** FRAMES + general notes on Vergil’s moves list = http://forums.shoryuken.com/t/vergil-safe-blockstrings-pressure-basic-frame-data-thread/137064page-2#post-6287349**
UPDATE 12/14/11: Added new note on how being in Devil Trigger gives Vergil a legit high/low mix up. One of the best in the game actually. Also added info in number 3 which explains how you can last ditch keep yourself safe if you whiff when not in DT. Also added left/right+assist mix up with j.d+H (helm breaker).
**UPDATE 12/8/11: Added note reminding to not whiff anything if you’re not in DT. **
**UPDATE 11/19/11: Added notes for number 4. Must be in Devil Trigger for the string to be safe. **
IMPORTANT NOTE: Vergil’s mix up is mainly based around getting behind the opponent (a mix up element made to be more prominent in MVC3 than MVC2 or other fighting games). ** Instead of forcing the opponent to block high or low you want to force your opponent to hold forward on the stick. There’s different ways to do that while keeping your block strings safe that I will explain below.**
GENERAL INFO ON VERGIL’S PRESSURE
[details=Spoiler] Alright…so we all know that Vergil has some unsafe normals.
We also know that this is MARVEL. The game where you can cancel anything into anything. We also know that Vergil is the only character that can cancel his S into H indefinitely unless they advance guard. We also know that he has a round trip move that he can charge like a buster to cover things. We all know that there are assists in the game and of course he has sword supers.
**Making this thread early so we can get this shit out of the way. A thread to post any found safe block situations for Vergil so we can find a way to use him outside of turn on spiral swords aka sword dance and mash on shit. **
Alright so main issues with Vergil’s point game.
- Start the round without a lot of meters. Meters allow you to go into sword dance so you can hurp durp keep stuff safe for 5 seconds even though you barely understand the character. Jump forward or teleport and you get free cross ups without even pressing a button on the stick.
- Normals like s.H and s.S are pretty damn negative on block.
s.H = negative 13 on block, s.S = negative 13 on block.
s.L is negative one on block and becomes plus one in Devil Trigger making it his only positive on block normal if in DT. c.M is negative 7 on block normally and negative 4 on block in DT.
- Is not able to cancel his normals on whiff into other moves (at least initially). The only character in the game that works this way. Making it very risky to throw a whiffed s.H, f+H stinger or even some of his M normals and expect to stay alive for very long.
**Strategy guide’s overview on Vergil’s point objective. **
Your goal with Vergil is to set up a cross up attempt. Why is this so important?
*Rapid slash hits the opposing character’s backside from almost any position and leads into massive combos when cancelled into Devil Trigger. *
*Trick Down teleports directly behind your adversary from any distance, while Trick teleports to their front; both can be used in conbination with assists to sandwich your foe into an ambiguous side switch guessing game. *
When meter is abundant, you can always force a guaranteed KO after a successful cross up via Vergil’s Dark Angel Hyper Combo
How can you achieve this goal?
*Use safe pressure stemming from s.H, air M, stinger (f+H) and Judgement Cut (qcf+atk) to limit your adversary’s mobility - this hinders their ability to jump and dash towrads you, ultimately making it easier to keep them grounded for a cross-up attempt. *
*Force your opponent to block long range f+H while you call an assist to lock your rival down, and then cancel into trick, trick down or rapid slash. *
*Thrwo round trip to lock your competitor in guard stun, then teleport next to them with Trick or Trick Down. *
Activate Spiral Swords and then teleport in with Trick or Trick Down.[/details]
**Safe block strings and pressure (REMEMBER #5 FOR BLOCK STRINGS): **
1. MOST IMPORTANT. If you’re NOT in Devil Trigger…DONT EVER WHIFF ANYTHING.
Just like SF…make sure you always make some type of attack or block contact with any normal or special you do. Read number 3 to understand why.
2. Only character in the game that can cancel their s.S on block into a s.H.
Every other character has to call assist or turn on XF. You otherwise can’t cancel into anything else after a blocked S normally including specials or supers.
3. Devil Trigger grants you the ability to cancel whiffed normals into specials which normally can’t be done without DT (only character in the game that can’t cancel into SPECIAL moves on whiff in standard form).
It also gives you SAFE BLOCK STRINGS WITHOUT ASSISTS (explained in number 4 below). If you whiff a normal and are not in DT, call a strong assist or cancel into DT or Spiral Swords. You CAN HOWEVER cancel whiffs into supers without DT. If you’re in a bind and just whiffed something cancel into DT (preferably, qcb+2atk) or spiral swords (f,d,df+2atk).
Remember when in DT that landing combos is important to maximizing time in DT. Everytime you hit the opponent in DT it freezes the time for a split second. Giving you more time to set up resets and generally use the DT. Using instant air dash H high/lows and assist left/rights can set up combos and resets that kill people without burning out all your meters.
