Ryu Final’s Ryu is best Ryu, simply badass but with good character development, the stuff of legends.
Ryu’s part in A Shadow Falls is very much a stereotype of DBZ. Everyone else fights the bad guys while Ryu trains. Ryu stomps Necalli, powering up and gaining a new form. Everyone together can’t stop Bison. Nash tries and fails. Ryu swoops in and stomps Bison. Ryu even throws a Kamehameha in the escape.
It’s just funny really thinking and realizing that it is a stereotype that DBZ itself didn’t actually follow. (I forgot Vegeta arc. Goku was crushed by Vegeta; Vegeta was beaten by Gohan.) Goku trained a lot and would swoop in to save people, but he almost never sealed the deal on his own afterward. Half the time, he flat out failed, with someone else saving the day. If A Shadow Falls had been an actual DBZ arc, Nash might have kamikazed Bison for the finishing blow after Ryu’s fight.
To add to this there was a point where after Vasili left he originally took down his version of the plot guide before reestablishing it later on claiming he had made revisions which were pretty much absent. I believe he stopped updating his guide around the time of USF4 so no SF5 characters in his. Tiamats guide original guide Pre SF4 without all the clone theories still exists out in the aether but it hasn’t been updated since SF dark age I believe so none of the current characters we all know from SF4 era onward and some other stuff weren’t included in his.
He kinda made a big impact on the whole SGS thing pre SF5. I remember seeing Death Match videos featuring Akuma which get millions of views by people because he’s an insanely popular character. When they described what the attack was they clearly state that SGS would drag your soul into to hell where demons would tear you apart. Millions of fans seen this and up until SF5 thats what they believed what SGS was. The threads in those Youtube videos was a dumpster fire of fans hearing an idea which was essentially made by a fan as well and not Capcom at all. Those same fans then would go on to make Wiki pages which would say the same thing so when you see SGS and wonder “wtf is that?” type in Google “what is SGS” you would get Vasili’s original idea regurgitated by the fans. The Udon comic where Akuma SGS Seth but it didn’t work on him because he didn’t have a soul. Now we have Vasili’s idea now be published in comic books as well.
The funniest thing was that we knew what SGS was ever since Nakahira mangas which came out in the late 90’s but because of one guy’s interpretation of Akuma’s Alpha 3 ending we got some stuff about souls being dragged to hell getting attacked by demons for over a decade. I remember @YagamiFire making a thread way back during SF4 era which actually described what SGS was in actuality and its kinda cool that now in SF5 you actually get to see which of the fans was correct in that aspect.
I remember even posting in the thread the fight from Asura Wrath, where SGS is featured as soon it was available which show that Asura do counter the attacks within SGS and it’s not a soul related thing.
Which probably clarified and cemented the thoughts on how SGS really works.
This was even before SFV.
I must say I kinda hate the plot armor/protagonist power argument used for Ryu (even for Goku but I won’t go into that). I understand where it comes from and it’s not even wrong. But at the same time there are few characters who deserve their wins more than him. He’s the guy constantly training, dedicating his life to fighting. A typical Youxia archetype that has probably become synonymous in recent times to that role more than any other character before him in a “reimagining” of a tale as old as time. Am I really supposed to think that Guile’s training, a military man who is defined by his family, would yield better results than the Wandering Warrior’s? Or that Chun-Li, first and foremost a cop, could win against the man who travels the world accepting any challenge and challenging the toughest fighters?
Make no mistake, Ryu isn’t written like this because he is the protagonist, he’s written like this because he is an archetype.
Hell, it’s not like that protagonist power is helping him that much either. He’s basicaly locked into sandbagging every sparring match with Ken, between Sagat in SF1 and Bison in SFV there’s no notable fight confirmed he won and by the time of SF3, where he should be at his peak to this point, he only beats up the newbie Alex. I guess there’s Seth in TTTB, but that is indeed the definition of plot armor.
To close it off I just have to ask, don’t you think, favorite characters and biases aside, that the few wins that count in the large scheme of things SHOULD go to Ryu? Otherwise his whole journey, his whole story makes no sense. To begin with defeating one of the most important fighters, deserving of the title of King over his entire art… to then doing nothing for the rest 6 entries in the story.
