The Painwheel Reset Thread

painwheel

#1

Ok so I’m just going to catalogue Painwheels on hit mixups here as i know them. This isnt so much to help out forum regulars so much as people that are new to her and having a thread like this is always good to go over once in awhile just to refresh and maybe add something into your game that you have forgotten about.

Since there is no hitstun decay in this game, all resets can be practiced outside of combos making them that much easier to apply in game.

First a combo that i think people new to her should start out with as it is easy even in a decent amount of lag and perfectly sets up multiple reset opportunities and does decent damage for its ease of use t is my go to combo in lag followed by my full combo that i do when i can kill or just to show an opponent that i do have the skill to do a full combo (cause i rarely do full combos with her)

1.cr.lk,cr.mk,st.hp xx flight F+mk (land) cr.lk,cr.mk,st.hp xx qcf+LP (unshakeable stagger)
4092 damage when dash st.lp is added at the end, 4500 damage when dash st.lp,stmp, j.mp (4) is added at the end. for how easy this is it should probably be painwheels goto reset starter.

  1. cr.lk,cr.mk,st.hp xx flight F+MK (land) cr.lk,cr.mk,st.hp xx flight DF + LK (land) cr.lp,cr.mk,st.hp xx flight DF + LP (land) cr.mp (4 hits) st.hp xx QCF +LP (dash forward) st.lp,st.mp, j.mp (4), j.hp (2 or 3), j.hk (land) st.lk,cr.mk,st.hp xx DD+K xx super

7489 damage, variable cause of how many times j.hk hits towards the end. the only tough spot in the combo besides muscle memory is the link to cr.mp after the DF +j.lp and the air juggle has weird timing for different characters and can be somewhat random. both combos arent position specific as they work in and out the corner. when the second combo is easy it might be time to move onto her cr.fp loops.

Ok so those are the combos, for the second combo the resets generally happen right after the QCF + + LP but i sometimes mix them up earlier.

Anywho on to the resets im not going to order these from most effective to least, though where i know the info i will try to show where they are character specific:

st.lp,st.mp xx flight UF + j.mp (land) throw or low (doesnt work on double or bella) basically the j.mp crosses the opponent up underneath allowing painwheel to attack from the other side as they are landing… combine this with a pillar or updo for some nice effects.

st.lp,st.mp xx flight DF+LK (land) immediate forward jump throw. only works on double with absolute ridiculously good timing, very hard versus bella as well, though i havent practiced it against either in awhile, i can swear i did it once or twice to each… though it may have been a fluke or im trippin. either way it works very easily versus the rest of the cast beware the mash, this is for swag only, very high chance this wont work ive only gotten it off a few times. Leave for people that are mindfucked or are simply not as good as you are. The best thing about this is that it is a very fun way to practice converting painwheels airthrows in training mode.

st.lp,st.mp, j.mp (4) xx flight DF airthrow. Pretty self explanatory, doesnt work versus double and hard to make work versus bella.

st.lp,st.mp j.mp (4) xx flight, j.hk (crossup or non crossup) the reset i go for once people start teching the airgrab… people get hit by this all day. its practically free.

Tertiary options for the j.mp xx flight reset are DF+MK call pillar or updo as you do the j.mk… the j.mk will wiff and the opponent will get crossed up by the assist plus if they press a button free blow up… take your free otg.

And same thing to try and frame trap the airtech from the first option only stay in front this time.

st.lp (slight delay) cr.lk or throw (evil dirty shit right here) basic 50/50 throw/low mixup that cant be chicken blocked.

st.lp xx flight DF+LP basic overhead option, safe to many mashed out supers, can be made even more safe from doing it from st.lp,cr.mk since cr.mk has more hitstun but the overhead still wont combo. problem there is that there is literally no mixup… its just a trick/ aggressive option for baiting mashed super.

Air or ground throw xx flight j.lp plus assist xx flight, crossup j.hk… a stupid reset, but worth it once in awhile for myself atleast, i just want people panicking and the more resets they get hit by the more they panic. can totally be done without the assist.

the same reset is available after cr.fp.

st.hk (2) DF + airthrow… credit Mynus doesnt work against double or bella afaik though is pretty easy versus the rest of the cast, this is a damn good reset. Can be mixed up into crossup j.hk.

st.fp xx flight UF +j.hk… crossup reset versus a grounded character, doesnt work versus certain standing characters.

So thats it for now, if i remember anymore gimmicky bullshit that actually hits people i’ll post them when i remember them, please feel free to post any and all of the resets you guys use as well.

-dime


#2

reserved


#3

From st.hp, you can do flight df j.mk, which won’t come out and allow you to land and go low/throw. I’m a fan of doing this after threatening so many overheads.

From throw (or any similar situation where you’re restanding like cr.hp) do fly, hit them with something (lp,lk, mk, doesn’t matter), xx fly AND call assist at the same time, go nuts. This mixup gives you 2 chances to go left/right (depending on the assist it might be more), but it’s just nice because I like to fly around like an idiot and this makes it difficult to smack her out of the air.

I always try to use different points to reset, and that’s where PW get’s to shine. No other character can put a reset anywhere as easily as she can. Being creative with where you put your reset is just as important, if not moreso than what the reset actually is.


#4

i already have the bolded up there in the list. do you find that that first reset you posited works? i tried them out awhile back but it just loses to mashes and upback all day in my experience… ive tried to make it work but never had any success.

i also totally agree with the last part of your post, its not so much what reset you do as long as you keep them highly varied and mixup the places you do them.

