Tournament Level

zero

#1

on a tournament level how does everyone feel about zero? im looking at all these different tourney vids and i keep thinking to myself hes only able to keep up for so long. im probably tripping since i lost whatever comp i had when i got stationed in turkey and was on to some shit but didnt get to try it out more. internet connection here is horrible so yeah. anyways i just want to see everyone else thoughts about him as a tourney character


#2

He’s the new Karas?


#3

I think he’s really solid. Long-ranged normals that all lead to big combos and a strong reset/mixup game with and without assists makes him a really strong character.

It helps that I barely lose offline matches and he got me my first tourney win (sadly the skill level is kinda small) but yeah, he is nothing to sneeze at.


#4

see i thought that too kenmastersx but even playing him and then looking at the scale hes got a lot of short comings due to his speed alone. like i said its probably cuz i dont have the chance to fight comp anymore since im not in the states but with all the pressure chains i come up with to practice in training pushblock moves him out hella far. thats when i started noticing how much recovery his moves had.

i already know about resets and what not but they really aint that great if your opponent knows how to defend, once again due to his speed. i dont know help me get better with him cuz i think i hit that block where im feening for some competition and the only fix i get is watchin youtube videos.


#5

xero15, I was gonna PM you this, but since you haven’t bothered to clear out your inbox of old mail…


#6

id love to play you taurus but im in turkey…internet connection is horrid here thats the only reason really why i made this thread i cant test new tactics out. for all i know he can be a fucking beast in tournament play but then looking at the level of tournament play and looking at him i dont see it possible for him to last long but once again im without comp so i have to theorize about it as opposed to experiencing it right now. thats military life for ya.

oh ill clean out my inbox and im waiting for that vid to load now TO


#7

Oh…well that sucks.

In any case, Zero is definitely a character who’s gonna rock at tournament level. Yeah, his lack of health is a drawback, but if you play Zero right and give him the right assist, the opponent will never be able to hit him. If Zero gets them in a corner and they can’t megacrash, Zero wins.


#8

zero’s not a runaway character though. like i said before his power lies in his resets but alone he doesnt have the manueverablity to overwhelm someone with a good defense. by no way am i saying hes garbage hell no im trying to figure out what people who are planning to use him tourney wise are doing to compensate. like samurai is gonna be at final round this weekend. if i was gonna go id be trying to money match him its cool though ill catch him when we both are able to attend the same tourney, oh no disrespect meant by that if you reading. i know how money matches can be interpreted.

back on subject though if i pushblock your sC or cC and you do fC i dont need to pushblock that cuz youre gonna be open unless you do a special. that is a mindgame you can use but its weak really cuz you can wait it out and react accordingly. you do a normal i pushblock that im free but i could also attack you before your next attack and get out that way too. call assist or cancel into special and your left wide open if your assist isnt covering you.

i guess what im askin for is an explanation as to why you think he can hang? big combos when no meter yeah thats true for everyone not just him. as long as they sit at one and a half bars you wont be getting buster combos off unless they just dont MC period.


#9

Keep in mind i’m no pro, so if anything I say is just flat out wrong, everyone can feel free to correct me or expand on what i’m trying to say.

Xero, you say that Zero’s strength lies in his reset ability. The thing is however, is that is only one of Zero’s strengths. While Zero isn’t as proficient at it as Saki or Volnutt, Zero can still play a strong keepaway game with his Z-buster, Hadangeki, and his command dashes for fast evasion. Zero is also arguably the best pressure character in the game, so even if he is against a solid defensive character, all the opponent is gonna be able to do is defend and pray Zero leaves an opening, which won’t be often. Zero also has ridiculous meter building ability, so even when he gets put into a combo, he can MC out of it no problem and be able to replenish that lost super meter in no time at all. Add to the fact that Zero doesn’t even need his supers to be devestating, and you’re pretty much up against a character who can’t be comboed.

That’s my view on Zero anyway. I could be flat out wrong and before we know it Zero is considered a joke character for tournament-level play, but from what I see now, Zero is gonna be the deciding factor in a lot of matches.


#10

I’d say only a few characters go even with Zero. Those being Y-1, Ken, Saki, Jun (maybe), PTX (maybe) and Alex w/ 3 meters (maybe). Everyone else seems disadvantaged.

That’s why I think Zero’s the most competitive character.

Edit: maybe Y-2…


#11

Zero’s good. I wouldn’t say people can’t hang with him cuz he’s got some holes here and there, but overall, he’s one of the strongest characters. He’s a plenty solid pick as a tourney character as far as anyone can see, especially with the right assist (polymar).


#12

lmao pushblock barely affects zero as long as you’re pretty close, you can continue block strings up until you’re done with all your C attacks, and then you’d be too far. In that case, you could use an assist to cover you, or do a A DP early. You recover insanely fast after the DP and you could either block or if the opponent pauses attack some more.


#13

i disagree with the pushblocking only cuz i sit in training practicing against it. i think i may be just overthinking the whole thing. i guess we will see how he plays out through the tourney season


#14

Just make sure that when the dummies set to push-block you’re omitting A’s from your block-strings. It’s a little bit unrealistic to push-block A’s in a match 'cause it’s easy to fuck up and push-block to early and get a back-dash instead, which will give Zero a free hit. Also, push-blocking multi-hits (of which Zero has 2, 5C and 6C) improperly will register a back-dash as well, which equals a free hit for Zero.