If Ryu’s story is halted so is Street Fighter’s, it just has to be written well so it doesn’t look like his wins are “protagonist power” but due to his experience and skills. That way they are satisfying for the audience.
The vibe i get from the average eventhub article, udon publication or kiki artwork lol
I wish capcom had a stronger respect and sense of protection toward SF
That little thread about SGS that @YagamiFire made was actually one of the things that got me here in the first place when a G+ friend linked it
TBH, the story fans are the unsung heroes of the SF fandom IMO.
Here is the link
I need to figure out when our SFV locals will start.
I kind of feel like going to them this year to meet people there and improve my game further.
Left to that POS street fighter wiki lol
Let’s hope she kills the mitch.
As a lot of you have stated numerous times, that wiki is complete bullcrap and as much as I dislike the site, at least TV Tropes has accurate information (then again, that’s because some of this forums members have worked on the SF page there)
Again I may sound like an apologist, which really isn’t my intention, but let’s be real: 1. A wiki is hard to mentain. 2. Sources for actual hard facts about the SF lore a hard to get, especially in English so misconceptions can easily run wild. 3. For a quick glimpse at getting what’s what in a series it’s fine.
The problem with the wiki, and any wiki in general, is that debates and such are impossible and as long as members suffer from Vasili syndrome, aka not acepting hard facts, things can’t improve.
Yep, and when people do look for information they end looking at the wiki or the plot guide, even when they have a professional deal with Capcom themselves! That shows how hard to come by the official info is and how easy it is for false or uncertain info to spread when people starve for it. Can’t really blame people for it. This should be Capcom’s job (and business!).
It was mentioned that Udon took the Shun Goku Satsu hell thing from the guide. Another example is Gen’s restaurant. At some point the guide noted that Gen owned a restaurant called Genhanten because it appeared in a Pocket Fighter stage, though it was eventually removed because the canonity of that game is questionable and apparently it was never mentioned in other sources. Now the SF wiki and every piece of Western media features this restaurant, from Udon Comics, to trading card games, to The Legend of Chun Li, because they went to Gen’s section and said, “oh, he owns a restaurant, ok, that’s going to be useful”. It’s become legit fanon at this point and I wouldn’t be surprised if it ended appearing in the games themselves.
Funnily enough, it was Vasili10 who removed the mention to the restaurant and we didn’t realize it until we casually named it on a thread and he brought the removal to our attention. The guy is a lunatic, but he does know his stuff. If he says that the restaurant appeared nowhere else he’s probably right.
I always thought the Genhanten stuff was just a playful joke much like how Dhalsim owned a toy shop in that game.
But Yun+Yang still work in and/or own a restaurant passed from their relatives right?
I hope Capcom would have been more strict qnd organized with their SF franchise like in they were in 90s from visual and character personality (according to some in the making of SF movies in the 90s) . They may have been that way because SF had been their flagship franchise back in the day.
Im glad there is a CFN profile but they stop updating it. CFN profile did help us progress data of individual characters. I like the idea of CFN profile they should have updated it and fixed it people would not questioned it if it would change frequently since it’s official source so it would be undebatable.
SF needs a new OVA that covers SF1 then another for SF2. With consistent design that compromised to their original in game art… Also some anime shorts like they did before in SF4. I really enjoyed arcade mode illustrations I hope that CAPCOM if they would had a new upated CFN they would used the illustration and other SFV content like videos to know which is which to be confirmed to the characters. Like which death of Nash was is it the shadow fall or the arcade mode endings.
Ooh, so many replies, I’m glad there’s some energetic discussion going on!
I think you all have covered Kage, I don’t have anything to add.
@Dracu hey, welcome aboard, great intro post! Always nice to increase our ranks!
As for your questions:
Shin Akuma being stronger than Oni. Hmm, I’ve not looked at Oni’s info in forever, but unless he was referring to the idea that Shin is controlled, thus stronger and not a rampaging beast, I’m not sure. Oni seems to be presented as being something beyond anything we’ve seen and more powerful aesthetically.
Ah G & Q. As the resident Q obsessed maniac, I’m happy you’re speculating about him!