-dime


#5

Yeah the first isn’t a go to that I always use, but like I said once I threaten with overheads enough people tend to stick to the ground.


#6

My painwheel putting in dat work.


#7

Thanks to Mike Z for dicking around in training mode before the most recent patch demo on “The Mix-up” and giving me ideas that led to the resets below. These require a combo into s.mp and an unregistered j.lp to avoid triggering the IPS.

  1. s.mp, j.lp xx fly, df air grab/up + j.lk - Combos ending in a s.mp can turn into a really good aerial 50/50. Throw on hit turns into combo, j.lk on hit can chain into j.mk and re-stand. It’s iffy against Double/Bella ofc, but works pretty well vs every-one else.

  2. s.mp, j.lp, j.lk, j.mk, j.hp (early chain cancel into…), j.hk, land into low/grab OR j.hk xx fly into overhead - A re-stand reset that you can stick to the end of a long combo string, so you still deal damage & gain meter before going into the guessing game. If you still have a light available, you can continue the combo on the ground and reset from there.

  3. s.mp, j.lp, j.lk, j.mk xx fly, j.mk , charge j.hp - This is an aerial burst bait which I’ve shamelessly lifted. The second j.mk triggers the IPS and an instant burst is absorbed by the Hatred Guard on the j.hp. You can then air grab the recovery. I haven’t looked beyond a failed bait though, since this is one I rarely use (I prefer grounded baits with Hatred Guard…and missing the punish every time >_<).

I’ll be posting whatever comes to mind with the hope that it will be enough to kick start the forums.


#8

Nice stuff view, though i dont think i will be using any of those they are nice. New POST PATCH RESET ONLY:

Thati just came up with yesterday… Dont worry, this shit will work

St.mp,j.lp,j.lk, j.fp (wiffs over falling opponent) air hk reaper crossup jst as they touch the ground then fly cancel into full combo(cant fly cancel pre patch :frowning: )

I should start compiling all the other various resets ive found… Painwheel has like literally a million of them, almost unworthy of trying to list them, though if there are people interested in new stuff i will post what i have.

-dime


#9

For that, can you fly instead of fierce, then go for cross-up reaper + assist call to cover a correct block?


#10

Yeah but it will be ALOT slower… Ive been trying to come up with some launch into fly left/rights but nothng so far is fast enough… Te one i posted will be good if not abused though and its very fast.

-dime


#11

I have another reset variation that can end in a left/right mix-up on a falling opponent. Then there’s the 2-hit s.hk xx fly cross-up for grounded opponents. I’ll post them up later.


#12

The st.hk crossup is already briefly mentioned in the original post.

If you eant to see why i dont like resets that start with jumping hk… Look up jontlemen versus ddsoul… Jontleman uses like 5 resets to kill a character and uses j.hk resets almost exclusively…

-dime


#13

I saw some of that and I’ve played both of them in the past. Jontleman doesn’t maximize damage on his openings, so where you see five resets starting from j.hk, he only needed like 2-3 to kill a duo character (j.hk into full combo should do around 40-50% with a super at the end). Add that to the fact that ddsoul cannot defend/ the j.hk resets were practically free and you see why he worked it so often. There were also some really bad reset choices in that set (going for resets instead of just doing the super/dhc and killing, etc).

I missed the st.hk cross-up in the original post, sorry. I hear you on the damage scaling caused by the j.hk, but it’s not like your combo does no damage (unless you’re squeezing a lot of early light attacks into it).


#14

That may be so, but im thinking in forward terms. Specifically at ips has been neefed which means damage is nerfed, and the fact that throw starters and resets are now scaled to 50% damage… When we look at it that way, painwheels reset game is nerfed heavily as far as damage is concerned cause throw and j.hk account for much of her reset starters, and both scale damage… So imho the thing to be doing now is trying to find non throw/j.hk reset starters.

So this would be the hk buer crossup, cr.lk, and overhead starters plus whatever more we can find. Not to say that j.hk and throw should be eliminated… Just that they should be steered away from as resets and more used as blockstring starters/neutral game starters. Funnily enough i dont currently use any j.hk resets. For me its all low/throw and i have a million different variations for that… But im having to switch them up now cause i recently have switched from lk bomber to hk and mk bomber cause ive thrown peacock on my team.

-dime


#15

Yeah, single hit starters do seem like the way to go for maximum damage resets going forward. I don’t think Painwheel relies heavily on IPS abuse to score good damage right now though, so IPS change shouldn’t be a major concern. I may be the only person who likes the raw throw scaling across the board, but the range and combo-ability off of it should keep it as a strong mix-up tool. What I’ve been doing lately to check on throw damage scaling effects is to do raw LP Stinger and do my throw combo off of that. It’s like 25 - 30%-ish meter-less, so not too bad imo.

The left/right I’m looking at atm though

s.mp, j.lp, j.lk ,j.mk xx fly df lk/ f then df lk

Single hit starter, opponent is pretty close to the ground when it hits. I’m trying to figure out the exact timing for the cross-up, but it has potential to be really ambiguous.

Edit
I need to ask Mike Z if you can throw xx fly xx Buer Thresher and OTG. With the way the changes are set-up, most characters should be able to throw xx super and combo afterwards to get an un-scaled combo. If that works, you could even reset into throw xx super and build enough meter for a second super, similar to Peacock’s corner throw xx shadow xx super combo.