We can be really good at this game


#1

When it comes to King of Fighters, Americans and Canadians (and I think Europe) are usually last amongst the world. Some are going to say that it is because we suck, and for the most part, compared to everyone else (Asia, Latin America), we do, but that is because we have never taken King of Fighters as a serious game, ever. Sure, you might have a major with say 20, maybe 30 people entering, but that’s it. You rarely see locals, maybe regionals, but nothing else, and some of the people are probably entering even though they have probably barely played the game (I’ve seen it happen).

I’m not saying that KOF12 should be getting SF4 numbers, it might not even get prime SF3 numbers… I would at least hope it can get somewhere to CvS2 level. We have proven that if we can take a game seriously, that we can be on a world class level, if not, a notch below it. SF2, SFA2, SFA3 (before crouch cancels), MvC2, CvS2, 3s, TTT, T5, and some others. All these games we have taken seriously, and have been able to beat some of the best players in the world, or hang with them.

Right now, its up in the air. There seems to be a dislike of this game in Asia, does Latin America play it? will they even play it? And the poor business decisions of SNK, but those things we can’t really do much about. What we can do, though is to make this game competitive, and not “I’ll dabble in this game and place top 3,” but when entering a tournament, almost nothing is free. Its up to us to make it happen, because it won’t happen by itself.


#2

My 5 cents…

As you know I can reply to a lot of this due to the fact that I do travel for SNK related purposes and will be in more than just Ciudad Juarez, Mexico.

Latin America does play this game, Tijuana is going to take it seriously, Juarez, Mexico is gonna play it more, but you also have to keep in mind different cities have their own favorite games.

For example, in CD. Juarez, Mexico it’s a hotspot for:
-KOF 2002 Neo Geo above all
-KOFXI

So no no 98UM, 2k2UM, or KOFXII just yet. CD. Juarez, Mexico even believes KOFXI is better than KOFXII so once again it depends on the location, you can’t say things to a particular entire country.

Now in regards to the second part, yes this can happen, and as Clan Leader I will do my best to help this happen when the Netcode clears up. Also I am doing my best to do this for myself by travelling. I remember when people didn’t believe that I’m #3 in KOFXI in CD. Juarez, Mexico but even now people have to see that’s the truth. People have to have the right mindset and dedication, and while it’s nice to have more people playing the game, I don’t want dabblers. Sure I’ll play with anyone but if I’m spending too much time with dabblers I personally feel I am wasting my time because their dedication is not there and my time could be better served elsewhere.

In order for all of America to become very competitive in this game and it not be limited to “certain areas” people need a complete mindset change, they need to change the way they think and look at certain things, and if they want to get better they are going to have to travel. Playing online is nice and all, but if you look at the cream of the crop in regards to top players something you will find a common trait in all of them is TRAVEL.

And no I’m not just talking about travelling within the same country. The true top players don’t limit themselves to travelling within the same country, they travel ABROAD to other countries as well and are getting exposure you people just sitting here in America JUST AREN’T GETTING. (Justin Wong a premier example)

Even if you were to watch vids of Justin playing in another country you still aren’t getting the experience he’s getting. Don’t kid yourself, its like secondhand smoke, you are inhaling the smoke secondhand while Justin is smoking the cigarette getting all the tobacco, inhalants and everything else. Who is getting the strongest effect from the cigarette? The one smoking it.

See it works like this, every country overall has a style of some sort, so you want to see as many different styles as possible and different countries have different styles. You begin to realize it’s not about who is better than who or what country is better than the other, it becomes about MATCHUPS.

Take for example me vs. Rodo in KOFXI this past weekend. He’s about 3x better than me in KOFXI but I almost defeated him in Losers Finals due to AN EXPLOITED MATCHUP.

He’s not exposed to American style Gato Leader because they dont play him that much in Mexico and they play everyone else nearly so this caught him off guard. However by me playing Mexican style with Duo Lon leader he was very well prepared because he sees this everyday.

However Duo Lon Leader can take care of 99% of people here in America. Why? MATCHUPS and Exposure!!!

-DG


#3

Sure thing my friend look forward to playing you/hearing from you…Good post. The US overall is guilty of copycatting too much, so yes that means they don’t take them too seriously.


