**Updated 5/17** ONE thread about performing and application of the RSF/Punch Loop

trust me ill film me doing it and it will show how im doing it, it wont work for me, i dont know why, if i pause, it dont work, when i look at videos they do it so much faster then i do it and it works for them, ugh ill never get this to work

Thanks Ski and Xear. I’ll keep at it

Not so much about the RSF so much as ENDING It. I was watching a few of Hal’s fights online and the thought of Stun came up.

I’ve seen it posted several times about how stunning with an RSF loop sucks since this means that you will be getting nothing out of it due to damage mitigation…

Of course as its been mentioned in previous topics you can do cl HK xx Ex guac if you know it will dizzy

Or you can be a riskbreaker like hal and go for a tostada press during your loop since it doesnt combo, but thats where my question comes in for AFTER a loop to reset damage…

tl;dr

I feel that there are things Fuerte gets away with… Q-Bomb on Block for example. Just like hal goes for Tostada during rsf to go for the daze and reset damage, how viable is it to go for a throw after a loop?

Well, most people are mashing DP or ultra during the loop hoping you’ll screw up. I wouldn’t go for just a run stop grab.

Just to clarify ending with the slide is almost always best, but ending with a splash is great on xbl, cause those scrubs are mashing uppercut every time and the splash will counterhit the uppercut for 150 stun. Splashes are always risky though since focus is an ever present threat.

Just know your stun values and do the math in your head. Like if you just threw a guy, and are going for a crossup fierce, and it is a 1000 stun character. If you hit your fierce, then do 2 fierces then a slide. That’ll put them at 900 stun, the perfect position since hitting them with anything at all on their next wakeup will stun. If it is seth, then just do one fierce. If it is sagat, then you can do three. Anytime you can put the opponent in a position where they are waking up and hitting them with anything is a stun, you are in the best possible position because they are going to be desperate.

Yeah ppl love spamming that DP. Thats why I was thinking run back dash to make them pay for a mash.

I’m prolly just nuking it now… I’ll stick to the slide.

Pretty sure that’s 820 stun. Still close anyway. I believe I have the numbers in the first post 4 Fierces (3 Fierces and a slide) = 700 stun. Throw = 120 stun. Moving on.

Thought that I wrote about this in my first post, and it was obvious…

The whole point of the loop is to get within 100-150 stun, then reset with a tostada/crossup tostada/tortilla. It doesn’t really matter if the other person mashes… if they mash something it is HIGHLY improbably that they hit you out of any of these moves. Often (and on reaction), you can aim them away to safety, avoiding whatever they mash out.

Anyway here’s a tip. Im gonna go right ahead and tell you guys on this one, your mileage may vary, and I’ll explain why at the end.

So, during RSF, as most people have figured out, the first 3 fierces are really not that difficult to land. You’ve also racked up a ton of stun, more than 50%, and your opponent at this point in the combo is probably a little flustered. The common options from this point are:
continue your RSF until stun,
continue RSF until you go for knockdown/finisher,
continue RSF till you fuck up.

Now… if you truly believe your opponent is mashing at this point… you have much better options. Essentially, if the other person is a character who is mashing… lets say dragon punch? Run stop block. He goes flying… now you only have to do the same 3 fierces and you’ve dizzied. Or reset as mentioned above.

What if it’s Gief? Run stop block obviously will get grabbed. Run stop backstep however, will make that mash 720 totally whiff, and the above applies. So will run stop jump but that’s not really rewarding as you really can’t get fierces off any neutral jumps.

Please don’t ask me what to do if you read block.

You have to remember that El Fuerte is offensive character. Sure he can run, but he obviously shines on defense. If you’re going to play offense, as Buk recently said to me, a HUGE aspect of offense is reading your opponent. It’s all about maximizing the rewards on your risks, because generally there is going to be no way to safely attack your opponent in any fighting game.

In my experience, people tend to mash at around 3-4 hits, but when im up to like 6-7, they’re not mashing anymore. This doesn’t make a difference in practice, just something I wanted to point out when you consider a strategy like this.

I’m convinced that this is really how the combo was designed. That’s why 3 hits is just about 50% stun on most chars.

You DONT need to do 6 or 7 hits in RSF. In most cases, you simply do not want to. Can’t repeat this enough. See above.

6-7 hit RSF is the “reward” version, for those with excellent execution. If you can reliably do that many then you only have to guess right one quick time to stun most chars. You get to dizzy them damn near for free, no matter HOW they counter.

3 hits is the regular version. That’s why its in trial mode. That’s why its 50% stun. It’s very doable. You get to stun them, but you have to work for it. You have to read them. But this is still very feasible.

You should be playing for one hit stun. That is Fuerte. You can almost always win with this. Even on the brink of defeat, a one hit stun and a full stocked ultra kills or damn near kills anyone. The only character who stuns more than El Fuerte is Seth.

Dunno how much more I can break it down for you fools. Please heed this advice.

works for me foo’

Hm, i might have had counterhit on when i got those stun values, or maybe i just remembered incorrectly. Point is still the same, though.

Usually if I wanna reset a masher I don’t run stop block, though, I run then hit LK. I don’t like to block uppercuts because then they can fadc, and I don’t like getting stuck in the stupid little throw/hit mixup that you end up in after you block a fadc uppercut(frame advantage after a fadc uppercut is one of the dumbest things in the game…I just blocked a fuckin uppercut, I really feel like I shouldn’t be at a huge DISadvantage, but whatever). Fuerte has the mobility to pretty much never have to block a baited uppercut.

