The NGBC Primer Thread

More Primers I dug up, still can’t find the Hotaru one though…Stuart, thanks dude. :tup:

Goddess Athena NGBC Primer I:

***DG G.Athena Disclaimer: Okay this is one of the characters I have worked hard to make a threat since the game came out in 2005 to PS2. I will share some of the things I do for now but keep in mind things are changing rapidly as I adapt her so much of this stuff though it may apply is not exactly how I play her. I even play her somewhat different than the EVO World vids you saw, and certainly will by NEC8. So dont think just because of what I post you got me figured outHahhaa.

-First thing first know that while Athena does not necessarily need meter, her Meter is valuable! If you want to think how I play Athena, you need to consider Athena how I play her as a mix of Strider, Yun, and Sentinel. While the Strider and Yun may be obvious, I aint telling you the Sentinel, that shall be saved for NEC8!!

  • As far as her specials are concerned, Mermaid Kick DP+K has a lot of priority and very few things beat it as an anti air, it also lands on the opposite side of your opponent blocked, screwing up their timing for combosso keep that in mind. I prefer DP+D over DP+b because I track the opponent and land in their face when they tech or wakeup.
    -Shield Flip (qcb+A/C)- Another one of her best moves. Why? This move not only crosses up your opponents but is AN OVERHEAD. So yeah it must be blocked high, on top of this though its not totally safe only a few things can punish it off GCFS ONLY. This move can also be used as an Anti-Air if timed right as you will see me do. Mix up Shield Flip (overhead, crosses up, cant tech it if it hits!) with her slide and a throw and you got a SOLID WAKEUP GAME.
    -Reflect- Another one of Athenas best moves. It has more priority than MERMAID KICK. It can be used as an Anti Air and where Mermaid Kick fails, this will either beat it straight up or TRADE at the worst. Whats best about this move in addition to what I said? This is what you need to use for battery and in addition to this, this move is ANTI-CROSSUP…thus meaning those that like to crossup like Kim and do Backturned Tricksthis will stop it!!

-BNB Athena combos-
a. cr.bx2 to B/D Mermaid Kick (Low)
b. cr.bx3 to b/D Mermaid Kick (Low)
c. cr.ax2 to Mermaid Kick (High- hence why I DONT USE IT)
d. St.ax2 to Mermaid Kick (High- Use it rarely)
e. St ax2 to Deadly Assault (A DG Specialty of mineif I get this I get FREE HEALTH)

DG Free Health Parlor Trick #1- After a Deadly Assault because you wakeup backturned plus you cannot tech DAs PLUS you are on the other side of the screen, Plant a Heal Plant (down, down A+C) and then slide underneath it to get the health. To make it even more consuming, I now slide into Reflect so that if they throw a projectile or jump it will reflect or they will get hit. You have enough time to slide and block and get the health. Dont think this is all the Athena Parlor tricks I have, I have MANY MANY Parlor Tricks with Athena, I aint saying them all quite yet! Also by doing reflect after slide to catch the plant you build your SUPER METER, meaning yes its almost glitchy…hehe…you build health AND build meter at the same time!

DG Free Meter Trick #2- If you are full on health or satisfied with your health, you need to plant the Super Gauge Plant- (down, down B+D), which looks the same as the Heal Plant andTHE INFAMOUS BOMB PLANT. Getting ideas here…aha alas you see they all look the same hehehe. Now slide and grab the Gauge plant which will give you a meter of super, then do reflect and watch your super gauge practically explode…its almost broken how much meter you gain total…

The Fire vs. the Tornado-
-I know you all been waiting for some of my Fire tricks. Well first I need to tell you rarely if EVER use Athenas Tornado (qcfx2+C) over the fire because the tornado once you hit her out of it IT DISSAPEARS…not the case with Athena’s Fire(qcfx2 +A). You can release Athenas fire onto your opponents via doing another qcfx2+a, doesnt cost a meter. Same with Tornado, do another qcfx2 +C to release. Fire is much better because it creates hit stun, follows a long distance, HURTS, and doesnt launch the opponent high like the follow tornado where you cannot do anything to them until they wake up!!!