#4

I don’t think it’s necessary to travel abroad to become better, although it is a great asset to have. Many top Japanese players don’t travel outside of Japan (although they don’t need to), 99% of the top Marvel players don’t travel outside of the states, and there are top SF4 players in California that don’t even play outside of California. If you look at this, you’ll see that they don’t need to travel, because they already have great competition. I’d take traveling and seeing as many styles as I can, though, any day.

This is going to happen anywhere. The hardcore scene will be a small % compared to the people that have bought the games. Even in sports like basketball, most of the people watching or playing are not trying to be serious in the game, they just want to have fun.

KOF12 system isn’t that complicated, compared to games like 98, or 2002, infact, its rather easy to jump into (although you still have hills to climb if you want to level up). It is up to the person to determine where they want to take their level, and if they are serious, and have a group that they can play with that are serious (offline, or online) then they will strive to become the best, or a top player. If you have this type of trait in volumes, then I believe that KOF12 can be considered “an American game.”


#5

If there’s any year, it would be this one that the US excels in.

I can definitely echo what Dark Geese said about traveling and seeing other styles, with the additional tools of the internet compared to say 6-7 years ago, information is passed on at a much faster rate but it’s absolutely true that it’s not the same being there.

I had to good fortune to travel around for several years and I’ve managed to play ppl in HK, Taiwan, Macau, China, Toronto, Vancouver, England, Paris and of course the US (so.cal) and you’d be amazed how different styles can vary. Unfortunately, although I consider myself and addicted recreational player, I’m not super competitive (at least not in the tournament sense) but I enjoy playing and watching strong players.


#6

But what are your goals? That all depends on the player. If you just wanna be a top player in your country and you have access to top level competition in your country sure you may not need to travel. But if you want to be THE BEST DAMN PLAYER THE WORLD HAS EVER SEEN…then just playing people in your country isn’t gonna cut it. My dad is a Marine, and you all have to understand that mentality, very few make it as a Marine even though they try out. The Officer tells the group of people that come in and try out, only 10% of them will make it through. So that’s my mentality, I don’t settle for less. Why settle for playing people at a high level in one country when you can play people in ALL COUNTRIES? Why limit yourself? That’s my idea, but once again it depends on what your goal is. If you are okay just being a good player, sure go play good competition. If you wanna just be a top player, go play with top competition. IF YOU WANNA BE THE BEST AND BE AMONG THE ONES WINNING THE MAJOR TOURNAMENTS AND TOP 3/5, TRAVEL ABROAD AND GAIN ACCESS TO WHATEVER PLAYERS IN YOUR COUNTRY YOU CAN PLAY.

I don’t limit myself at all, I mean why should I do that?

Agreed cosign 100%. How are you doing my friend? You gonna be at West Coast WarZone? :china:


#7

If you guys get the chance you should try and come over to the UK, i guess it’s a bit short notice for some to come over now but we’re having a major tournament for XII over here in September.

Even if it’s just a weekend trip, i’d try sort out some sessions or a meet up so you can play some of the players over here.

It’d be good to play some of you guys.

A couple of us are considering coming over to EVO next year, though it kind of depends on whether the cash is available and whether XII would be there.


#8

The cash MAY be available if I can sponsor some of you guys should things start panning out for my business endeavor come February, I will without a doubt keep you posted!!!


#9

Im going to meet up with a bunch of people today for some casuals. Im gonna bring KOF12 to get some heads hooked on it today.


#10

Because a lot of countries have inferior players that really aren’t worth playing at all? THink about it, what would the top Japanese kof players gain from traveling to the US to play? It’s a complete waste of their time, they aren’t going to learn anything new and if anything, US’s gameplay might make them the Japanese get worse at the game.

Anyway, one step to getting good at kof is playing me on GGPO/2DF.

Edit: I don’t think the problem is that the US are guilty of copycatting…if anything, they aren’t watching enough and observing what’s really going on.


#11

I am going to be there; sadly word has it that Oscar isn’t going to be there anymore (and he helped XII get into Warzone in the first place) due to family reasons.

I’m only gonna enter XII as I’m pretty much done with the older KOFs sadly for the most part, EVO was just a oh-what-the-hell thing but clearly I was out of practice.