#15

Zero is both easier to play and more effective than most of the cast. Yes, he’s a touranment-caliber character. As long as you don’t get clearly outplayed, you should do fine with him.


#16

ooo finally a point :lol:

its been a while i forgot about the cpu’s tendency to auto correct stuff. i could see how multi push blocking could cause back dash now that i actually put thought into it. so that shoots down that point and i very much appreciate that. also i wasnt taking into account human error which i guess is easy to do when gettin caught up in theory. that also changes things.

how are people feelin about his resets? im not omitting assist but i find for the assist to work properly you have to know how to solo reset with him decently enough in case your assist fails you arent crippled. that being said and taking into consideration of his range, i think his B crossup is the better of the two. (A and B being similar) it puts you out of most poking ranges but still lets you attack. i use C dash for a whole different kind of reset. anyways anyone have anything to say on that?


#17

Reset-wise, I don’t actually see the hype with Zero. Y-1 and Chun and Batsu and Jun and Ken all have much more reset potential imo, Marvel-esque reset potential. Stuff like: aerial cross-ups, or aerial recross-ups, or simple high-low mixed with ground cross-ups, etc. Jun and Ken can throw into assists, even. Zero’s resets are kind of underwhelming in comparison. I mean, his command dash+assist options are really weak without the additional use of Baroque. Seriously, once you get used to it it’s like blocking a jump-in. Really, Zero’s resets are above average, but not that scary.

Really though, it’s his pressure that sets him aside in that top position. It really is that bad. He slowly rides you down with block-strings into assist (which sets up another block-string) while charging Z-buster to make his second block-string’s 6C safe, which simultaneously puts him at the advantage (or he at least seems to be at the frame advantage) to set up another block-string. All the while his assist is coming back, and Baroque’s always an option for continuing his strings, and he starts charging another Z-buster. And to top it all off he’s building so much meter in the process. And while you’re being pressured for what feels like forever he slips in a few gimmicky mix-ups until one stupid A/B dive cross-up works. And the worst part of it all is that the one time you caught him without an assist or baroque to cover his ass, he megacrashes. He also has great mobility and he pursues escapes and fleeing very well.
(My friend’s been experimenting with cancelling 6C into his activation super as well, and because he recover almost instantly it seems like you can’t even jump out some times. Seriously, at least twice he’s cancelled 6C into super and pressed 5A and it punished my jumping to escape…).

Mind you, his pressure strings aren’t perfect. You can only use Baroque once in these strings (if you even have it), and assists take long enough to charge that they’re also limited, and cancelling 6C into Z-buster or C-dives equals a free escape if your slippery enough. Honestly though, Zero’s just a tough-as-nails character to get used to, he’s by no means as stupid as CGoH Karas, but he’s still overwhelming. I’m lucky enough to have a friend that’s great with Zero so I won’t be raped for free by Zero’s when I hit up MWC or any other tourneys in the coming months, and I can tell you from experience that once you get used to it it isn’t as bad as it sounds, but he’s definitely a force to be reckoned with and I’m putting money on him being the best and most overused character in this game (at least, competitively).

But yeah, once you get used to him, blocking his mix-up/resets is easy for the most part (just pay attention and don’t get impatient when he’s on top of you), and his pressure is great, the best even, but ultimately fallible (especially if your on point with your push-blocking and know what is and isn’t punishable, and what is and isn’t escapable).

Honestly, I use a great team to fight Zero though, so I don’t know how bad it can be for some teams. I can just tank it out with Tekkaman’s absurd vitality and build-meter, and when I get the chance to make a safe switch to Saki I take it and run havoc on him. Zero might control the pace of the match in your face, and his mobility might be solid, but Saki shits all over him from half-screen distance or further. And when he finally gets in I just variable counter into Tekkaman or dry tag or sneak in a VAR or DHC and let Tekkaman soak up his abuse again. Works surprisingly well.

That’s why I say certain characters like Ken (runaway supersedes pressure), Y-1 (slightly faster attacks, slightly better range, much better damage, much better mix-up and resets, and more health makes it hard for Zero to establish consistent pressure), Saki (even Zero’s prone to smart zoning, which keeps him from getting the opportunity to pressure) and PTX (you cannot pressure this guy without a command throw) can handle Zero’s BS pretty well, because they can all either contend with his pressure or ignore it. Hell, patient and careful gameplay in general is all it really takes to beat him, but most people get mad when a character limits their abilities to press buttons.

lol, looking back on that it seems like I typed up a dissertation on Zero. Something like “Zero and Pressure: Pros and Cons and How to Handle It”


#18

honestly if you talk to my boy divinetenken on here hell tell you your post is exactly the same thing told him last week when i was thinkin bout making this thread. all that taken into account i came up with hell only last so long for tourney play but thats why i now say well have to wait for the tourney season to finish to find out


#19

YO ZERO WHATS GOOD? just saw the tvc steam from Final Round crazy yo really crazy.

R.D.T.U.


#20

thanks for the update last night son. apparently marn beat wong last night with zero so i cordially eat my words as i wait for my stick to arrive tomorrow to reup my training