The "Official" SSBM Thread


#1

First off, I want to make one thing clear about the indoctrine of this thread:

This is not a thread about discussing why or why not you may feel Smash is/isn’t a legitimate fighting game. This is a gameplay discussion thread.

If you have any thoughts on the afformentioned issue, post them here: http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?t=73551&page=1&pp=15

…and we’ll deal with it in that thread.

With that said, the last thread showed that there is indeed some interest to be found in this game at SRK, so I’d like to see how a thread like this would fare around these parts.

I’ll try my best to answer any and all gameplay related questions, and if I can’t answer them, I’ll attempt to point you in the proper direction to find them.

Viva’ La’ Smash.

-CynicaL


Super Smash Bros. General - Patience and Spacing....or Whine and Moan
#2

God bless you for making this thread.

-The Demon


#3

Here’s hoping it sticks around for a while

:cheers:

-Syn


#4

Ok, Noob here to Ask Qs; I’m tired of getting pummeled by my 10yo cousin:

  1. What’s the control Layout supposed to acomplish?
    (As in how’s it designed) I’ve a hard time getting used to it…

  2. Which are the non-so-basic movs?
    (Like parry, RC, triangle jump, Guard Impact in other games)

  3. Are there any established tiers?
    (I’ve heard pikachu is really high, is it true?)

Hope this isn’t too basic.


#5

The control layout is designed so that moves can come out eassily since the game isnt about how complicated the moves are, but how you use them. Also you should try and master jumping with the X and Y buttons rather then by pressing up on the stick, it allows you to get the most out of your jumps.

Some of the advanced moves include Small Jumping, Wave dancing, Wave Dashing, Reflecting, R cancelling, Wall Clinging, Air Item Grabbing, turtle grapling ect. as well as some character specific tricks such as Fox’s infinite and the Bowser Train.

Top Tier:

Zelda/Shiek
Ganondorf
Falco
Marth

Mid Tier:

Captain Falcon
Mario
Dr. Mario
Fox
Link
Samus
Young Link
Peach
Bowser
Mewtwo

And then there is everybody else.


#6

I’ve played this game for almost a year now, still a scrub since I haven’t got anyone seriously interested to train against.

Jaldaboath’s questions:

  1. In my opinion, it’s perfectly designed for the GC controller, which is designed to make learning games simple. You have two jumps buttons depending on your preference, you can jump with the stick if that’s your thing, you have two parry buttons also identical, you have the Z-button for the lightest shield or for grabbing, the sizes of the attack button reflect their importance (IMO), the C-stick can be used for instant smashes. I think the main point of the design is accessability for everyone though.

  2. I’ll let someone else explain these for you, since I’m not very good at it. The names: shield canceling (usually called L-canceling), short hopping, fast falling, directional influence, shieldgrabbing, wavedashing (making a short hop and air-dodgning diagonally into the ground) and SHFFLing (also called shuffling, it’s short hop fast fall shield canceling, basically you do air moves will barely moving from the ground) are the most important techniques. Here’s a compendium: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=42749

  3. This is the latest tier list I think: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=34838

Edit: beaten. :frowning:


#7

The Demon the tiers have changed since you last time you checked:

Top Tier:
-Sheik
-Marth

2nd Tier:
-Samus
-Falco
-Capt. Falcon
-Fox
-Princess Peach
-Dr.Mario
-Luigi
-Roy
-Jigglypuff

3rd Tier:
-Gannondorf
-Ness
-Mewtwo
-Mario
-Link
-Zelda
-Donkey Kong
-Ice Climbers
-Kirby:sad:
-Pikachu

Dirt:
-Mr.Game&Watch
-Pichu
-Bowser


#8

Only thing I can say is: Master the L recover first. This will evolve your game past scrub tactics on so many levels, its amazing. After that master short hop, then learn how to shffl (short hop fast fall l recover) all of your air moves.

Look at Smashboards.com for character strats and techs


#9

actually, the “latest” tier list from samshboards is as follows. Note that this list is actually 6 months old, and the smash community has had several major tournaments (TG6, MELEE-FC, and more) that have at least somewhat changed many players’ views about several characters (let’s just say ice climbers are likely to rise next time we re-do things). Here’s the “current” list.

Top
Shiek
Fox
Marth

Upper
Falco
Peach
Captain Falcon
Samus
Jigglypuff

High
Gannondorf
Mario
Dr. Mario
Luigi

Mid
Link
Pikachu
Ice Climbers
Roy
Zelda
Young Link
Yoshi

Lower
Ness
Donkey Kong
Kirby
Geedubya
Mewtwo

Bottom
Bowser
Pichu

As for the other questions

The layout is designed to be simple. A for basic attacks, B for specials, L/R for block and such. If you’re having any trouble with the basics smash actually has a pretty good tutorial video that you can view on the game itself. However, one basic thing might help you more than anything else - don’t think of it directly as a fighter, think of it (initially at least) as a platform game, like mario 3 or some such. It makes the controls easier to adjust to initially (which was why I picked up the first smash brothers so fast).

