Urien matchups thread

urien

#1

Since the unblockables thread has been quite successfull, I’m thinking about creating a new thread to be used as a matchup guide reference.

I’ll update/correct this post anytime new useful information is added

I’m starting with my view of the Chun Li matchup, hoping to complete/change it with the help of other Urien players.
I’ll list every contributor.

Alex

Akuma
Don’t forget not to jump in when Akuma has 2 bars because you’ll get raging demon’d.

Spend some time learning how to red parry Akuma’s hurricane kick.

When you have Akuma in the corner and you do fireball xx Aegis setup, you may want to stand back a bit incase he tries to teleport out.

Use jab headbutt to counter the dive kick.

If you parry Akuma’s crouching MK, he can hit you with a hurricane kick if you are too close. If you parry it from far away, you can safely standing FP, but if you’re too close, you’ll eat the hurricane kick.

This is probably not universal to Akuma, but it seems to happen a lot to him. If he has you trapped in the corner and is about sweep range away, if you do a FK kneedrop and he blocks, the kneedrop will actually cross him up and he’ll be knocked down.

Credits: gootecks

Chun Li
This one won’t be easy, but Urien is actually quite decent at fighting her.
Jumping HK is going to help a lot in this matchup. Learn the distance and timing so that you hit with about the tip of the hitbox, and as late as you can. This will stuff many of Chun’s moves, and it’s safe even if parried (only if it’s late enough, that’s why I’m stressing on that)
Usually jump straight HK works best since it’s easier to judge the angle well. Jump away HK is useful too, not much for hitting (it won’t hit often) but because she can’t really do much about that.
It loses to her cHK though at most ranges.
If she jumps as well and she’s not under you (in which case jHK is still the best), jHP usually works quite well, jMK is nice too if she’s farther away.
Of course you can’t jump everyday, so let’s talk about being grounded. There are three spots on which Urien should try to stay.
One is a full screen away charging meter (which can be actually good since Aegis charges faster than Hoyoukusen and it helps Urien a lot, maybe even more than a charged SAII helps Chun).
The second spot is what I call the “safe spot”, that is just outside of her sHP range. Here you are quite safe, but you can’t do that much either. It’s just for spacing purposes, or to control the match if you have the lead. From this range you can sHP her whiffed sHP and cMK most of her other whiffs. sMK can be decent but you should be very careful if the opponent can hitconfirm bHP consistently.
Throw out some sMP’s here and there (it’s a good move in this matchup), and stuff any dash-in tentative with any poke that’s fast enough.
The 3rd spot is what I call the “sweet spot”.
It’s just outside of her cMK range but inside of her sHP range.
Staying in that spot puts some pressure on her, and you don’t risk much at all. It’s quite hard to maintain the position, but as long as you can do that it’s quite helpful.
From that range, your sMP stuffs her sHP consistently, and your sHP stuffs everything she can do else besides cLP, cLK, cMK (which all whiff) and cMP (which can hit you but you shouldn’t fear that). And if she does nothing, both your sMp and sHP whiff so no fear of being parried.
You can also tap forward every now and then, and if you “catch” the sHP you get a free knockdown (sweep and dash in for some wakeup madness).
really, the only thing that may bother you when you’re in the sweet spot is cMP, which does tiny damage and leads to nothing.
Don’t ever let her be closer than sweet spot distance (unless she’s knocked down of course). If she closes in, get the fuck away while you still can.

the match changes quite a lot depening on her being (almost) charged or not.
When she doesn’t have meter, you can spam the sHP quite often (be in the sweet spot or not) without much fear of retaliation; you can actually use cMK into the sweet spot since there’s not the fear of her sHK (which beats it cleanly) on crouching Urien linked into SAII.
Feel free to use the spheres, even just to annoy her. Feel free to meaty cHP on her wakeup every now and then (it stuffs any of her reversals if timed correctly). Can even use spare shoulders without much fear (but still it’s better to avoid that).
Feel free to sweep her.
You can actually rush her down without much fear when she doesn’t have meter, you’re in control of the match.