Very good points though ski, I hope people will take it to heart.

try that on me lil wody.:wgrin:

Larry comin out of the woodwork

We will set something up on one of my days off, I am really itching to play someone decent somewhere other than online. Online is so sloppy.

Very good points on the RSF stun. People sometimes wonder why I don’t do more than 4 fierces when they’ve seen me do like seven… I hate stunning with RSF because I don’t know what to do - nothing afterwards does damage. I’ve been trying to test if it’s worth to focus attack after a stun or if that’s too much damage scaling. I’d like to experiment with FA lvl 3 hitting just as they recover while mashing, but that’s p risky. I didn’t think about run-lk in the middle of RSF when they’re mashing, that dodges command throws too? It’s quick enough? I’ve been using tostada press but oftentimes that will get DP’d.

After an RSF dizzy, the only thing worth doing is RSF for as many more hits as you are comfortable with into some reset. Do whatever is your best momentum-preserving tactic or highest damaging reset or whatever the situation calls for. IMO he should be able to do off cl.rh what abel can do off c.fierce, since he has to work so much hard to hit it, but oh well.

There’s one caveat about a post dizzy punch loop. Punch loop started after a jump in will do at least 10 more damage than a punch loop that started off a lvl3 focus, IF and ONLY IF you are able to land at least as many fierces off the jump-in as you would the FA. Generally, it’s easier to do RSF off a lvl3 so this is one of the rare cases where it’s often better to do a lvl3 focus post dizzy.

Fierce run LK will dodge command throws because you started at an advantage and sweep back really far, really fast. You can really just dash right out of it and few things are going to hit you. And halcyonryu was right on the money, I didn’t mention it, I meant to write (watch that meter), because if the opponent has an FADC prepared it should be your number 1 goal to get out of range of his DP to ensure that it whiffs, so you can reap your sweet sweet reward. I can’t tell you guys how many matches I’ve won off one hit, with like 0 life. Anyway, the backstep is also great for this situation.

As I mentioned, I often just dash back in immediately after the backstep, because the things that you evade sometimes have a faster recovery, lp shoryus for instance. and you want to get up in there and make sure you get it. Downside of this is, if they do a quick horizontal move, e.g. hurricane kick, tiger knee, blanka ball, you get smacked. Slight upside of the downside, those moves don’t do a huge for the other guy in way of gaining momentum. Keep it in mind though.

I don’t mean after RSF stunning. I know the damage scaling is awful with that and you should never focus. But say you got four into a slide, maybe a throw and then f.mk into a couple lp chops, and it stuns. When you get the stun outside of the RSF, but it’s more than one hit - do you want to FA when they’re dizzy or will it be better damage to just start the RSF without the crumple?

So this whole thread thus far has been discussing stun and how to perform the RSF. How about setups for RSF? What are you favorite and most reliable ways to setup RSF? Please feel free to mention specific setups on specific characters.

Really my only reliable ones I use are from focus attacks.

  1. Meaty FA after propeller, then RSF
  2. On uppercut characters, when they wakeup, I bait shoryuken and RSF. More specifically, especially on Ryus with lp shoruken, (on wakeup) I hab dash to their corpse and backstep, then do immediate lvl 2 focus into RSF.
    3)Cammy Spiral arrow and Blanka amazon river: FA absorb then RSF
  3. Dictator and Akuma on wakeup. When they teleport, choose a side and RSF. Best way is to hab dash back to one side, so you are kind of forcing them to teleport to the opposite side.
  4. On Backdash, lvl 2 focus and RSF.
  5. Walljump macho elbow setup: j.hp > st.hp > into RSF as many as possible.
  6. Vega Backslash: Hab dash through it and wait for him then RSF.
  7. Boxer: FA his dash punch then RSF punish (I never do this, ever. Just thought I’d put it up there)

Other than that. It’s just random occurrences when I use the situation and find my own openings. Jump in FA’s and whatnot. I’m sure there are a lot more. Please share if you have any good ones. I’m sure I’m forgetting some simple ones too.

I’m pretty sure gief does more stun damage with his MP headbutt then El fuerte does with his loop or at least it takes less hits with gief. This is great info by the way and I would like to thank everybody for the info. thx:lovin::tup:

Hello everyone,

I, as all of you probably are, am a SF4 addict.

I’d say I’m a decent player, since two days or so, I’ve been practising the RSF loop from El Fuerte. I can do 2 hits, sometimes 3.

My question is, my friend bought a stick, but I’m doubting to use it for el fuerte, I seem to use the controller better for the combo, for instance, I’m having problems performing down forward with a stick, it’s much easier on a controller, what are your thoughts on this ? I want to know what I need to use.

Any advice on the down forward part? It seems silly, but it doesn’t seem to be that easy.

Thanks in advance,
GRTZ

I think most people will say the stick is better. I use a controller but it’s more because i don’t feel like paying for a stick.

I’ve heard it takes a week or two to really get comfortable with a stick, so you may just need to stick with it.

practice. find a way to hold the stick thats most comfortable for you then stick to it.

You can always change the spring, actuator and restrictor gate on a stick to adjust the stick to your liking.

Should I do RSF fast or should I time the “run -> stop” I can only do RSF 4 times.

And the fifth time it seems Im too far away…