So Mike Z has been showing a work-in-progress patch to SG that had to include some kind of nerf to Double, as ordered by the funders for the whole project. So far we have seen a non-invincible hornet bomber with no grounnd bounce, and changes to her Lvl 3 that altered the invulnerability of her LV3 animation. It has been stated that these type of changes to Double WILL be done in the next patch. Let’s use this space right here to voice our own ideas on what would be the best changes to alleviate the peanut gallery’s complaints while maintaining the gameplay options the character has.
I personally think Double should keep her invincibility for Hornet Bomber at least for the first half of the attack- if invincibility to be taken could you hold til the peak of her arc to take it away? That way the assist could still be punished from afar, but the Double point character doesn’t loose the option of the invincible close-up start. I’d rather her LV 3 have ULTRA-Super armor rather than just lose invincibility. It would be ridiculous to be hit out of her LV 3 just because the teleporting all over happens to teleport into Georges Day Out or other projectile. I ask that Doubles LV 3 remain projectile invincible and could take up to 4 hits with super armor. Also it would be cool if Double;'s LV 3 was able to hit Lemmy all over the screen instead of trapping Double to just teleport around Lemmy til it explodes. Also a buff to the Cilia Slide assist? Come out faster?
faster recovery on the Slide, the ability to chain MP into MK, an armored move of some sort.
she feels basically the same, and mk hornet bomber assist feels almost exactly the same. shes here to stay
Somebody will have to post a video of the revised barrel BnB as I suck at doing it from just notations…
its the same thing you just end it earlier
You are missing the points ENTIRELY of the nerfs.
First of all Hornet Bomber IS ALREADY INVINCIBLE THE FIRST HALF OF THE ATTACK, and that is sort of the problem considering that a cornered player will have no answers to it being called. Not a single invincible move in the game can beat it out before you’re put into blockstun.
The reason for losing the invincibility on her level 3 is that if she hits an assist, the point character can do NOTHING to stop the level 3. Adding some arbitrary amount of armor will end up with the same exact effect; the point character has a very short window between hits (since it’s also going to be sped up), so it needs to lose its invincibility completely.
Hmmm. No reason to go all-caps on me. I posted this thread and that post around the time when Mike Z was bringing a patch build to WNF and other events when he was still experimenting with parameters to the changes being made- especially with doubles buttslam and lv 3. Written before any changes to the characters (let alone before the changes to the system like green ground bounce) were finalized. I wasn’t arguing with the changes after being announced on the list or anything- the intention was to get some community input on the changes being made to Double during the process of starting the changes 2 months ago. Basically this is an old thread and its purpose is obsolete now; if you want to you can discuss the changes of the character here or start a new thread you have options.
Regardless of whether going “all caps” was an overreaction, you did state Double should keep her invincibility for “at least half of the animation”, when that is clearly already the case, and clearly also the problem with it.
Basically, consider the caps more like pure, unbridled hatred for how unfair that move is. Add to that the fact someone (you) mentioned that the unfair invincibility (that was already admitted as being a mistake) should be kept. Unfair thing + someone defending it = all caps.
Can’t help it. It’s the internet.
Actually Shari’s combo:
gets to remain exactly the same, with one minor difference. If you started the combo with LK/cLK you have to use that after the first barrel loop as it won’t trigger IPS, and then you can use LP/cLP after the second barrel. Vice versa if you started your combo off a LP/cLP.
So that combo gets to remain 100% identical, except on Double which I don’t think can be combo’d properly from the jMP jHP due to her weight.
With the 5 frame buffer on jumps, the whole thing should also be significantly easier, especially online, as the earlier your jLP or jLK comes out the better.
While I’m here, will Double’s level 3 even be useful anymore…? Now that you can’t OTG from it, and with the reduced damage, I feel like just doing the car and having two bars left over to call catheads or car again later is by far the superior option. I could be way off though, any comments?
the funny thing here is that double gets to keep her invincibility on mk and lk bombers… which means that people will just move to those assists… i aready use lk bomber and have been for a couple of months… its better than hk bomber in most situations except when facing… funnily… an hk or mk bomber. the nerf to hk bomber is primarily a nerf to val as she used it best and its a buff against keepaway peacocks and keepaway parasouls. lk bomber is better imho in every other matchup.
persoanlly i think they nerfed double a little to hard… she will remain the same character… but besides her derp shit, she wasnt really good. i wish that theyd have buffed some of her weaker stuff like made her dash a bit faster… it got its invincibility nerfed so that seems a fair trade. i also dont really agree with making it so that she gains NO METER during catheads. SOME would be fine, even only 10% of what she gets now would be fine, it would mean that her infinite meter strats (which i havent seen nor have i seen whether the teams that can accomplish it are actually viable outside of that strat) wouldnt be possible. balance is and has always been, in the numbers. she loses her otg after her lvl 3 is preposterous since almost every character can otg after there supers and lvl3’s. i mean reduced damage is “somewhat” fine, but nerfing its damage further by nerfing its otg is dumb… people simply wont use it unless it kills… like ibukis current u2.
basically if they were going to nerf it like that then make it have more range… or something. just nerfing it, is bad.
hk bomber having its invincibility taken away is fine… it was stupid, but it should have rolled all the way down to all versions of bomber tbqh. all tat has really happened is people no longer have such an amazing support character with tools that boggle the mind as far as support is concerned, but now her ability at point is even worse, when it wasnt amazing in the first place. her support and derp should definitely been nerfed, (and they were) but she should have been given a bone as far her point play is concerned imho.
Considering that the level 3 knocks the opponent away from you, there’s no point in having it OTG anyway.
I agree though, they should have left the damage alone or reduced the damage but kept the OTG and direction. Not done both those things.