Goddess Athena Primer II:

Things you may need to know about Goddess Athena moreso-

-As Beast of Fire says, you can knock her out of the fire on startup and a fierce enough combo will knock her out of it as well. But if you anticipate this you will space yourself correctly as I do to Activate (What I will call putting the fire on from here on out) If you watch closely I Space myself before Activating if I need towhich in turn causes the opponent to rush me to try and use stuff like Bigs Cr. DxxBison Torpedo (Dont whiff versus Tung BITCHES!! ) or Kims cr.b to stop it…PUHLEASSE…I dont fear that shit anymore…since seeing it May 5th Ive come up with quite a few ways to get around it! Cough TRIAD I will give you one of my older ways right now-
-Bait their poke and release the Flame to them! This will not only hurt them but will make them think twice about rushing to combo low. This will slow them down. There are MANY other ways that I will elaborate on later.

Also know that Mermaid Kick, Reflect, or Throws will cause the Fire in Activation to dissipate…so DONT USE THEM WHILE IN ATHENAS FLAME…

Something else to know about the fire- It has an add on you can only do if you have 2 supers total. So say you have 2 supers, then you again access to the Fire Add on and the Tornado Add on- Which both are FIRE TORNADOES. The difference? The Fire Tornado from the flame (qcfx2 C after Activation) stays on you for a little while, and should it hit it launches and you are right there to juggle/reset after it (Watch one of my matches vs. Mago or my first ever match vs. Cajunstrike in NEC7)

-The Tornado Fire Tornado (Yeah sounds redundant, do it by first doing qcfx2c, then doing the Fire Tornado with qcfx2 A), travels full screen but also launches the opponent for comboability. This is really the ONLY reason to use the tornado Activation AT ALL.

Akari NGBC Primer I:

Akari has some of the best standing jabs in the game. Her bnb mixup is the following:
A. st. ax2 to hcb+p command grab (Hit)
B. Hcb+p Command Grab
-C.Cr.B to Command Grab (Low)

This alone will get you far…esp since her jabs are very good and stuff a lot of stuff on wakeup.

Strat rules about Akari

-Rule #1: As great and funny as the Ghost Train super (Level 2 qcfx2 p) is its only really useful in combovideos and in certain situations. I wouldnt use it unles they are reall low on health and I’d use it as an anti Air or off “certain situations” I’d get into later.

Rule #2- Use her parries instead or even better…down, up +D, to her guaranteed followup which is down, up and the same kick button pressed for the original move to get her addon which the opponent CANNOT tech and you can super cancel into qcbhcf+C Ride the Dragon Super. This is perfect for countering Tung’s Dive Kick also as she actually is a good counter for Tung just because of this shit… doing two of these into Super Cancel Ride the Dragon is hella better and more damage plus more practical than ONE LEVEL 2 GHOST TRAIN…

I learnt this after a good while playing with her.

Last part for the first Primer- The infamous Guardcrush Loop-

Theres a Single and Double Guardcrush Loop as well as more advanced tricks like Karacancel Loops…but for now the Single GuardCrush Loop is:

  • [Cr.C to begin, qcb+k command run, ], then repeat brackets.

Shiki Primer I:

Shiki is a bit of a gimmicky character, but I’m finding out she’s more solid than I originally thought. She does excel in any matchup where her dash stab move (qcb+A/B/C) can go under their projectile or pokes and that move leads to good damage.

Learn dash stab C version > C > cancel to uppercut > cancel to dive. It all combos, but you have to do the inputs pretty fast. There’s no reason to just do the stab by itself or stab > C by itself, really. Also note that unless they AB step and throw out something fast enough, dash stab is SAFE so long as you don’t do the C followup (the launcher/flashkick thing that you cancel into dp/dive).

Her dp by itself sucks. You can do it in the air, but you’re better off using D for air to air. That’s not really strong either though.

Teleports are good. All four buttons are separate teleports. You can cancel into dive or dp after C and D version teleports for an overhead/limited anti air. I mostly used these to get around shit, though (Robert, Marco).

Command grab is good. Really good. You can combo into it after one-hit close C, which is a good punish if their other character is already dead and they can’t switch out to avoid the command grab effects (directional inputs are reversed for them if you didn’t know, as long as the skull is over their head).