***4. USE ROUND TRIP OFTEN (hold preferably L button down 90 frames or one and a half seconds)! ***
You will know this is fully charged when Vergil’s forward arm is glowing light blue. Like Zero…charge round trip often during the fight and let it go right before or after a normal is blocked then do trick or trick down to after they leave block stun for mix up. If they block the wrong way they get hit. If they block they can push guard you but the charged round trip can get up to plus 90 frames of advantage on block. Allowing you to cancel into trick or trick down near the end of the block stun from the round trip and start another mix up with an assist.** Round trip is key to buying time to use assists with your pressure more often and open people up. You can also charge round trip before the match starts.**
Just like Zero, if you have Vergil on point you can charge round trip before the round starts to give yourself an early lead on pressure when the round starts. The start up is a bit long at 30 frames in standard form and 27 frames in DT form but once you get it out it starts up your mix up and gives you safe pressure.
**One of the best aspects of round trip is that it basically acts as a self assist if you have already used up an assist or don’t want to use one yet. **This move acts similarly to the wind disc in Arcana Heart where you can basically have a disc on screen that will constantly follow you after you unleash it. What this allows you to do is essentially have an assist that can constantly spin up and down and around the screen until it finds you. Meaning you can use your teleports like your Trick and Trick Downs to literally run away from the projectile and keep it on screen for a long time which can tear up assists and set up probably some of the craziest left/right shit I’ve seen in the game yet.
Round Trip is the only one of Vergil’s specials that has more advantage on block (plus 90 standard, plus 80 DT) when in standard form than when in DT form. All other moves grant greater advantage in DT.
The only real caveat to Round Trip is that you CAN NOT cancel into it if you whiff a normal unless you are in DT.
5. s.H, rising sun (f,d,df+L), cancel into trick up OR f+H stinger, rising sun into trick up (H teleport, mash H before the first hit of rising sun finishes). Opponent must block rising sun for this to work.
**Both block strings are safe without DT. Make sure you learn how to space this so they still block your rising sun if they advance guard. They must block one of the hits if the rising sun for this to be safe. You don’t get frame advantage but are completely able to block again without issue of guaranteed punishment. ** This string is also safe to most XF guard cancel situations (only cancelling into a fast invincible super like bionic arm can guarantee punish).
6*.**** s.H or f+H + assist button, do trick or trick down (L/M teleports)***
7. NOTE: NOT REQUIRED…BUT IS SAFER IN DEVIL TRIGGER.
***s.H OR c.H OR f+H stinger into qcf+atk judgement cut (whichever one can force them to block). ***
Judgement cut is plus 8 on block normally and plus 12 on block when in Devil Trigger with a much bigger hit box. FRAMES ARE MORE NEGATIVE WHEN NOT IN DT SO NOT TRUE STRING IF NOT IN DT. IT IS SAFE AGAINST A MAJORITY OF MOVES BUT SOME FAST SUPERS WILL PUNISH.
8. NOTE: MUST BE IN DEVIL TRIGGER
Vergil gains very powerful high/low mix up when in DT. Basically when he’s in DT he has basically CLOSE TO NO air dash height minimum. Can air dash forward extremely low to the ground.
This allows you to hit with his half screen air H on pretty much all of the cast even if they’re crouching or fake it into a low. His air dash is hella fast. If you super jump then immediate air dash it basically allows you to overhead from half screen.
You can basically do air dashes where you’re more or less levitating off the ground more so than air dashing. Further pronouncing how DT completes him as a character.
Your general mix up is basically:
Against Crouching Opponents
1.instant air dash H for overhead.
2. instant air dash M to cancel the air dash and land then c.L for low. This fakes the air dash H.
3. Ground dash into c.L. Gives you a faster low if they are reacting to the c.L fake.
4. Dash forward from a distance then instant air dash H (fakes a dash up c.L)
Against Standing Opponents
**1. Instant air dash H. **
2. Dash up c.L if they insist on stand blocking.
3. Dash forward from a distance then instant air dash H (fakes a dash up c.L)
Whether they’re standing or crouching the distance you need to do this mix up keeps you safe from air throws unlike other air dash movements. The fact that Vergil can overhead or c.L mix up from such a crazy range gives him a leg up when going for high/low mix ups from a distance over Dante. There are certain characters like Ammy and Morrigan that Dante has a really hard to near impossibly time air dash M or Hing where Vergil’s instant air dash H will hit.
He has plenty of left/right mix ups with assists and even a self left/right with round trip and rapid slash so he has plenty of options for mix up once you’re in DT. ** Instant air dash H will only sometimes cross up on some of the bigger characters when crouching. Meaning you will mostly be using this for the high/low mix up from a distance and not cross ups like Dante.**
The air dash H will whiff on extremely short characters like Morrigan or Ammy if you’re too close to them but as long as you space yourself with a judgement cut first you’re in good range to instant high/low. If they’re about Wolverine to Wesker size just do it right outside of Vergil’s c.M range and you should be good.
Pretty much anyone about Captain America size you can air dash H almost next to them and still get the overhead.
***9. Force your opponent to block j.d+H (helm breaker) then immediately call assist and mash on L or M while in the Helm Breaker animation to teleport in front or behind of them before landing. ***
Allows you to force the opponent to block a helm breaker and then immediately set up left/right+assist mix up.
** - Air f+H, wait then press air S if you don’t get air throw.** Essentially tap f+H then press air S if you don’t air throw the opponent. Option select where you get an air throw if they are within throw range. If not within range you hit them with air H and it cancels into air S starfall/dive kick for combo opportunity.