I’ve gone on and on about G since he first showed up, I even did a video and most of my speculation appears wrong, but I do think there’s a sinister streak in him. Like your ideas, I do think that there is a plan for G to bolster his forces with some sort of “Alphabet Company” comprised of various men and women from across the globe. One of the ideas I had was that he was like Dr. Doom in that he’s a bad guy to some (well, a lot of people depending on the era) and has skewed but good intentions for a select few. For Doom it’s his people in Latveria, and in G’s case he may be taking on the Illuminati and going about evil means to “save” the world. Could be interesting if he was in the middle of morality.
Q’s uncovered developer notes imply that he’s being mind controlled or resisting. My theory on why he fights so sloppy is that he may be fighting the control, or by the time of SF3 he’s broken control, but it’s left him with psychological and maybe physical damage.
One thing about Q is that he’s been looked at as an urban legend for an unknown amount of time. The CIA has had to field questions that he doesn’t officially exist, the move names he has are from observations, he’s been seen at crime scene photos all over the globe but not caught in the act of committing the crimes. The thing about G’s story costume is that he appears younger (someone hacked the model and removed the mask and he has black splotches of ink over his eyes and the glowing purple eyes are NOT part of the mask, but his actual eyes.)
IF he’s younger and not just shaved, then I have an idea. G for whatever reason was savvy enough to use social media to get exposure, but until Rashid fought him he struggled to get an audience. What if before his recent president of the world scheme, he took the urban legend of Q, utilized it (hence the discrepancy in his costume and Q’s longer, but somewhat plain coat) and tried something, until he ran into the actual Q? I’m not sure where it would go from there, but I don’t exactly think G becomes Q, but rather is incharge of him for potentially sinister purposes.
Stage hazards as early as SF2? Huh, could’ve been interesting if they got it to work. I like the stage transition and hazards in SFV and wouldn’t mind some more in the future.
@javert & @mykka I wouldn’t worry about Rose dying in SF5. The Udon books were doing their own thing with their take on continuity and she seemingly died ages ago just like @Doctrine_Dark said. Once SF4 came about, they started trying to catch up and Gouken’s fate in the books is different than the game as well as the SF3 arc. So I think she’ll be safe.
Hey Bea! How are you? Good to see you round these parts again!
Man, all these memories of how people got into lore warm my heart. On the flip side, yeesh, it is pretty scary how because of the misinformation, that’s found its way into major media sources. I really, really want to combat misinformation of SF lore and hope that Capcom gets a bit more focused on it in the future.
I was really hoping that at the end of the game’s life cycle SFV would have included a large lore guide and include the Shadaloo profiles in the game itself. I’m just glad nothing really crazy made it’s way out of the old plot guide (no Cyber Gen and Zombie Gouken making their way into an OAV or something, phew)
I feel the future games need some spelling out of the lore. Once we solidify the mysteries and get past SF3’s timeline, who knows how things will be – with everything so clean and everyone organized and future games no longer being endless prequel, I feel the story could go to some interesting places and be easier for the audience at large to follow.
It’s been a while @Shockdingo
I too would really like a “archive” feature where you could look at plot+character info implemented into future games so that we have a single and clear interpretation of what went on and so that Capcom won’t have to screw up story details again.
On another note, as we (hopefully) move on to a post SF3 era, we’ll experience far less discrepancies in terms of canon as Capcom will have to essentially design a story without it being anchored to SF2+Alpha
It’s would be interesting to see a stage transition in future SF games like in Xmen COTA.
I prefer the more realistic stage transitions from New Generation where the weather, time of day and background people would change compared to the over-the-top transitions that the early VS games had.
Going off on a tangent here but I especially loved the Yun/Yang stage as you start fighting on a tramline only for the fight to lead to the restaurant next to the tramline, the chaotic loud music also helped.
That stage really helped to build up the world of SF as your battles have a impact on the environment around it. I know that already happened in the 3D games but I’d like it to be more… involved, if you will.
Xmen Cota stages transition were amazing making the stage felt more dynamic. It felt the background like it was episodic per round. I do like NG stages too like Elena which have the same vibe taken inspiration from Cota stages which started it all.