Reset into command grab:
Dash stab > followups with C > either command throw or close D for an overhead into either:
far D > D assault
another dash stab

qcb+D is an overhead. Crack Shoot, basically. Recovery is okay, you can’t combo off of it, and there’s only one (useless) way to combo into it, which is one hit close C. I don’t even know why that works.

Stupid purify blockstring that I invented mid-match at NEC:
cr.A > cr.B > qcbD. It’s incredibly stupid. On a cr.B hit, you can do level 2 super for LIFE.

Pokes are good. cr.A, cr.B, st.B (RANGE). They’re fast. cr.A combos into cr.B. The slash chain (st.A > st.B > cr.A > cr.B) is mediocre, but there if you want to use it and land a st.A. If you could dash stab or DA after this, it’d be a lot better.

DA (Double/Dual/Deadly Whatever Assault) combos: close D > far D > DA. Best use of the D moves, by the way. You have to connect these fairly close, or the pushout will make your DA whiff. Otherwise, anything that combos into dash stab will also combo into DA.

Supers: I have no idea why dash stab super is there. Normal dash stab combo does the same damage, basically. I guess if you’re lazy/want to run the timer down, go for that. The other super is the real cheese, it’s fast, has great priority and steals life. She also orgasms or something. A good super, all in all. Hard to punish. Best use of meter, well…only use of meter imo.

Etc: far C is slow. It CAN combo into dash stab or DA if you hit close with it, rarely will you use this however. cr.C is a sweep and…that’s about it. Cr.D is NOT, but is a two hit combo starter. It’s the main method of comboing into dash stab, for me. If you hit a close C, remember, one-hit close C combos into command throw. If they can’t tag, do that instead of dash stab combo.

Ai Primer Version I:

  • Before you go on trying to tackle her infinite…you need to know the basics of Ai first.
  • Her bnb combo is Cr.b, cr.a, df+D to qcb+p Bat…this can link into the qcbx2 p super.
  • Another variation of her bnb is st.b to Df+C to bat to ourobouros.
  • -Ai doesnt have a really good Sweep…so be careful.
  • The bat reflects projectiles…builds good battery by itself and is a good thing to use.
  • Her teleport is good and its qcf+k…one button makes her actually teleport while the other is a fake…
  • Her OuroBouros Super is good for rush down and can be released I believe by doing another qcbx2+p to release it.
  • Her Joy Joy Balloon is mid-air ABC in the air…D dismounts and can dismount via a crossup…this is key for mastering the infinite. If you Press D again after the first D she will do a dive kick that will crossup.
  • Pressing ABC again while on the Joy Joy Balloon will make it explode.
  • Forward+ C is a good normal to use as well.
  • Far St. D is a good poke to use sparingly with Ai also.

Shishioh Primer I:

-Hes the glitchiest character in the game…
-He has a LOT of bnbs…most of them from Kizuna Encounter.

  • One of them is
    -Here are some of my tricks- MoonWalking- st.b to cr.A and it will seem like he is moonwalking but he is staying in the SAME PLACE.
    -DG glitch frame trap- St. BxxDp+C-Shishioh will glitch out and go into an Auto Combo series which will end with a DP+C Sword or something else…proof it is glitchy…if it hits it HURTS.
    -Frame Trap #3- Infinite Jab Series- Repeat [st.a to st.b] xn repeat brackets
    -Japanese bnb- cr.a to cr.b to f+C to qcf+a, finish with qcbhcf+C Super. The timing is different on this but trust me it WORKS.
  • His counter (qcf+k) only counters HIGHS and Overheads…it is vulnerable to lows. You can also Supercancel out of it into qcbhcf+p super.
    -His cr.b is a low use it to link into his punch series.
    -If they dont tech know that after a launcher (f+a) the C Sword (Dp+C) is FREE serious damage.