#12

Just a side note, most japanese KoF players I’ve seen have been far inferior to Mexican/Chinese. Not saying there isn’t always an exception to the rule, but the Japanese have never really been anything when it comes to KoF :confused:

Lol at people getting worse by playing America though. America is pretty well known for being good at a ton of games, as opposed to simply excelling in one specific area. Maybe it being a combination of a bunch of different nationalities helps :tup:


#13

My question is, why should KoF12 be the one that America picks up & decides to play fer srs? Of course there’s the whole new & shiny game thing, but at this point the effect has already worn off. Because the console release was so bad, the game isn’t pulling in new players the way BB & SF4 did and still are. Even the folks who bought the game @ first look haven’t been playing. Pretty much like Kof12 arcade, the console version is apparently dead out the box. At this point the US version of TvC has a better chance of making it into Evo2k10 than Kof12.

As for international play, that’s kinda ridiculous to put on people who are interested in the game. American KoF isn’t going to get any better regardless of whether or not 10 guys travel to Mexico, China, or whereever else. Sure they’ll get better, but that doesn’t do much for the 3/4 people in the US fighting game scene couldn’t tell you the difference between a hyper hop & a super jump.

The scene starts w/ “dabblers” & regional stuff. Pretty much every regional tournament you see right now is SF4+BB, and occasionally some combination of 3s/MvC2/HDR/BB. KoF12 is barely on the radar, because nobody plays it, even when it’s brand new. Pretty much nobody can sit home & “dabble” online, or even in training mode because frankly there’s very little to do. When you compare that to BB, which picks up a whole bunch of people who only really dick around online, even when that game is harder to understand on a base level than KoF12.

I can’t even explain how there are more people interested in playing UFC & AH2 port than KoF12. Dudes might as well be playing the US ports of 98UM, that would prolly get more hype than 12 anyway.


#14

Simply put, as a long time KOF player- I’ll say this: KOFXII, gameplay wise, has the best engine of any KOF in the series. It deserves support since it’s actually a good game.

As for places playing it, they do exist- Houston does, North Carolina well, Cali does. It won’t be played everywhere- but only SF4 really is played everywhere. Locally for example, no one plays HDR at all.


#15

Well my experiement last night went great! After all the SF4 causals I popped in KOF12 and I got some games going. A lot of players were just watching but when I got off a CC combo with Ralp and Elizabeth both ending with a Super they were like, “Whoa that was fucking hot!” I got a few players wanting to get the game now. I told them that the online isnt hot right now but a patch #2 is coming out something by the end of the month which brings it up big time.


#16

Eh…what? It doesn’t look like you follow the scenes much because Japan’s kof2k2 is actually pretty solid, probably the best in the world. Their kof98 is really solid too, it’s just that there are a few players from China that are a bit better (Dakou, Xiaohai for instance).

JP kof2k2 players that would beat Mexico: 777, Oogosho, Hammer, etc
JP kof98 players that can hang with the best of CHina(mexico is nothing in 98): 777, Oogosho, Kyokugendoa, Raian, etc

How many people in Canada/US play kof2k2/98 on arcade machines? Do they even exist anymore? On GGPO/2DF, there’s a ton of idlers but they don’t want to play kof unless it’s with that one friend, so they can mash it up. There just really isn’t any love for the game.


#17

Man my post had a lot of that early mornin salt in it. Pretty much what I’m saying is that, forget being top players, how about just getting players? I think we should play the game to get it some pub before worrying about where the US stands internationally.

As it stands Season’s Beatings 4 wont have KoF12, just like Summer Jam didn’t, how is the game going to build momentum?


#18

So you didn’t read the first part of my post, and glossed over the entire second part?

Once again there will always be those few players who prove to be the exception, but when I think KoF, my mind doesn’t jump to Japan, it jumps to China, Mexico, and in some cases Korea.

In any event, if you truly think the Japanese would have nothing to gain by playing American players, I can only feel sorry that you feel that inferior about your skill, as well as those where you live. US players as a whole are coming out of the woodworks and doing great at almost ALL games. Tekken used to be a primarily Korean ruled game, and now Naps and Chet are downing them left and right.

Either way, after chilling with Dark Geese at Devastation, he’s got me convinced that you do need to travel to learn. If you aren’t doing that, then you’re limiting yourself. By that same token, the japanese players that you apparently love have done the same thing, so it’s obviously a great help, no matter where you play :tup:


#19

There is a scene here in the Northwest like Seattle and Portland. After Northwest Majors a lot of people were interested in playing the game.


#20

What are you talking about Japanese are really good at KOF. They just had a tournament on KOF XII Japan vs Taiwan and Japan won the whole thing as of right now Japan is the best at KOF XII right now. Have you been to Japan or played real Japanese players before in KOF.