The SF4 Juggle System:


this isn’t weird, any hit state can be set by counterhit.

counterhit is treated completely separately from normal hit, pretty much any property can be changed from normal hit except things like cancelling properties.

basically you have
1 - standing hit
2 - crouch hit
3 - jumping / juggling / 2nd part of focus crumple hit
4 - stand block
5 - crouch block
6 - ??? unused air block?
7 - stand counterhit
8 - crouch counterhit
9 - jumping counterhit
10 - ?
11 - ?
12 - ?

basically they can set anything to anything if they wanted to, we’re just benefited by them HAPPENING to universally make things do a certain amount extra damage on counterhit for example.

for example, here i modded rog’s jab to cause crumplestate on counterhit:


I just meant it’s weird that they added that, it has no real use. I mean, when do you hit AA CH EX Yoga fire in a real match? And the only thing you can do from it is another EX move for one hit. Or Yoga mummy, but yeah, you need to set that up in advance.

So now we know 6 moves that works differently on CH:

lvl.1 FA
AA lvl.2 FA (They enter that spinning animation like a lvl.3 AA FA)
Tiger uppercut (Same thing here)
df.LK with Chun (standard knockdown)
1st hit of Ken’s HP SRK (Float knockdown)
1st hit of AA CH EX Yoga fire (Float knockdown)

Does anyone know any other moves?


i think they were going to make it a more universally present function like it is on tekken / blazblue etc but then it either got cut (either they thought it’s stupid or they ran out of time, or they just forgot about it like how they forgot to make blanka’s hitboxes work right because they made him early in development)


Yeah, that is possible. I wish they kept it so that every counterhit move on someone in the air puts them in standard/float knockdown instead of resetting them though.


^^Seems a bit broken that i mean everyone would be J.LK because a counter hit would mean big combo (or at least a reset attempt of SRK)^^


But the combo possibilities!


it wouldn’t be that broken because antiair counterhits are pretty rare except against sim/seth, and also when people with juggle air2air normals but those juggle anyway


I’m working on a video with proof of a lot of stuff that is wrong in the main post. Btw Anotak, do you think you could check the JP for the hits in Dan’s Super? I have a theory, I want to know if it is true.

Dan Super:
1: JP = 0 - CCSK
2: JP = 1 - CCSK
3: JP = 2 - CCSK
4: JP = 3 - CCSK
18: JP = 17 - CCSK
19: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

Here’s the vid (Still processing atm): [media=youtube]HpYRANKAudY[/media]



Just a short and simple Ken video demonstrating how minor differences can have major effects :stuck_out_tongue:


Yes, the first hit doesn’t have FKR, only the 2nd hit.


Goukens backthrow doesn’t cause float knockdown, it appears it hits as if the enemy is standing… So it’s not even float knockdown, well, even that doesn’t define it… moves will cause reset. howeve it’s peculiar.

first hit of his Tatsu causes float knockdown but not reset, so a second makes standard. However you can do backthrow then Tatsu then Ultra. Which shouldn’t work.

Unless i’m mistaken >_<


You mean it hits like they we’re simply jumping? i assume you mean because EX palm hits twice.


Kich, why don’t you update the OP?


Yeah, basically that. (Does Gouken have any moves that act differently on standing/jumping opponent (that do some form of knockdown on both)

If Kich has done a runner or not keeping track i’ll take the responsobility of making an updates SSFIV version of this thread. :slight_smile: But he still may be around, who knows.


I’m assuming that because Gouken’s back throw doesn’t actually hit the opponent it isn’t considered a conventional state at all, it just immobilizes them like Fei Long’s command grab does. I think of it as an identical state to the one you get after a focus attack.


I’m guessing you mean the stage 2 of a crumple stun. Makes sense.


Someone gonna make a SSFIV version of this thread? Don’t have time to tend it…


i will be doing one… Uhh, i have to get SSFIV first :stuck_out_tongue:


I have some decent data for Juri and Guy. It seems like thy have included a new property though. YOu can’t juggle after some moves, even though you should. For example, you can’t do 1 hit machinegun upper -> Ultra 2 with DeeJay. DeeJay seems to be plagued by this property a lot.