**Hotaru Primer I:

Hotaru: -cr.D can be kara cancelled into virtually anything -cr.B, cr.A, st.A all have massive priority -df+C can be jump cancelled -jump D is used for crossups. lots of priority. -has air chains from jump A or B to C -air knee special is hard to punish without a gcfs -DA will combo after her standing D break in her backturned stance -kick flip from phoenix stance is great aa -first hop of her C super has invicibility -B super is faster than the D version -qcb+p is good to bait gcfs, and then punish the gcfs with her B super, as is the A attack from the backturned stance -f+B when used alone has auto-gaurd at startup, and if counter hits will wall bounce -incredible dash -Hotaru’s B&B’s do a lot of damage, and are easily confirmable -I play her with a lot of mixup and throw setups, as it’s easy to cut off her chains, stances, etc. and then go for dash in->throw

Hotaru Primer II:

Last time I started with what you can do after her bnb launcher combo. I forgot to throw in that you also can do her Deadly Assault after the launcher combo. After a Deadly Assault most Hotarus throw a fireball because she can rush after it.

Also some more tidbits for you, if you are facing the corner you might wanna do an airthrow after the bnb combo so that your opponent lands in the corner so you can start the SieClayton/Keeroc Command Grab/Bnb combo mixup.

Random tidbits- Notice that the Japanese use cr.ax2 to link into df+c, C DxxBreak with Hotaru.

Also know that Hotarus least used move is:

Enter Backturned stance (BT Stance), There are 2 ways to do it-

  1. 1-Get into AOP Stance (Down A+C), then press Back B+D.
  2. 2- Press Df+C, then with her back facing you you are in backturned stance.

After this press forward, forward B+D in Backturned stance…this is the move least used

If this hits near the corner at a certain angle you can combo into Bnb Combo!

Other Misc. Things-

Watch out whoring Hotarus air qcb+k move…

Its fine at the beginning of the round or when your opponent does NOT have meter…

But when your opponent DOES have meter than can easily GCFS it.

Cajunstrike FRX Hotaru tricks Once again proof Cajun…you try this shit man and Im looking for it or I break it almost on reaction!!!

Cajunstrike will go into Backturned stance, and do her A attack three times in a row to catch you slipping. He will stop at the 3rd time though! LOL. Or between the 2nd and 3rd rep he will try to throw you from BT stance…

So yes get the Cajun loop down- Thats BT stance A, (which makes you go to AOP stance) get back to BT stance by pressing back B+D, then repeat.

Her Overhead- Get into AOP Stance- Down A+C, then press D.

In the corner you CAN combo off of it

Thats right… the overhead creates a stun…CROUCHING OR NOT.

So you can combo into cr.bxxdf+C, DxxBreak (A+C) whatever

Triad will after a blocked bnb go into AOP stance and almost IMMEDIATELY do the overhead…all of them do it…Lucious (SieClayton), Cajun, P-Soul…its like habit…so I train my eye to see that pattern as they do and block high after a blocked BNB.

Also know that Hotaru CANNOT block in both AOP and BT stance…so if they wanna play that game PUNISH THEIR ASS!

Also know that Hotarus Crossover is Jump D…use it.use Jump-in D a lot too…has good priority.

For fun- A Texas Showdown 6 Hotaru combo-

Do her BNB, but instead of finishing with St.C to D, after DF+C, press A (Yes part of Cajuns loop this is how he gets into it to start his TRIPLE BT A SHIT) then finish the combo with a Sweep

sorry, I wrote the iori one too. :sweat:

Ummm guys;


How do you ADD a character?

Yo, Jester: Copy the primer from that. It’s the primer but when I found it, it wasn’t labelled primer…


behold my shitty primer skills

The ultimate juggle list it up.

I’ll edit in the commands friday morning.

You should also have a small section to explain what Ultimate Juggles are.

Alright. I just did it. Thanks for the heads up.

The Wiki incorrectly has Kyo’s Ultimate Juggle posted for Iori “Iori Yagami: 100 Shiki: Oniyaki [A]” by the way, does Iori have an Ultimate Juggle?

Edit: Didn’t realize Iroi and Kyo DP’s shared the same name. :sweat:

Chonrei NGBC Primer I:

  • Bnb is A,B,C, DP+C or hcbx2 p super.
  • Use hcbx2 p super to punish things.
  • Use his forwards roll (qcf+k) and backwards roll (qcb+k) to rush the opponent.
  • His Jump C is godlike in priority for jumpins.
  • When you use his Ball Super (qcfx2+p) use the C version for further distance…put them in blockstun and if they are blocking high go low, and viceversa.
  • DP+C is a good Anti Air for Chonrei.
  • F+b is his overhead.

