What's a frame trap?


#1

See thread title.


#2

Basically if I do a move on block or on hit that allows my character to recover and attack before you and then attack right away, and then you also attack as soon as you recover from stun, my attack will beat out yours.

For example (I don;'t know if this is right on frame data, just a general guess), if I do fei long’s close standing MP, it’s +3 frames if you block it. That means that I recover a full 3 frames before you do allowing me to attack with the initiative.

The trap is tricking unknowing people into attacking right away, leading them to get counterhit.


#3

A well-known frame trap is the Nemo String with Chun Li.

After a blocked c.lp (you can do it after any move with the same block stun though, or if you alter your timing slightly), do a close standing roundhouse into Hazanshu. The close roundhouse starts up very fast so it will beat any more the opponent tries to do after the blocked hit. The will cause a counter-hit, and give enough frame advantage so that the roundhouse combos into Hazanshu (it won’t combo if it’s not a counter hit).

Here’s an example of two setups during a match:
[media=youtube]gYolcCzHTv0#t=30s[/media]

Nemo goes for the standard setup, but Nuki doesn’t bite. Then immediately Nuki pulls it off after a blocked neutral jump roundhouse.


#4

So basically, if I’m in blockstun and perform any hitting command, I’m going to get counter hit? How is this different than any normal block string?

I noticed on the Chun example, after the j.RH, she didn’t combo into that standing kick. Is it not supposed to be a combo or something?

I’m still confused.


#5

lol illitirits example is perfect cause its got video… but since your still confused i’ll break it down… if you still dont get it then theres no help for you i suppose.

standard “offense” in a streetfighter game is to throw your opponent after a quick attack has been blocked, now generally speaking theres only 4 responses to this pattern to break it:

1.tech the throw attempt/crouch tech.
2.do a reversal like srk or ex messiah.
3. jump out/ away
4. jab them before they throw you.

now the most standard of those is to either jab out or to tech.

so, if i do a BLOCKED jab, my opponent will immediately think that i’m going to follow it up with a throw, and since there response will generally be a jab or crouch tech i can instead, initiate a frame trap… heres how the chun frame traps work:

blocked jab gives me +3 frames whereas chuns close hk comes out in 4 frames… this means that if i do this string as fast as possible that there is only a 1 frame gap… which also means that since the fastest jabs in the game are 3 frames… it isnt NEARLY enough time for them to interrupt my hk, so it will hit as a counterhit. and well, thats the trap: if they push a button during my string they get counterhit and i can do a bigger combo than before.

frame traps are best used on block cause the opponent is more likely to attack after blocking something… whereas if they got hit, they would just try to block since it might be a combo.

tldr:

a frame trap is a gap left in a string to entice an opponent into making an offensive move which gets immediately counterhit, leading to a combo.

-dime


#6

Another way to do a frame trap is to do a move that leaves you at negative frames, then immediately follow up with a move with invincibility. The most typical example of this is Rufus galactic tornado followed up with ex messiah kick. Galactic tornado leaves you at -1 frames on block which generally means you’re at a disadvantage. -1 frames doesnt mean that the move is punishable by any means but most people will throw something out just to apply pressure and gain the offense. But if you do a ex messiah kick right right afterwards,you will catch them if they attempt to stick out any move since ex messiah has invincibility frames on startup.


#7

Dime, thanks for the explanation, that helped a lot and Last Wolves thanks for that information too, thats a clever trick. I’ll watch out for those god damn Rufuses.

Is there a frame trap thread that has a big list of them by character or anything?


#8

This is not a frame trap simply a safe block string. A Frame Trap requries you to have the frames of the moves add up so that you win by being at advantage.


#9

You just gotta remember that any attacks given while you are in block stun are just ignored.
So say theres a balrog spamming the shit out of jab while holding down+back. If I jump in (using ken) and c.lp,c.lp,c.lp, none of those will hit because he will always be in block stun.
If I do c.lp,c.lp,c.mk then the c.mk will counter-hit. This is because c.lp gives +2 advantage on block, c.mk takes 4 frames to start up, so there is 2 frames in there where he has a chance to attack. If he is spamming the shit out of jab, I’ll just counter-hit it.
nay mean?


#10

Some bnb combos are also auto frame traps on block.

eg. Blanka’s c.mk, s.lp xx ball frame traps opponents who mash low tech.

c.mk leaves you at +1 on block
s.lp activates at 3

The gap will allow a c.lk through if they’re mashing low tech, but it will get beaten by s.lp and they’ll get hit by the ball. As stated before though, the trick is to condition people into thinking you’re going for the throw.


#11

Quick, I’ve seen your stuff on the bison board and I believe that another auto trap is one of bison’s bnb combos (cr. lp st. lp cr. mk). I not confident enough in my frame data analysis to prove this, so please correct me if I’m wrong.


#12

a good way to test if a block string or bnb indeed contains a frame trap without using frame data is to go to training mode, pick the character with the block string or bnb that you suspect has a frame trap as player 2 (ie. bison’s bnb c.lp st.lp, cr.mk) and pick another character for yourself as player 1 (doesn’t matter who).

then, when you are in training mode, go to record, and record the other guy’s block string or bnb or whatever (the point is you are trying to figure out if it has a frame trap or not). of course this is assuming you can perform the other guy’s combo.

then, block the blockstring/bnb combo using player 1 as the blockstring/combo of player 2 is played on repeat. if you get hit mashing jab or crouch teching throws, the jab or throw tech you used as player 1, trying to mash out, got hit in the startup frames, and therefore there is a frame trap in the combo you recorded for player 2.

this method is kind of hard though of course if you can’t perform the other person’s combos, so frame data is probably the quickest way to go by as long as you are fluent with it.


#13

OK, I think I’ve got the idea what a frame trap is! Thanks!!
But when I went into the training room, and record the CPU with cr.lk cr.lk cr.mk,
after I blocked the first 2 cr.lk and stand up to grab(Abel’s grab is 3f),
I supposed to be counter hit, which it did happend, but eventually I’ve actually grabbed him!
What’s going on here?

Here is the vid: http://tinypic.com/r/9l9aj9/6


#14

thats because you didnt execute the frame trap combo properly.

i just tested it, the only way you can get away(all reversal timing) :

  1. ex tt
  2. ex cod
  3. lk wheel kick
  4. backdash (you can fa backdash but he can combo that cr.mk into hadoken etc and you’re going to eat that for free lol)

#15

LOL…I watched over the vid again, and found out that was a cr.lp cr.lp cr.mk combo!!! Silly me!!:blush:

EDIT: Well, I think I did it right, didn’t I?
prorook was saying cr.lp cr.lp cr.mk combo…:sweat:
And on the screen, it showed it was 3 hit combo I recorded.


#16

Question; is Bison’s lk SK followed by a jab a frame trap, as it looks like the opponent should have the advantage?


#17

I’m not a Bison player, but lk scissors is 0 on block. jab starts up in 4, so it will lose to 3 frame normals (eg. Ryu’s jab). c.lk has a 3 frame startup, so it’s probably best to use that. It will beat most crouch tech attempts.


#18

That’s my general experience with it, yeah. Against worse players I’ve found they’ll throw out a special and I’ll stuff it with lk.


#19

scuse me but this is hilarious because it’s basically exactly how the guy in your avatar would respond to the post (if he bothered to do so)