What exactly is footsies?


#1

can you explain to me exactly what footsies are? possibly could you list how to do them with certain characters? also what is a crossup? thanks


#2

Footsies are mainly used to bait an attack and punish, sometimes by whiffing a safe attack. Like with Chun walk back and forth outside shoto’s c.mk range whiff a lp here or there, when they whiff a c.mk, s.mp xx super their recovery. A cross-up is used to get on the other side of an opponent. there are generally 2 types, ground cross-ups and jumping attack cross-ups.

Ground cross-up- In CvS2, this is generally done by hopping over a knocked down opponent with a dash in CAP grooves. Ex. Terry can sweep from max range, dash twice to cross-up. Other instances are like Chun-li’s kick super super jump cancel last hit into a j.rh, then you can walk under your opponent while they are in the air.

Jumping cross-up- It an air attack you do from the front but it hit from behind, your opponents have to block the the way they are facing or they will get hit.

Both are used offensively, and help avoid reversal “wake-up” moves such as lvl 3 super or shoryukens. Did that help any?


#3

dont listen to the guy above.

footsies is a strong ground game, thats it.


#4

I think he was just trying to be more specific than “a strong ground game” by giving examples of what Chun does. With Sagat, it’s a walk-back-and-forth-while-random-poking-into-super game. No offense, but “a strong ground game”, while it’s true, doesn’t really help someone understand more about what footsies are.


#5

The guy asked for an example, I gave him one. Chun-li is a perfect example. “Strong ground game” in itself really doesn’t explain much.


#6

Over the recent years, whiff punishing somehow became a blanket statement for footsies. It’s really only a small part of it. While it’s true that footsies basically IS the art of fighting on the ground, I guess if I were to be more specific it would be knowing how to counter any given opponent ground strategy with the resources available to you.


#7

Footsies are a strong ground game, yes, but you need to know how to apply it.

Along with what RagingStormX said, I would like to add more…

Footsies are a way of attacking in a match used to accomplish many basic things. These include baiting/whiff countering, moving in, counter hit/throw setups, or high/low mixups. I’ll give an example for each…


Baiting/Whiff Countering

The idea behind this is to make your opponent whiff something in order to do alot of damage. That’s basically it. This is good when you figure out an opponents pattern in the way they attack or whatever.

Basic Example:
Lets say you have Ryu and you opponent has Chun or something. Everytime you do a cr.forward they try to hit you with st. strong on recovery. So you wait for it, then out of frustration you make the opponent whiff st. strong, and you do cr. forward. Thats it.


Counter Hit/Throw Setups

The idea behind this is to do a mixed up attack pattern and making your opponent block then throwing them, or to get a counter hit combo which does more damage then a regular combo. That’s why the counter hit is better.

Example:
Ken:
BnB is cr. short x3, st. short, short funky kick.
So you do that first.
Then you dash in and the opponent is blocking, you do cr. short x2, wait, counter hit st. short because your opponent may try to attack you when they think you’re going to stop attacking.
Next time, you do like cr. short, throw, because the opponent may try to block. Its well worth the risk if you have super and they don’t.


High/Low Mixups

The idea behind this is to make the opponent block the wrong direction. Then you can go for damage. That’s it.
Look back at the Ken example from the previous part.
Use the same BnB combo for this example…
Ken:
cr. short x3, st. short, short funky kick.
Lets say the opponent is blocking low.
You can do cr. shortx3, st. short, forward funky kick and hold the button. The kick will turn into an overhead and hit the low blocking opponent.
2nd example:
Same BnB…
You do the basic BnB first, then you can move in and do, cr. short x2, whiff st. jab, throw.
Or…
Sagat:
You can do st. jab, cr. short, st. strong, low forward.
If they block the st. jab, you switch it up with low short, if they block that then you can do st. strong because it hits high or low. Just make it a continuous guessing game for the opponent.


Moving in

There are many ways of moving in on the opponent, by A)Good Footsies(combination of everything listed) or B)Dashing/Rolling in after a whiff.
Here are some basic ways to set it up.

1)Sakura vs. Blanka:
Sakura stays out of range of Blankas cr. fierce. Blanka whiffs it and Sakura rolls in as the cr. fierce recovers. She combos into a special than she can go for a wakeup mixup, etc.

