable without opening yourself up to rufus’s close offense. AA with lp headbutt, s.fp (chop works ridiculously well unless you do it too early), ex headbutt and lk/ex splash. Keep him out as best you can and when he’s close, burn meter to get away (ex headbutt) or hk splash and just eat the c.fp punish. It’s worth it. Do not do too much nj.fp because if the rufus jumps from below you, instead of from far away, he can rh you as the nj.fp is retracting, leading to ex snake strike and ultra. If you jump, make sure he’s half screen away, not 1/3 screen away, otherwise do jump back roundhouse cause he can’t reliably j.rh it.

In terms of offense against Rufus, don’t bother relying on HHS cause it leaves you too close and with unfavorable positioning. Rely on headbutt which rufus can’t punish (he can punish fp headbutt, but not mp, lp, ex). A trick is to throw a mp headbutt and then an ex headbutt in order to bait the c.fp from rufus on block. You just got a nearly 200 dmg counter-hit cause he stuck out his fat hand. C.Fp from rufus is -14 on block so technically you can reversal ultra it. There’s a reason why nobody does it in Japan (honda’s ultra is 10 frame startup).

Focus attack only works against rufus against really early dive kicks. Otherwise you’ll end up getting a weak lvl 1 fa that you dash into your death after.

Do not whiff unnecessarily against rufus cause you get hit by galactic tornados and c.fp’s. Against ex messiah kick on block, do an ex splash late. I found that to be the best punisher. If you don’t have meter, you can do lk splash which will trade with the overhead follow-up, or you can nj.fp and punish rufus on the way down if you spaced it right (rog does the same thing with wiggly punch). EX headbutt that goes head to head against messiah kick, takes full damage from messiah as if you?re grounded. EX Splash just gets knocked out and you take 40 damage.

When punishing rufus’s ultra on block, know that the last kick whiffs when you block the full ultra. He can be reversal ultra’d so just mash when the ultras finishing.

If you?re challenging rufus?s wake-up, which you shouldn?t do too often, make sure to watch for wake-up snake strike. Punish wake up snake strike by blocking and then doing c.mk xx fp headbutt for safe push away. Another good way to bait/option select against rufus is do meaty c.lp xx fp hhs. If he jumped or threw, you got a free hhs, s.rh. If he ex messiahs, you can still block in time since messiah starts in 11 and c.lp recovers in 7. If he snake strike?d, his first hit will hit you for negligible damage and then you can punish with c.mk xx fp headbutt. If he backdashed, nothing happens cause hhs doesn?t come out if you did the cancel right. So in general, pretty safe offensive tool. If you do a meaty lp headbutt, it?s also a good option because you?re airborne during the middle of the move so ex messiah?s do 1 hit only.

When you?re waking up, watch for the cross-up dive kicks and try to burn meter or ultra to escape the corner crossing up. It?s worth the meter. Rufus?s who knock down from mid screen away like to do a safe-jump fierce so make sure you block high when waking up if they ?re jumping. It?s a very tricky jump-in that doesn?t look active when he?s coming at you, but it is.

For a good example of how to beat rufus, see here:
[media=youtube]rcfDLOCxK2k[/media]
[media=youtube]YwzYYm9kNZc[/media]
[/details]

Sagat:

[details=Spoiler] 7-3 (20%/30%)
-Easily E.Honda’s worst match-up. :rofl:

  • Get friendly with eating some chip damage and jumping over tiger shots.
  • The main struggle here is to get near Sagat, but once you force him into the corner the match-ups becomes 6-4
  • Tiger uppercut can punish blocked sumo slams so gamble with them wisely.
  • Get creative, it’s your job to figure out the Sagat your playing.
  • Most Sagat like to poke after Tiger Knees, throw out an Ex-Torpedo to counter hit.
  • Basically you want to make the Sagat player flinch or hesitate so you can capitalize on his mistakes.
  • Cr.:lp: can stuff the start up of a tiger shot and has amazing range on it.
  • Be very careful with your cross ups, Sagat is a Reallytall character so if you mistime it the block stun will be gone and you’ll end up eating a Tiger Uppercut.
    -I haven’t tried it yet but I think you can oicho his walking :hk:.
  • If your feeling psychic and close enough, try to Ultra or Super his Tigershots and give him a little panic.
  • At a certain range jump in :hp: beats out his standing :hk:
  • :hp: Torpedo can be punished by Tiger uppercut and Ex-Low tiger shot.
  • Once he’s in the corner HHS the fuck out of him and force the compromise so you can punish.
  • Ex-Sumo Splash Beats out Tiger Knee
  • Play random as fuck in an attempt to confuse the Sagat player. :rofl:
  • Play dirty and what I mean is random and dirty coincide with one another. When you have the Sagat figured to start doing random FADC’s and sitting real close to bait attacks out.
  • This match solely rests on you outsmarting the Sagat player. Don’t get discouraged or upset when you lose, you aren’t really suppose to win this match-up in the first place.
    :rofl:[/details]