**Chonshu NGBC Primer I:

  • Bnb #1- St.Cx3. forward, back+C.
  • Bnb #2- st.a to cr.b (2 hits) to DA.
  • Bnb #3- St.C (2 hits) to f,f +a.
  • Use Chonshus teleport games to mixup.
  • You must use everything Chonshu has to stand a chance, Chonrei is better overall.
  • Corner Loop- [Dp+C to qcfx2 p) repeat brackets until run out of meter.
  • DP+C is Chonshus Ultimate Juggle.
  • The flash combo with Chonshu- Dp+K is not in Chonshus command list. Combo into Dp+k and then do another hcb+k with the same button to watch Chonshu teleport in the air.

Mudman NGBC Primer:

-Instant dive kicks are king…its instant overheads and very abusable. Vs. Big though be careful.

  • His bnb low combo to mixup with Overheads- cr.b,cr.a, df+D/C? I believe. Also mix in running throw with this mixup also.
    -Zone with high and low fireballs with qcf+p/k.
    -Zone 98 Iori style throwing low running man fireballs and if they jump doing his qcfx2p running man super to punish them jumping.
    -He can float in the air with ABC and then come down to qcb+k, then to dive kick…its a DG patented trick I use.
    -He has horrible matchups vs. Tung and Big… Big’s lariat takes away Dive Kick free…Tungs Anti Air Muscleman takes the shit away also…so be careful…its not in your best interests.

A lot of the Mai and Shiki stuff is outdated, incorrect there’s new stuff etc, I’m going to get on writing complete guides soon.

Cool, post em up in here and I’ll edit accordingly.

You need to since you are the resident Mai-Shiki user…


In regards to the comment about Yuki having no good, anti-air.

His Submarine Screw (dp+P) is decent when charged and acts like a Shoryuken with invincibility frames at start up, hits 7 times on standing opponents, 6 on juggled.

It can also OTG for a single hit.

However it has really bad recovery (his charged Submarine Screw has perhaps the worst recovery out of all of his special moves due to the long animation and start up)

There lies the problem: IT MUST BE CHARGED. Without charge it gets beaten easily. Even if you land the hits more than likely Yuki to will get hit.

Something I found funny about Yuki’s guard break string(base cr.D>Sub.Screw) is that you can hit after the cr.D between Sub Screw. As such Yuki doesn’t really have a guard crush string at all.

another problem with Yuki is that he doesnt have a “good” combo that uses 1 meter or 2, like lets say Moriya or Kim.

Hey man, finally caught your Shiki/Mai matches that DG put up from a while back, nice. Was wondering if you could do another Shiki Primer/Guide to add to the list? Looked like you had some good shit going on in those matches, I’d be very interested in reading up on it. Thanks.

Yuki doesn’t have any good combos period.

Or really good anything. aside kara-IAD’s.

You can do standing c (one hit) dash cancel into another close standing C. It does so-so guard bar damage but iirc you can’t cancel it into Sub.Screw. Give it a try.

You could probably do close d > dash cancel > standing close C (2 hits) Give it a try.

Maybe standing d > dash cancel > mutation combination or wtf it’s called (his command combo)

Yuki sucks. I’ll admit. But he’s SNK’s Sentai so he’s leet as fuck in my book. Plus I like his hair.

Note: Iunno what the “technical term” for the dash cancel is but it’s doing command roll while attacking. DG told me the name a while ago but I fucking forgot so I just call it dash or blue cancel.

Actually my Shiki guide just got put up on gamefaqs, it has almost everything I know about her. And those NEC matches were nothing compared to my work at FR and what I’m just now perfecting. :china:

Good shit Brent…:tup: Look forward to playing you and running that MM back again.

Heres the Mudman Primer I just posted.

Nice man, printed that out for reading material at lunch tonight. :tup:

Hey DG, think you could do a few more primers over the next few weeks? I know they are basic, but we have about 3/4 of the roster covered now for just that. Would be nice to have everyone and put it inot one big file or something. No rush, just an idea. BTW, your Jin Twin info was great, it helped me start a foundation for my own style, they are now one of my favorite and better teams. Between me and my friend, we have almost the whole roster at a somewhat above scrub level to pretty decent. Gonna try to make MWC to finally meet and also so me and my friend can play some different people.