2)Making the opponent think you’re going to attack:
Cammy:
Walk up, cr. short, walk back, cr. forward, walk up, walk back, walk up, throw.

3)Dash in after you counter a whiff.

4)Get a knockdown on the opponent.

5)Crossing up:
Jumping over the opponent and then hitting them from behind before you land.

6)Make the opponent block something, then walk up/dash in, whatever.

7)Throw out one projectile then move in.

If you notice every one of these parts of footsies has to do with some other part of footsies. Just keep that in mind.
:tup:


#8

thanks alot for your help. it helped me understand the game alot better.


#9

footies are prolly the first thing you want to work on if you’re new to SF or 2d fighters in general. trust me … all the flashy combos in the world aren’t gonna help you if you can’t get in to land them … it’s the most frustating thing in the world knowing you need to land some 80% combo and getting your face kicked in trying to land it.


#10

Buk:

Whenever Geese whiffs a d.HK, I can kick his limb and then gain the advantage by using Ken d.HK xx qcb+LP/LK.

My question is what exactly are some things I can do with Ken to make Geese whiff that d.HK? If I want to stand at the range where I can consistently punish his whiff, I leave myself within range of Geese’s far s.HK. If I stand outside the range of Geese’s far s.HK, then I always have reppukens or his deadly random jumping, cross-up, non-cross-up j.MK to worry about.

It seems like good players can just snap their fingers and make the opponent do whatever they want. All they have to do is walk just the slightest bit forward or maybe whiff a few jabs, and the other guy will always jump forward, roll in, or in this case, whiff a Geese d.HK on command… just like a trained dog. :rofl:

From what I’ve been told, the reason these good players can do that is because they have a such a strong footsies game. I’d like to learn the basics so I can eventually be able to control my opponent at such a high level as well. Think you might have the time to help me get started? I suck.


#11

Writing footsie basics would take pages upon pages upon pages. I would also feel like something of a hypocrite for writing up something like that, since my own footsies aren’t really all that spectacular. It’s one of the many reasons why I use the team that I do: they’re not entirely footsie dependant and instead play off of my other strengths.

If you feel your footsies are subpar, then I would advise dropping Ken. If you really like Ken, then I guess you’re gonna have to spend more time thinking about what you can do to counter certain situations… for example:

if you get outside of Geese’s low rh range, he’s gonna s.rh you instead right? You can counter that by:

  1. jumping straight up and coming down with a huge combo
  2. pre-emptively sticking something out like a s.rh and getting a counter hit
  3. rolling and getting a huge combo
  4. rc fireball

and probably more that I haven’t thought of. Just play a ton of situational theory fighter in your head. It’s more helpful than you would think.


#12

Ah, thanks a bunch for your reply Buk. I watched some more of your matches and realized you’re correct about how your characters aren’t really that dependant on footsies anyway. Practically every character I’ve seen you play (other than Hibiki) is a 100% momentum type character. Get a single knockdown then 50/50 mixups, ambiguous cross-ups, and forced guesses until the other guy dies.

Regardless of what characters you use though, thanks again for the tips. Every little bit helps. :smile:


#13

Stuff I see Choi and Sanford do with C-Ken:

-Catch them standing.
d.LK, d.LK, d.LK (blocked), stand up for a split second, d.HK xx roll/hurricane/funny kick

-Keep them from walking back.
whiff s.LP, d.HK

-whiff jab(s), poke with hadouken.
I don’t know how, but they make this work really well. Especially with Ken’s slow hadouken. It takes up a lot of space.

-frame advantage move (like a blocked jump-in), walk foward, d.LP, close s.HK (or s.LK or s.HP), fancy kick.
Great for counter hit AND guard crush.

I think this goes without saying for every character, but once they get some kind of knockdown is when Ken’s mixup games really begin (and when he really gets scary).

What are some setups I can do with those crazy random jumping MK’s? juggle with dp+MP, walk back, then properly timed super jump forward MK for example.

If anybody wants to reply to me, feel free to bring it to the Ken forum.


#14

Can I reply here instead :slight_smile: Because some of these things apply to many characters :slight_smile: :slight_smile: :slight_smile: smileys :slight_smile:

-Catch them standing.
d.LK, d.LK, d.LK (blocked), stand up for a split second, d.HK xx roll/hurricane/funny kick

This works because when you stand up from a crouching position, your opponent’s reflex is to stand up, too.