Sakura:

[details=Spoiler] 6-4 Honda’s Favor

  • EX-Headbutt beats most if not all of sakura specials (except fireball ofcourse). LP headbutt as well if timed earlier.
  • Be careful of her jumping :hk: it snuffs headbutt when done deep enough.
  • Sakura’s cr.HP (anti air) beats most of honda’s jump ins clean. You may be able to get away w/ j.HP from very far but it’s unlikely. So don’t jump in predictably.
  • Option selecting against here is just asking to eat a wall of mix-ups and a potential Dizzy/Ultra.
  • Her cr.:mk: can catch almost all of your whiffed pokes and go into a Shoryuken, so don’t throw them out recklessly.
  • If she can’t cross you up she can’t hurt you, if you have to just take the throw.
    [/details]

Seth:

Spoiler

Vega (Claw):

[details=Spoiler] (6-4 E.Honda For health and damage output reasons.)

  • Vega can punish blocked MP/HP headbutt w/ slide (cr.HK) or ex.Barcelona dive (i believe)
  • Vega dive-claw off the wall (where he comes straight at you) and ultra are punishable by headbutt on block, or ultra if done w/ counter timing.
  • ALL of vegas non-EX barcelona dives (cross up or not) lose out to j.mk belly flop.
  • J.HK of vega beats headbutts if timed properly. Use it as anti air sparingly.
  • Jumping in/crossup w/ j.mk is a viable choice as long as you don’t overdo it, vega doesn’t have too many counter options here.
  • Due to his height you can FA under his wall-screw attack and it will sail right over.
  • When he Wall dives to the other side of the screen just simply wait til you turn around and New Jersey :hp:[/details]

Zangief:

Spoiler
  • Abuse the neutral jump HP to stop zangief from getting too close.
  • EX-Buttslam beats gief’s body splash crossup w/ ease
  • BUT: Zangief can punish ANY blocked buttslam w 360, super or ultra, so be careful about abusing it on wakeup because he may do an early crossup, you do buttslam, he blocks the slam and 360 you.
  • After the 2nd Chip of his PPP Lariat you can Ultra.

#5

Video’s and Extras

K I (Sa) vs Akimo (Ho)
[media=youtube]ZHPiXDy3YGE[/media]

TKD (El Fuerte) vs. Akimo (E.Honda)
[media=youtube]-uJCh…layer_embedded[/media]

Akimo (Ho) vs Ueda (Gu)
[media=youtube]I_9p_aFC0XI[/media]

Niyani (Bl) vs Akimo (Ho)
[media=youtube]RNq0Oi2ary8[/media]

Akimo (Ho) vs Nekojita (Ke)
[media=youtube]ItF9spMX9n8[/media]

Cross (Ke) vs Akimo (Ho)
[media=youtube]EshNJJ6JWZg[/media]

Akimo (Ho) vs Osaru (Gu)
[media=youtube]e0ujyBC1PKM[/media]

Akimo (Ho) vs GEXP (Ab)
[media=youtube]VhsbKGUQlag[/media]

Akimo (Ho) vs PE (Ru)
[media=youtube]Uljdcpk0s6Q[/media]

Mago (SA) vs Akimo (HO)
[media=youtube]naJlhPJbqk4[/media]

???BL??vs???EH?
[media=youtube]efGLjbC_9pQ[/media]

DESORA?SG??vs???EH?
[media=youtube]qlnb0oA_MKQ[/media]

74(Gouki) vs Namameso(Honda)
[media=youtube]AI82O-5LkeU[/media]