When she has meter
This may sound obvious, but never ever throw a sphere unless: 1. You’re from full screen range (and I mean FULL) 2. You can bait a jump (an early enough anti-air sphere is safe even when parried, but this is general Urien knowledge) 3. You cancel it into aegis.
Beware that her SAII can go through aegis too, so don’t be obvious on sphere xx (any) aegis follow up. If you always dash or shoulder after that and your opponent catches on (and good ones will do fast), they just get a free super on you.
Don’t whiff sHP. a good chun will SAII it on reaction. It won’t always happen of course, but it’s not worth the risk most of the times. Be careful with cMK too (but that’s harder to whiff punish).
Always cancel your shoulders into some aegis, and be carefull with that anyways since both her bHP and cMK stuff the shoulders with the right timing.
Don’t use f+HP as an overhead unless you’re ume-sure they’re falling for it, since it can be reversed by SAII on block. The overhead itself is quite good when she’s not charged, but there’s less risk involved if you just UOH if you need to overhead her when she has meter.
Instead of meaty cHP, try meaty cHP 1st hit canceled into LP headbutt. It retains the great meaty hitbox of cHP, but it’s safe unless she parries both hits. You have to partition it most of the times (no need to cp only if you knock her down right in front of you and she doesn’t quickstand or she’s cornered)
Don’t sweep.

When she knocks you down.
You’re fucked up. Well, not really, but it gets quite hard. If she has meter and you don’t feel to ume-parry, just block low and don’t fear the damage from kara-throws since it’s a fraction of what she can do to you otherwise.
If you EVER feel the urge to do something, let it be nothing else than reversal lp Headbutt which is the only not totally unsafe thing. Since you’re considered airborne from frame one, it’s gonna beat kara-throws, and since it looks like you’re still on the ground, they’ll go on with hit confirming and you can block (or even parry) their super since you’re being reset (see RX vs Nuki at Gamer’s Vision SBO3 qualifier). Still, its far from abusable.
You can try reversal PPP Aegis if you feel desperate and need some breathing space, but beware that even though it has a 1-frame startup it still can get stuffed by some meaties when they’re perfectly timed.
When she doesn’t have meter, and you have enough health left and enough meter to kill her with unblockable series, then guess parry may actually be worth it.
When you’re cornered, it’s like above but just worse. Only small thing to add, if she down’t have meter and you predict a throw, you can HK kneedrop to get out of the corner.

One thing to know: if you parry the second wave of her super and you jump straight up right after the 8th parry (or 16th if you parried the 1st wave as well), her last hit will go under you switching sides and and whiffing (it can hit you if you jump too late). Very useful if she was cornering you, since this sets up a corner juggle/unblockable.

Credits: myself, Emphy

Dudley
If Dudley stands there and whiffs standing RH hoping to catch you as you jump in or stuff one of your pokes, you can use standing MK which is fast enough to catch the whiffed RH from far away.

Crouching MK is your friend and can keep Dudley away. But Dudley’s crouching FP will beat it.

When Dudley jumps in, you can standing MP or F+MP if you do it early enough. If Dudley starts to parry the MP, you can do standing jabs. Or you can do d+fp xx EX headbutt if they parry the first hit, but if they don’t parry the first hit, you’ve burned your meter.

Be careful throwing out random tackles, because lots of times, even if you throw out a RH tackle, Dudley can jump back MP and then do MP -> command dash xx corkscrew.

On wakeup, usually Dudley will stuff a jab headbutt, and if not, he can do crouching MP xx corkscrew. I think your best option is crouching jab or just blocking.

Against the swing back blow, standing jabs will usually stop it. Also, if you walk back a step, you can hit him with d+FP.
Also, it’s probably not the best idea to jump in too much against Dudley, even if he doesn’t have meter. If you jump in on Dudley when he has meter, he can easily, command dash xx corkscrew. If he doesn’t have meter, he can do standing RH xx jab machine gun blow.

Also, this is common knowledge, but you can’t do the mid screen headbutt unblockable against him, you have to do the dash tackle under one.

Credits: gootecks


#2

**Elena **

Hugo
Stay away, abuse jump-in roundhouse. I do an early jump-in FK, then jump back and FK again. That works a lot when Hugo tries to 360 or throw.

If Hugo is using Gigas:
If you are both in the air and Hugo air parries, it’s best to jump or jab headbutt when you hit the ground, otherwise you might get hit by the Gigas. Also, if Hugo jumps in and parries, get off the ground quick or you’re going to get hit by the Gigas.

Using EX headbutt when Hugo whiffs standing MP also works well.