For a lot of the more specialized names and such, I reccomend that you check the compendium of knowledge topic thing here - http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=42749
Also, for a pretty good explanation of some of the details with this, you can look up the video opera article about smash brothers at http://www.video-opera.com/features/f0011.php If you have any questions about any particular tactic I can give you details, but to go into everything would be a waste of my time and your time with the two links avaiable.

I’m definitely willing to help answer anyone’s questions.


#10

how do you do fox’s infinite, i’ve never been able to figure out what it was.


#11

Eh, I’m no Fox expert, so I’m not gonna try and explain it to you. He has about 5-6 different types of infinites, all rediculously hard to do. Here’s a thread at our forums discussing it:

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=37321

My advice is to not get too caught up in trying to learn them now. They’re rediculously hard to do and actually apply in pressure situations (i.e. when actually playing a human). Fox is already the most technically demanding character in the game without the infinites. They’re worth practicing, but to be honest, not even the best Fox players can do them consistantly in a macth, so I’d suggest waiting a good while until you’re comfortable with the more fundamental aspects of Fox (i.e. his more difficult than average shorthop).

x1372:

Can you, or anyone else explain to me how to make links to videos off my hard drive? I think it’d be cool have a few links to some videos in this thread; like a vid of Fox’s infinite for Sid for example, and not to mention some cool match vids, that show off what Smash is actually like at high levels (“Ken Defeated” instantly comes to mind).

_Syn


#12

ONE time, I will say this.

Submit the best 3 Smash high-level match videos you have to CV.com, and I will endorse them. One time. If people genuinely like them, then after that it’s up to Blaze.

N - Ugg, I can taste the bile.


#13

Thongboy, I’d be so there if I knew how to put up the vids. Could you point me in the direction, I could find an explaination on how to do it?

I’ll also make a thread at Smashboards to get the communitiy’s ideas on what they feel the top three matches to represent high level play would be, Give me a little time.

I think that it’s awesome that you’d consider doing that. Thanks alot.

-Syn


#14

fox infinite:

2B -> [3]X,R (repeat, X,R is almost as fast as roll cancelling)

I believe if you get sicknasty enough at it you can go across a whole level and then 8+A launch them for the kill.

fox and marth have one of the best up close moves in the whole game with 2B (shine, reflect, etc). it comes out really fast, hits in every direction, is jump cancellable. you can crazy shit like jump, 2B, jump, 2B, 8B and it combos.


#15

Haha, I hate SSBM, but then again, I’m biased etcetera. I don’t have to like everything, the site’s not just for me.

If you AIM combovideos, you can send them directly to him and he will upload them himself. Otherwise, you can PM me and I’ll do it.

N


#16

A word of warning for the Fox-player: Since you’re a fast faller, you should learn how to DI (directional influence) properly. A Peach-player can chainthrow you upwards from 0-70% if you don’t DI out of the way.


#17

I don’t know if it ranks anywhere near the top three videos, but Captain Jack’s Ganondorf ditto match on Final Destination is pretty entertaining.


#18

I do tend to disagree with part of that list, I would definately put Ganondorf higher just based on my experience playing lots of people, but then again what do I know? He is just beastly and Im not entirely sure how anyone could put him in the third tier, at least to me he’s clearly tops.


#19

Ganondorf is definitely an excellent character (and for the record, I put him a bit higher in my vote about the tier list last time) but he’s just not QUITE good enough to be a tier above where he is. He’s got a ton of good things about him, but it’s just not GREAT like some of the characters above him.

Sheik is the game’s best at combos. Marth has his awesome range and tipper power. Fox has extremely good combos, and the best rush-in in the game if you can get the timing perfect. Falco has his short hop blaster and his killer spike. Peach is the priority queen. Captain Falcon’s speed and short hop knee are an extremely lethal combination. Samus’ recovery, projectiles, and misdirection make her extremely difficult to play against. Jigglypuff’s wall of pain is almost impossible to get around when done properly.

Ganondorf has a lot going for him, but it’s just not QUITE enough to get him up into the next tier. He has power and quickness, but most characters can keep just out of his range when played well. Also, when he’s off the cliff, he’s dead. At least captain falcon’s jumping is a bit quicker to sometimes help him recover before his opponent can set up an edge guard, but ganondorf gives his opponent all the time in the world to set up an edge guard. There’s only one really notable ganondorf player who has done well at several tournaments, and that’s Eddie from Chicago. However, even eddie hasn’t done too well at some of the latest tournaments, at least in part because so many players can take advantage of dorf’s weaknesses.

oh, and as for the match videos thing, we’re working on determining which ones to give ya TB.


#20

n00b question: What is chain throwing? Is it like when you juggle a character off a throw and then go from the juggle to another throw?

Also, can anyone give me a wave-dash tutorial?

Oh and since no one’s mentioned it, I will. CC(crouch cancelling) is really important. And Samus’s is GODLY.