Namameso (E.Honda) vs. Bonchan (Sagat)
[media=youtube]nF3GK3l8GT0[/media]

Namameso (E.Honda) vs. Shiro (Abel)
[media=youtube]v9VaiTqD2Hc[/media]

Namameso (Ho) vs Hitoshi (Bi)
[media=youtube]YlUY-1yL7n0[/media]

Nemo (Chun-Li) vs Namameso (E.Honda)
[media=youtube]PdrqI889R24[/media]

Fujino (Go) vs Akimo (Ho)
[media=youtube]ZYnyQpilO6A[/media]

Other E.Honda Tidbits

Multiple HHS links
HHS, c.lp xx HHS

Standing
Blanka
Dict
Sim
Guile
Claw
Abel
Cammy - Standing only
Doesn’t hit Gouken, Fei, Seth

everyone else crouching only

HHS, c.lp xx EX HB

Dict
Blanka - standing only
Crouching - Claw, Gief, Elf, Rufus

HHS, c.mk xx HB

crouching - Dict, Akuma, Honda, Ryu, Ken, Viper, Rufus, Dan, Chun (Cr. HHS)
Standing - Blanka
Crouching EX HB only - Claw, Elf, Sakura, Rose

Telepathic’s Ex-HHS Faq
I have my character specific EX Hands stuff that I’ll post later here so you can use it in the new thread.

Update

EX Hands

For most Honda’s EX.HHS are not a good thing. If you see EX.HHS in a match it is almost always because the Honda player messed up his hp.HHS cancel. This usually leads to either wasted meter because the opponent was blocking or waste opertunity as you “moonwalk” away because you where holding you charge. Others feel that EX.HHS are a waste because much of the discussion focused on executing the EX loop for “Honda’s Ultimate combo” which meant you had to hit four 1 frame links for less damage than Honda’s easier super cancels. I am going to try to layout information on EX hands and it’s combos to help Honda’s add more damage potential to their arsenal. If you are still struggling to consistaently execute c.lp/c.mk xx hp.HHs combos then EX.HHS is not for you. Work on the basics first and then add EX.HHS later.

IMO, the trail combo EX.HHS, c.lp xx EX.BS is a waste of meter. EX.HHS, c.lp xx hp.HHS, s.hk does more damage and requires less meter. If you feel you want to use another bar, one more .EX.HHS, c.lp xx hp.HHS will do more damage than ending with EX.BS. Additionally HHS, s.hk returns meter, so the whole combo really only uses half a bar. The following combos work on every character. But because you are using EX meter without hit comfirming I recommend you only use them for sure punish situations (whiff srk’s, blocked ultra’s, deep punishable moves, landed FA’s).

c.mk xx EX.HHS, c.lp xx hp.HHS, s.hk = 410 / 468
c.mk xx EX.HHS, c.lp xx EX.HHS, c.lp xx hp.HHS, s.hk = 484 / 538
j.hk, c.mk xx EX.HHS, c.lp xx hp.HHS, s.hk = 484 / 606
j.hk, c.mk xx EX.HHS, c.lp xx EX.HHS, c.lp xx hp.HHS, s.hk = 540 / 657

For one bar you are increasing you damage by 90-110 points. For two bars it’s 150-180 damage. by comparision when Akuma does his b’n’b lk.HK, dp xx FADC red fireball combo’s he’s using two bar for 50 more damage. Very few characters can turn one bar into 400+ damage. We’re talking Viper’s FFF EX seismo; Gouken’s c.hp xx EX.Palm > HK; and Ryu’s SPS, c.hp xx HP.DP combos and thats about it. Plus your only using half a bar anyways. But to me the universal EX.HHs combos are only great to punish big openings. You might only get on or two of those per match (or not at all versus tough competion). The beauty of EX.HHS is that if you know a little character specific info you can hit comfirm it on every charater except Sakura. For hp.HHS link EX.HHS the more hitstun the move before hp.HHS the deeper the hp.HHS which makes it easier to land the EX.HHS after. Just link HHS, HHS or the s.hk link you have to learn the distance that HHS > EX.HHS works and doesn’t work.