-whiff jab(s), poke with hadouken.
I don’t know how, but they make this work really well. Especially with Ken’s slow hadouken. It takes up a lot of space.

This works because the jab takes up a lot of space. More importantly, no one rolls into jabs. So it makes the hadoken safe.

-frame advantage move (like a blocked jump-in), walk foward, d.LP, close s.HK (or s.LK or s.HP), fancy kick.
Great for counter hit AND guard crush.

Walking forward makes people try to tech throw on reaction. A lot of moves you can get counter hits with by walking forward a bit and then sticking out a jab.

Anyway, thinking about what you would do in a particular situation makes it easier to control what your opponent would do. For example, say that your opponent’s Cammy is whiffing cr. MP just outside of Cammy’s cr MK range, but inside her st HK range. You’re using Ken. What would you do?

If you said you’d hit her punch with st HK, then you just whiffed a st HK and ate a counterhit HK -> super

etc etc


#15

This also works because it induces counter hits since people think you are “done” after the three low shorts, when Ken still has +5 to work with.

The point of the whiffed jab isn’t to prevent them from walking back. The d.HK would do the same thing since they can’t walk back the instant you press the button. The point of the whiffed jab is to counter would-be whiff punishers: they see something whiffed, they hit their button, your sweep comes out first and counter hits.

The whiffed jabs are there to dull your opponent’s reflexes. It’s harder to anticipate to something like a fireball on reaction when the opponent is constantly moving around, doing things like whiffing jabs/shorts and poking you.


#16

We need more of this stuff. People don’t know how to fight on the ground, but they can RC Ken’s LK Funky kick. Maybe nobody wants to write pages upon pages about it, but every bit is a huge help. Thanks.


#17

Some of my random footwork tricks:

You can write pages upon pages on footsies, but will you understand it? I mean a lot of the stuff in footsies is as advanced as not moving 2-3 more pixels forward, breaking the rhythms of your whiffs, learning the speed of the character’s moves and such. Everyone plays it differently too, yeah there are some similarities but even if you try to xcopy [random popular japanese player’s (how do you do that anyways?)] footwork, it’s going to be different.

My favorite shoto footsie trick of all time is the hurricane kick over the c.hk, dunno why I like it so much but here it is. one way to set it up, you basically get in a little closer, but not too close, but not too far to the shin and make them whiff the hk right when you see hk movement, lk hurricane into whatever.

Footwork is the best way to see how an opponent you’ve never ever played before’s style is like. For example, if he doesn’t have any footwork at all, it’s safe to assume that he doesn’t know what he’s doing and you can jump in ALL DAY ALL DAY.

Ken’s :r: + :hk: is a good poke, I often try to time it when my opponent hits forward or when they think i’ll do a sweep and they do a projectile move like a sonic boom to counter the sweep. Or just toss it out randomly.

Chunli’s s.lp can beat sakura’s S.RH, but timing and character placement is kind of strict. Say we are at about Sakura’s HK distance, and that if she presses HK, i’ll get hit by the last pixel of her HK. I press s.lp 2 times, move forward 2 or 4 pixels forward, make her think i’m going to do s.mp by doing another s.lp (he found out because of the way I play my footwork earlier in the match) but then i move back, 1/4 sakura hk away after that s.lp, she moves back to because she thought i was going to s.mp, we are about 1 and 1/2 sakura HKs away, noticing that i didn’t s.mp she moves forward so that we are an HK away, ready to s.hk me at the right moment, I see this and I move forward a pixel or 2 and s.lp, now she predicts that i’ll move forward after that s.lp so she s.hks me, but i moved back a 3 pixels before she did that and i did a s.lp to beat her s.hk. all in 2 seconds me and my opponent thought about this. If i wrote all the variables, it would be very confusing.

edit: positioning is also a key factor in footwork. Say I am near a corner and my opponent is trying to drive me into there? blah blah blah too many variables too many variable too manyvariables blah blah.

edit 2: so the basic idea of footwork is to have a dominating position to attack the opponent.

did you understand that? Some of it? THought so.


#18

Hey guys do you have basic footsies versus Sagat? I’m having hard time beating him when he turtles.


#19

Who are you using?


#20

ken A-groove