Using Sagat's F+HK

sagat

#1

So i’ve been trying out Sagat in Arcade Edition because i enjoy doing crazy damage, but i’m not having much luck using F+HK as anti-air. It doesn’t seem to hit anything significant, which is kind of a bummer because that one move is the whole reason i wanted to learn him.

Any advice for how i should set that up? His low fireball is so ridiculously slow on recovery that it seems impossible to F+HK people who jump over it. Is there some other way i’m supposed to bait people into jumping at Sagat?

Basically, what are some practical ways to land Sagat’s F+HK?


#2

BTW Maj are you still too busy to combine forces for a combo vid?


#3

The F + HK can be used for a few things but it’s not a one size fits all tool like some of his other normals. Thing’s like Bison’s return headstomp or Sim’s floaty jumps spring to mind. You won’t really be using it as an AA in a FB game (TU, Kara TU, TK, St.Hk all better options). It’s more of a “good read” tool, or to punish a bad jump in.

You can get fancy if people are neutral jumping your FB’s and FADC a Tiger shot and roundhouse into Ultra (this looks bad ass). Again though, it’s up to you to decide if it’s worth burning 2 bars on that kind of set up. I wouldn’t, but then again, I’m not very good… lol


#4

As far as reactionary punishes go, only the larger, floatier characters that rely on a mixture of empty jumps/neutral jumps/long reaching jump normals to make you second guess your anti air will see use from this. I’ll occasionally use it on gief/rufus to make them think twice about the risk reward involved in doing so. Really though, any character that you know will have to take the initiative and jump at you more often then not, will see any use from this move.

Alternatively, you could always just play a few mindgames, I suppose. You could condition the opponent with a meaty tiger shot -> kara tiger shot trap that you could normally neutral jump over a few times, then when they get it into their head that you’re going to go for that every single time, throw the one tiger shot and wait to see if they jump and follow up with a forward RH. Overall, a really situational move. Use with caution. Maybe if you’re lucky, you’ll whiff in front of their face, they won’t expect it and be late to punish it. If that’s the case, just tiger uppercut FADC to safety. Gimmicky but it can work.


#5

Thanks for the suggestion but i’m not that interested in whiffing F+HK to do random uppercut for the sake of seeing F+HK. I’m more interested in making a “good read” with F+HK, but i’m wondering if there’s any other way to land it besides throwing some fireballs and then not throwing a fireball.

Even punishing Bison’s Headstomp followup is damn near impossible with the way F+HK moves forward. Can you guys remember seeing any match vids where F+HK was used in an interesting way? I looked up some Sagat tournament matches recently and they all seem pretty dry for the most part.


#6

Yeah, i’ve had more success just sticking to St. MP to deal with bison headstomp follow up as far as normals go. Due to the start up and forward moving nature of the move, there just isnt much use for it. It really cant be used in option selects either. It can’t even catch a backdash. If you really really have to have a use for the move, you could always punish a whiffed ultra like Vipers with F.HKx2 Ultra I suppose.


#7

It’s all about reading. Some opponents are big enough to be hit with while standing, like Zangief, seth, or sagat. So, I might toss it out if I see them standing in range while anticipating a jump. But if you are hoping to use it regularly, there aren’t that many opportunities. You can use it as an option select in a fireball war though. I know Alioune has a video of it where at the right range will throw a kara LTS or if they jump OS high step kick. For this OS, you need another tigershot on the screen, and it is only advisable against characters that don’t have a good move to get through a fireball.

I think that sagat’s step kicks have the majority of their power from the kara ability while still being above average in their usability.


#8

I’m a video addict, here’s one I remember recently… Mago probably pressing it more times than ever in this one… The ending is sweet.

[media=youtube]ehvkuCJkhxk[/media]

Leslie used it a few times to good effect in Canda cup against Justin Wong’s Rufus and Wolfcrones Viper. Those are both in the video section just added lately.


#9

F+HK is an excellent move, but I think first you need to look at it’s hit box(it’s in the top right)
http://www.eventhubs.com/images/2011/sep/30/sagats-hit-box-information-super-street-fighter-4-arcade-edition-image-2/

Second, the Low shot is a great fireball no matter what the recovery and when used with Kara’s you can easily bait people in for F.HK, Kara TU or regular TU.

It’s going to take some practice to get the hang of it, it’s ideal for beating empty jumps if you know a player is empty jump heavy. I suggest going into practice for finding some good distances for it.

Some set-ups include f.throw or b.throw, low shot, then high shot on their wake up, if they jump over the high shot it’s an automatic kara TU or double f.hk.

You stated you just picked up sagat, eventually you’ll be able to pick up when people are jumping forward but just looking at their feet, it even works great against neutral jump(hits twice). Don’t forget to use it against Bison if he tries devils reverse or headstomp tricks.

Enjoy!


#10

It’s not about punishing the headstomp, it’s about a get out of jail FREE card. You either take no damage, or kick Bison in the head…that’s it lol.

Leslie’s Sagat was doing this a lot against a Bison player(not at Canada cup)


#11

What the fuck is this “good read” nonsense I keep reading?

See a forward jump, step roundhouse them in the nutsack. There are only a handful of jump ins in the game that you can’t do this too.


#12

I guess i was just hoping for a list of specific moves that F+HK can punish, but it seems like it’s basically limited to jumps. That’s fine, i can stick to using that way if that’s all there is to it. Seems like Mago was just throwing that move out there half the time he used it, either for simple forward movement or to fish for random drills. Too bad nobody around here uses Dhalsim.

Anyway thanks guys.


#13

Sorry if its a bit late but heres a clip of towards rh used very practically, bascially using vipers strenghts ( her unique air game ) against her.

[media=youtube]p7MWSr2ie1k[/media]


#14

Wow, can’t believe it took me this long to notice. Thanks dude, those were good matches. Viper is such a weird character.