HHS, EX.HHS, c.lp hp.HHS (s.hk will whiff) hits on:

Gief, GK, DH(*s), BL, CH, HO, Dict, AK(*s), GU(*s), Box(*s)
Standing FE, CA, GU(*s), SA(*s), Claw, AB, RU, DA(*s)
Crouching RY, KE, SE, VI, EF, RO, GE
(*s) indicates that the some hits of EX.HHS will whiff but the last hit doesn’t so you are still at +4 frame advatage.

These crouchers are unsafe because the last hit of EX.HHS will whiff

FE, Claw, AB, RU, SK, DA

So any time you land a b’n’b HHS combo you can extend it with the following combos

c.lp xx hp.HHS, EX.HHS, c.lp xx hp.HHS = 404
c.mk xx hp.HHS, EX.HHS, c.lp xx hp.HHS = 444
j.mp/mk, c.lp xx hp.HHS, EX.HHS c.lp xx hp.HHS = 434
j.hk, c.mk xx hp.HHS, EX.HHS, c.lp xx hp.HHS = 514

J.hk, c.mk xx hp.HHS, EX.HHS, c.lp xx EX.HHS, c.lp xx EX.HHS, c.lp XX EX.HHS, c.lp XX hp.HHS = 612 damage which is inline with j.hk, c.mk xx hp.HB/(HHS, HHS) xx super = 618 but I’m not recomending it.

500+ damage without using a Super or Ultra!! To me this is the true damage potential of Honda. Ppl say Honda hits hard. I don’t think they have seen a Honda that truely maximizes his damage. These combos only cost you half a bar. So meter is not an issue. If you have ever done c.lp xx hp.HHS xx Super you just use 4 bars for 440 damage. Well for one bar you could do the same damage if you can execute one 1 frame link.

“But if I miss the stupid link I’ll eat a reversal” Well if your opponent is going to try to reversal you between ex.HHS and c.lp why would you go for the 90 damage of the hp.HHS when you could stop block and punish for 300+ damage anyways. “You can’t block and punish against Gief” Why use ex.HHS when you can HHS, HHS, HHS Gief anyways. I’ve been punish more times when I miss HHS, s.hk which is a 3 frame link than from missing the c.lp after EX.HHS link. If you are not able to consistantly hit the link, HHS link EX.HHS still has benefits.

If you miss the link here are the outcomes:

they block
c.mk xx hp.HHS, EX.HHS = 332 damage, blocked c.lp xx hp.HHS = 35 chip for 367 total versus 300 damage of c.mk xx hp.HHS, s.hk
They jump
c.mk xx hp.HHS, EX.HHS = 332 damage, pre-jump hit unscaled c.lp xx hp.HHS = 180 damage for 512 damage
Or you can ochio them
c.mk xx hp.HHS, EX.HHS ~ hp.ochio = 532
You get reversed, shit happens next time bait and punish

All the above is just my opinion and I’m not that good anyway but hopefull better Honda’s can use this info a continue to level up the Fatman.


#6

Akuma

BE PATIENT and dont be discouraged if Akuma lands a BnB or two and runs away. You can easily make up the damage with 1 combo. Your goal is to slowly inch forward and punish mistakes
most akuma’s will usually end up in a corner at some point during a match. You should be looking forward to this. Once there, you prevent teleport and scare akuma with Neutral jump fierce, dash ochio, ex heabutt, ex slam, jump roundhouse trade with airballs, focus or stand fierce chop his dive kicks, etc. dont be too close, or he’ll teleport away. Just about everything works if you’re smart. The closest you should be is about 1.5 character lengths maybe

its probably not a good idea to play with there wake up too often with Slam shenanegans since he can teleport away UNLESS its midscreen…because a teleport pushes them closer to a corner

horrible akuma’s will overuse red fireball. You can punish this easily. If your closer than midscreen you can land a jump-in combo. A tad bit closer and you can also ultra that shit for huge damage

Also, remember evo…Focus Akuma’s stand roundhouse since the last kick whiffs honda

i’m not sure if my friend just sucks and could have punished me or jumped away…but i have hit my friend’s akuma with ochio on blocked stand roundhouse. A better option is probably Jab xx HHS

EDIT: a video with a good idea of how to play the matchup
[media=youtube]ZYnyQpilO6A[/media]


#7

from wut ive seen in training mode

  • only dictators ex headstomp beats hondas air attacks. he can be hit out of his normal headstomps if timed properly. neutral jump hp on reaction to normal head stomps will beat them clean. ex headstomp only beats attacks where you jump forward or neutral. jumping back will beat out ex headstomps if you jump back on reaction to it. also, whenever honda and dictator trade it will always be in hondas favor
  • lp oicho has more range than abels lp command throw
  • rufus cmp beats out ALL of hondas jump ins if properly timed. all buttslams including ex and even his jump in lp/mp

#8

nice start to this thread


#9

MR SNK, props to you for doing the work for this.


