When im using MSP i have a real hard time against trapper teams. Specifically team Clockw0rk and team Duc. I try to push block but I’m probably push blocking at the wrong time (specifically against spiral sent). Whats the right time to pushblock and what other options do you have when you get trapped/pinned down?
Any help or comments on whats a good strat against trapper teams are greatly appreciated =) thanks.
For Spiral, you need to figure out which pattern they’re using, however, a good Duc player will have multiple patterns. You need to pushblock about 2 hits before the first sword comes after you, and jump out at the low swords. Hopefully the drones aren’t attacking you at that point, and you can get out.
Generally, you’re going to have a difficult time getting by both Duc and Clock with MSP. Watch the Evo 2k5 videos, and see how Yipes manages against Duc with MSP and MSS. You can get some ideas, even though he lost. As far as getting through, watch the Sanford / Duc money matches at Evo 2k6 to figure out strats against that team.
As far as clockwork, watch the Clockwork / Soo matches on Preppy’s site www.zachd.com/mvc2/ and get ideas that way.
Trust that you WILL have a hard time fighting them, as Magneto gets raped by Strider typically. If you rush down too much, he can teleport away from you, likewise with Spiral. There’s drones on both teams, therefore you have to watch your rush CAREFULLY. Spiral can do her command throw and Strider can launch you if your rush gets predictable. BE CAREFUL! and since Magneto dies, you wont put much of a fight up with Storm/Psylocke.
Strider’s bombs prevent cable from AHVB, and spiral can teleport behind him and murder.
both of those characters counter cable. Storm is your best bet, since spiral’s trap is nothing for storm, and she can stay in the air longer than oroborous lasts.
Storm’s Vertical typhoons also prevent her from being trapped on the way down, just don’t abuse that shit, cuz spiral can teleport and do metamorph on you
with clockwork u at least have a limited amount of time to rush down before strider or whoever is on point can get meter.
i never played a good duc. but from watching evo vids sandford always ends up super jumping out of the trap. maybe u can wait for them to mess up their trap cuz its complicated enough that if they mess up u will get a window of time to escape or do one of my favorite moves MT DHC HAILSTORM
against spiral, block low, and mash psylocke. the top sword misses, so you arent in total block stun. she will eat some damage, but at least you are out of the trap.
when strider does orbs, super jump and air dash up and tempest. Hopefully that will keep you up long enough for orbs to run out.
Unless you are already good with cyc, dont pick him thinking he will counter a decent team clockwork. We have seen it been done and getting hit by cyc doesnt mean anything. Honestly, psy and capcom do better against my strider than cyc.
when strider is rushing in after orbs are done, counter into psy xx butterfly super xx hailstorm is game for strider.
that doesn’t work. Strider can still chase magnus except he has to block then throw rings then bam, magnus is back on the ground. Even if strider doesn’t go to the air to get magnus down, strider can chill on the ground and build around 30-40% bar and still manage to throw a bomb to xup magnus with into a trap rep.
doom beats capcom clean and if you anticipate a capcom call, you can do bomb+orbs on him and chunk 40% right off the bat.
psy\cyke can give s\d problems because of their ability to beat doom as he’s already out. A wrong doom call followed by a proper counter call with either of those 2 assists can lead to a mixup oppurtunity against strider.
that doesn’t work either. Any strider player will constantly anticapate an alpha counter and strider has the ability to attack and dodge alpha counters except for cyke. Strider can even throw a bomb out as he’s coming in for his next chain so if you do alpha counter, you’ll alpha counter right into the bomb.,
c.lk, c.fp, c.rh will slide the opponents sprite back which determines where your alpha counter comes out @. If you alpha counter after the c.lk, strider will dodge any AA alpha counter except for cyke. In capcoms case, striders c.rh will beat capcoms alpha counter.
w\ msp against trap teams, you should be more worried about getting mobile than actually attacking. Once your able to move around the trap patterns and anticpate the follow ups, msp just needs 1 touch to win. Just constantly move around w\o attacking too much and pick a nice spot for a GOOD mixup. If you fuck it up, just keep using the same strat over and over till you get your lick.