Be careful with tackle xx EX Aegis because I believe Hugo can 360 you. For sure he can parry 1 hit from an Aegis unblockable setup and then 360 you.

Credits: gootecks

Ibuki

Ken


#3

Makoto
It might be scrubby, but anytime I get hit in the air, I always jab headbutt when I hit the ground to avoid the karakusa. Jumping a lot and doing jab headbutts seem to work best for me when avoiding karakusas.

Meaty fierce will stop a wake-up SA2.

Use crouching MK to keep Makoto out.

Credits: gootecks

Necro

Oro

Q


#4

Remy

Ryu

Sean

Twelve


#5

Urien

Yang

Yun


#6

Great idea! It’d be nice to have everything in one place.

Dudley:
If Dudley stands there and whiffs standing RH hoping to catch you as you jump in or stuff one of your pokes, you can use standing MK which is fast enough to catch the whiffed RH from far away.

Crouching MK is your friend and can keep Dudley away. But Dudley’s crouching FP will beat it.

When Dudley jumps in, you can standing MP or F+MP if you do it early enough. If Dudley starts to parry the MP, you can do standing jabs. Or you can do d+fp xx EX headbutt if they parry the first hit, but if they don’t parry the first hit, you’ve burned your meter.

Be careful throwing out random tackles, because lots of times, even if you throw out a RH tackle, Dudley can jump back MP and then do MP -> command dash xx corkscrew.

On wakeup, usually Dudley will stuff a jab headbutt, and if not, he can do crouching MP xx corkscrew. I think your best option is crouching jab or just blocking.

Against the swing back blow, standing jabs will usually stop it. Also, if you walk back a step, you can hit him with d+FP.
Also, it’s probably not the best idea to jump in too much against Dudley, even if he doesn’t have meter. If you jump in on Dudley when he has meter, he can easily, command dash xx corkscrew. If he doesn’t have meter, he can do standing RH xx jab machine gun blow.

Also, this is common knowledge, but you can’t do the mid screen headbutt unblockable against him, you have to do the dash tackle under one.

Makoto:
It might be scrubby, but anytime I get hit in the air, I always jab headbutt when I hit the ground to avoid the karakusa. Jumping a lot and doing jab headbutts seem to work best for me when avoiding karakusas.

Meaty fierce will stop a wake-up SA2.

Use crouching MK to keep Makoto out.

Hugo:
Stay away, abuse jump-in roundhouse. I do an early jump-in FK, then jump back and FK again. That works a lot when Hugo tries to 360 or throw.

If Hugo is using Gigas:
If you are both in the air and Hugo air parries, it’s best to jump or jab headbutt when you hit the ground, otherwise you might get hit by the Gigas. Also, if Hugo jumps in and parries, get off the ground quick or you’re going to get hit by the Gigas.

Using EX headbutt when Hugo whiffs standing MP also works well.

Be careful with tackle xx EX Aegis because I believe Hugo can 360 you. For sure he can parry 1 hit from an Aegis unblockable setup and then 360 you.

Akuma:
Don’t forget not to jump in when Akuma has 2 bars because you’ll get raging demon’d.

Spend some time learning how to red parry Akuma’s hurricane kick.

When you have Akuma in the corner and you do fireball xx Aegis setup, you may want to stand back a bit incase he tries to teleport out.

Use jab headbutt to counter the dive kick.

If you parry Akuma’s crouching MK, he can hit you with a hurricane kick if you are too close. If you parry it from far away, you can safely standing FP, but if you’re too close, you’ll eat the hurricane kick.

This is probably not universal to Akuma, but it seems to happen a lot to him. If he has you trapped in the corner and is about sweep range away, if you do a FK kneedrop and he blocks, the kneedrop will actually cross him up and he’ll be knocked down.


#7

With Chun, you forgot about how her cr. rh beats Urien’s j. rh :xeye:

I don’t like this match.


#8

I’ve added the contributions, but I want to discuss a bit.