#10

It was about bloody time. Can we get an admin to unsticky the old thread?


#11

good shit snk.

there’s a reason you’re the fearless leader of the honda army.


#12

for zangief matchup:

  • EX-Buttslam beats gief’s body splash crossup w/ ease
  • BUT: Zangief can punish ANY blocked buttslam w/ 360, super or ultra, so be careful about abusing it on wakeup because he may do an early crossup, you do buttslam, he blocks the slam and 360 you.

#13

Akuma’s s.HK is neutral on block, so he can likely beat any normals you throw out, depending on the distance between the two of you.


#14

Thx for the tips! I just want to add a few things to some of the match-ups

Vs Boxer
If you are expecting the rog to do non-ex special…I like to throw out random c.mp or s.hp…it seems to stuff them clean.

Vs Gen
"His move off the wall where he comes kicking at you can be countered w/ a headbutt easily"
Are you sure about this?? I always get stuffed by this kick…it seems to high priority…IIRC…i got my ex-headbutt stuffed by this kick before.

What I like to do vs Gen is to avoid the cross-up distance …to me that is what all Gen players are going for… neutral jump(backward) HP will help ALOT… or even jump back HP …

Vs Dictator
"The second hit of headstomp (purple hands) actually loses out to headbutt."
Would like to add that…S.Hp beats it clean too if you don’t have a charge…

Vs Rose
"so throw out a quick oicho against sliders after you block"
Doesn’t a regular throw beats Oicho since all regular throws have start-up of 3 frames and Oicho has start-up of 5? Unless it is ex-oicho then the 5 start-up frames is unthrowable?..I usually just tech throw out of it.


#15

Vs Bison (Dictator)

Ex-headbutt beats out ex & regular headstomp if you connect with your ex-headbutt as late as possible.

If bison goes for headstomp and you block the second hit can be ultra’d, same goes for devils reverse.


#16

then jab xx hands is a good idea to throw out from time to time as a block string or surprise counter hit…since honda’s crouch jab is awesome

too predictable and akuma can DP


#17

Abel’s wheel kick can be stuffed by any of Honda’s punch normals.
I find that c.jab>F.HB is the safest punish against blocked Cammy drill.
Jump back immediate RH is really useful against Gief and Abel when they get close and you need to create space, I even like to do it in the middle of their block strings sometimes since neither of them really incorporate quick low hits I can hold back+up and mash RH and I usually catch them.
If Bison is spamming devils reverse, you can swat him out of the sky with RH Buttslam, but it won’t reach him if he’s doing devil’s reverse immediately on the full end of the screen.


#18

vs C. Viper

"- C.Viper can’t punish blocked FP Headbutt except for w. super so use at will (especially if you can telegraph her earthquake attack)

  • EX-Headbutt beats all of Vipers aerials (I believe) and so does lp headbutt if timed earlier.
  • Do not block crouching too much as c.vipers like to spam the overhead + trip mixup.
  • Ultra+Super are easily punishable by whatever you want.
  • neutral jump + HP is a great counter to jumping boots and her flame kick too. "

she can punish FP headbutt with mp burning knuckle. might have to be stand blocked.

ex headbutt sometimes does not beat flame kicks that are on top of you as opposed to in front or behind you (auto turn around)

i think crouch blocking and trying to react to the overhead is still the way to go. much better to eat the overhead than a sweep that leads to oki, or an ex seismo that can lead to all kinds of crap.

you basically beat her air to air with almost anything you have if you stick it out early enough.
another good move to deal with her flame kicks is to focus them.


#19

Thanks alot for this, MrSNK! You da fuckin man :tup:


#20

awesome work MrSNK, I will be sure to use this.