the last thing you should worry about is that s\d can do wayyy more damage than spiral per trap pattern. Its ok to trade hits with spiral to get in close every once in a while but you should really watch what you trade with strider. Especially if theres a bomb somewhere. If that bomb makes contact and orbs connect, things can go south fast.
btw Tito Mel, I think you’re doing something wrong if Psylocke/Commando are giving you more problems than Cyclops. And I’ll try that alpha counter xx Butterfly Super next time I play against Clock, but I’ve never been particularly successful with it in the past.
against strider, its not the actual trap thats killing you. If strider dumped 5 bars on one opponent who had full life for repeated trap chains, its not enough to kill you. When you try to get out of the trap or call your assist because strider is beasting all over your face, thats when the real pain is dished out.
if you get trapped, deal w\ it but don’t panic. Stay calm and look for a way out. Yes, when you fight against s\d or spiral, its inevidable that you will eat a trap rep. Its going to happen. Stay mobile and deal with as little as possible.
you can force strider to dump his bar by creating movement and scaring him. See if the other guy can play s\d w\o bar.
the biggest problem playing against trap teams is that everyone panics. its all about patience and experience of the fight. if you have mag you can jump out and dash but the worst thing you can do is super jump, try to find an opening or a whole in the trap and that one hit will pay off. for storm you can super jump and whore typhoons if you do get out its good against strider but he can also cross you up on the ground to mess up your typhoons. smart psyblade calls are good dont just do them recklessly cause youll lose an assist almost instantaneously
Psy does give my strider problems, but not cyc. when i get hit by cyc, they are usually blocking something, so its difficult for them to follow up, especially if i get hit while orbs are activated. he is much easier to avoid as well than psy. tempo of the match does not change if i get hit by cyc as opposed to psy or capcom, which im sure you will agree shultz is more important than having a holeless trap. While i do get hit by capcom much less than cyc/psy (probably once a match) the tempo of the match is changed. my orb meter is gone, im high in the air (leading to cross ups) and im across the screen.
as far as the alpha counter comment, he was looking for ideas and i gave him one. I dont care how good your strider is you will not predict every single alpha counter there is so to say it doesnt work is wrong. the op must use his judgement obviously when the right opportunity to alpha counter is and put that in his playbook. It doesnt hurt to know. BTW OP, you have to wait until orbs are done with if you want to counter.
this is what i’m trying to get across to you. Strider can dodge alpha counters or use different re-trap chains to stay away from your alpha and still trap. You don’t have to predict an alpha counter. If you simply just stay away from them entirely and readjust your retrap chains to do so, you’ll never be alpha countered during re-trap oppurtunities. Not to mention that strider can really bait that out.
I can even go as far as to say that s\d is the only duo in the game w\ a full screen trap sequence that you can vary guard cancel timing on which prevents NO ALPHA COUNTER what so ever.
c.lk, c.fp, c.rh will beat\sidestep any AA alpha counter except for cyke after the c.lk. The only reason why clock won that match is because josh thought he can catch clock with an alpha counter to drop strider. That and the fact that josh did several unneccessary resets but still, the multiple attempts to alpha counter strider were shot down.
i 2nd motion shoultzula, you should try to be patient. keep in mind that you won’t die with 3-4 reps of trap sequence against strider nor spiral. be patient and pick your spots to counter.
tip: you said you are using msp, right? when strider is trapping you, try push blocking and calling psylocke when he teleports, i learned that’s when usually he doesn’t expect it. and when you are able to sj when he has orbs, try to spend the longest time in the air so that his orbs would be wasted. on magneto, when you don’t have levels, try qcb+punch. on storm, just fly around.
on spiral: spiral’s trap is almost perfect but only almost. i got 2 ways of getting out of the trap. let’s say you’re already trapped, pushblock on the s.hp and block the first 2 daggers and sj on the third/lowest dagger. for that you need to practice because it is actually quite difficult. the other way is to also pushblock the s.hp and just block the daggers or spam your assist after the drones hit you in the trap sequence, usually spiral is slow enough in running to you to continue and start another trap sequence and psy gets hit with the dagger and then you can sj your way out of the trap RSTD that spiral.