I also found that sHP is decent as a late anti-air… sMP loses cleanly when it’s not done early enough, but sHP beats Dud’s jHK quite often (and knocks down)

Actually almost any meaty will stop wake up SA2, so i’d stick with something safer.
I’m not too fond of cMK in this matchup, since it loses cleanly to her stupid cMK (and EX fukiage) and she can dash karakusa you on recovery if you whiff.
sHP is unsafe too but at least it can stuff her cMK at some ranges other than being able to stop her dashes.
sLK can be nice to stop her dash-ins too.
I hate this matchup btw. :sad:

I don’t like the match either, I just think that among the hard matches it’s not THAT bad.
You’re right about her cHK. Anyways I swear I’ve stuffed that sometimes too, but I believe it was like from the very max range (like the last hitting pixel). Not relieablo though. At least, you can empty jump and if she cHK late you can just dash in ->throw her during recovery iirc.


#9

Just a suggestion. Perhaps you can include unblockable specifics for each, like you did with Dudley? Well, not “specifics” exactly, but let us know what setups don’t work, or character specific stuff… like “kneedrop unblockable doesn’t work” or “all unblockables work”. Maybe also include ground crossup info, etc. Or, corner combos ie: “you can’t double tackle this character” or “tackle > FB > tackle work on this character”. What I mean is the really character specifc technical stuff… Not too specific, but just informative.

In any case, it’s an ambitious yet good idea for a thread IMO.


#10

good idea, i just didn’t want to re-cover too much ground that was covered in the unblockable thread. but here goes:

Corner Combos:
Tackle -> Fireball -> Tackle
Alex, Dudley, Chun, Elena, Necro, Twelve, Q, Makoto

Tackle -> Tackle -> Headbutt
Ryu, Ken, Akuma, Sean, Yun, Yang

Tackle -> d+FP -> Tackle
Hugo

Unblockables:
Mid-Screen Charge Partitioned Headbutt:
Akuma, Ryu, Ken, Chun, Makoto

Mid-Screen Dash Under Tackle:
Necro, Remy, Alex, Dudley

Yun/Yang:
d+FP -> tackle xx FP Aegis -> dash back -> d+FP -> RH kneedrop -> FP headbutt -> d+LK -> d+FP

Ibuki:
d+FP -> tackle xx FP Aegis -> dash back -> MP fireball -> RH kneedrop -> RH kneedrop -> guard break

I believe you can do the charge partitioned headbutt unblockable against Hugo too, but I’m not positive.


#11

nice post man…straight from RX’s vids…can’t go wrong with that…in his vids, he also did tackle, fireball, tackle on urien. just wanna mention it cuz you missed that one.


#12

ooops, yeah forgot that one


#13

What about Akuma just repeatedly hurricane kicking you in the corner? Friend of mine did that, I was able to parry one, and then he mixed it up, overhead into hurricane, low forward into hurricane etc etc, not fun. Or is the key to never get into that situation?


#14

I’ve never played against a good Akuma. How much damage can he get off a RH hurricane? It does barely anything by itself…


#15

The key is learning to red parry the last hit, but there’s a lot more than that.
As soon as I have some spare time I’ll give a complete vs Akuma analysis.


#16

Doesn’t midscreen headbutt work on Urien too? And i thought dash tackle works on everyone else that doesn’t get hit by the midscreen headbutt or am I wrong? Oh and shouldn’t you include the number of hits for cr.fierce? Doesn’t it change sometimes (like sometimes it’s only 1 hit while others may be 2)?


#17

midscreen headbutt works fine on urien.

I’ll post my thoughts on urien’s matchups later. Just got back from a 14h shift from work… :slight_smile:

All i can say is that i have MAJOR issues with Chun and Ken.


#18

hows the dash under tackle work?


#19

Vs. Akuma

Jumping is never good against him. Weather you jump towards him or away from him he can catch up on you. As soon as he has one bar full never jump in on him. Some have mentioned the fact that you can be demoned but better akuma-players will just srk>super you and save one bar at the same time. If you start to parry he can still play with you. Anyways, just avoid jumps.

Don’t relay on partitions against him. Partitioning against this guy is a bigger gamble than one might actually think. And the reward you get for it is really not worth it. I do maybe one or two against good akuma players these days.

Play defensivly. Wait for your chance and just punish him. Never save on meter but instead go for as much damage as you can get on any single opening you have against this character.

Besides this do what has been said about him by others.


#20

against akuma, do ppl usually use aegis or thunder? i’ve always used aegis, no matter who i’m fighting, but i’ve seen the benefits of thunder against akuma. do the benefits outweigh the inflexibility?