Simple question. Every tier list I look at has Dudley at C-tier or lower. I’m just curious as to what puts him at such a disadvantage over the rest of the cast?
match up wise he’s high tier (low on the high tier)
He’s low because he’s hard to use.
When people think of Dudley at his best they think of Marn.
low pokes: why cant i touch them + gotta take a substantial amount of risks + OSing back dash doesn’t lead into much a lot of times
almost free on kd
he isn’t 3s dudley
I haven’t seen Dudley be considered anywhere near C tier since SSF4 came out. If you are talking about tier lists that are based on matchups then he is considered low tier because people don’t know anything about Dudley’s matchups. People have literally JUST figured out that Dudley vs Sagat is 6-4.
Dudley vs Gouken 4-6? No chance.
Dudley vs Makoto 4-6? No chance.
Dudley vs Cody 4-6? Nope.
And like Thirtyfour said he is hard to use. Most of his matchups are even imo which means that you have to work harder than most to consistently win.
Kokujin bes Duds.
A lot of the cast is “almost free on kd” to a Seth player, but ya he is basically free.
Haven’t you watched the tut? we 3rd strike now.
I don’t base my tiers on Seth alone. Thanks for judging me like I was some typical shit Cammy player.
Gouken can run a train on Dudley when he gets knocked down as well as keeping him out fairly well. Apparently he also has retarded dive kick set ups that were doing quite the number on Mellow in a lobby I was in.
Makoto wins in buttons, hides bricks in her hands for damage, and has the most annoying thing for Dudley to deal with (command grab.) Also runs a train when Dudley gets knocked down.
Cody pretty much loses if he gets knocked down but Cody dictates everything else about the match. Dudley doesn’t have a really solid “get off me” until three bars either. 4-6 or 5-5 imo.
I always wanted to know who people think Dudley beats. Because I have him beating nobody but Sagat and only slightly.
I’m gonna say this because of how helpful you are to the Seth forums. That right there is Dudley forum sarcasm. It is not offensive, although it may seem that way it is not. We all talk to each other like that. And I would NEVER judge someone as if they were a typical Cammy player. That is WRONG. (RIP Cammy). Relax bro and welcome to the classiest board on SRK.
Everyone runs a train on Dudley when he gets knocked down.
Gouken’s dive kick is borderline broken. That move beats almost everything. Gouken only has two buttons he can press (c.LK, c.HK), pressing anything else is just too risky. 6f sweep, -3 on block, puke 5-5 imo.
Makoto vs Dudley is all about momentum/first hit. Once Dudley starts pressure, Makoto has very few options for escape. And vice-versa. I completely agree with you about here command grab, it is one of the most annoying moves in the game next to Bison’s c.LK. 5-5 imo, although I can’t really say too much about this matchup. Thirtyfour has a lot more and better matchup experience against Makoto, he would be able to elaborate more (again).
Cody match up is just as you said, almost. Most of his buttons are better than Dudley’s but I think people (even you) are sleeping on Dudley’s normals. 5-5 imo.
Dudley himself doesn’t really beat too many characters. What I consider favorable matchups for Dudley are Sagat, Oni, Evil Ryu, and Dan. Other than that, Dudley as a character just beats certain players. Some people just can’t handle pressure or rush down. Similar to Seth, although not as severe. He can overwhelm some players easily. It’s the players that don’t give you limbs to s.HK buffer or c.MP buffer against. It’s the players that just block a decide to eat the occasional throw rather than the 300+ damage counter hit combo.
Most of his matchups are 5-5, which force you to outplay your opponent. A lot of people don’t want to work that hard and still get wins.
imo dudley’s good match ups are vs abel, ryu, sagat, rufus, c.viper, akuma, dee jay and dan. despite the advantage, i’d say it’s minor and not enough to make it an easy mode win but he has the tools to really throw these characters off their game and negate a lot of what makes them very strong vs other characters.
Floor: I used to argue with Dudley players that he did beat Sagat. So imo it seems it’s Dudley players themselves that failed to understand him. *shrug
Not that it matters since ultimately Dudley loses to the metagame and has no real effect on the metagame as well. Same as any other mid tier and below char.
I would say it’s because there aren’t many good Dudleys out there to make them think twice. Kokujin is the only one I know of worth watching. We gotta get more out there. But it’s really the same reason people say Hakan sucks despite his great normals and his buffs. Really no one knows what these characters are truly capable of.
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Tier lists judge characters based on knowledge at the time. Most people know Dudley can hit like a truck but has difficult doing so. So they put him low down.
He has good matches vs all fireball characters. He beats Sagat, edges Akuma based on damage output and being able to duck out of several of his set ups, and beats Ryu based on being able to punish blocked sweep with U1 and duck/ultra through blocked cr.MK xx Fireball strings. Beats Rufus. Does well against yun. Can do well against Seth if he stays on his feet most of the time. Same goes for Viper.
He doesn’t really have any shit match ups. I dislike Honda and Dictator, but there’s tools there to be used, they just have to work less than Dudley does.
I think you don’t see many top players using Dudley because you have to actually work too hard to get the same results as one of the obvious top 5 chars. The mental fatigue over a 2 day tournament to not lose two sets with Dudley must be pretty severe. Lots of 1 frame links, amazing reactions and pretty tightly times OS set ups along with great whiff punishing and pin point accurate spacing.
actually why i think dudley beats viper is because he doesn’t care about her mix up. he has too many ways to either outright beat it or just negate it and bring the game back to neutral. for akuma, dudley can punish way too much of his stuff for big damage. s.rh, sweep (when akuma doesn’t have ultra 1 stocked), air fireball forward/neutral/back, demon flip outside of KD, fireballs, c.mk xx fireball. plus akuma’s DP is more at risk of getting blown up by SSB. U1 vs akuma can really keep them humble.
i don’t think dudley does too well vs yun. if he does, it’s simply because he comes out on top in a slug fest. s.mp really, really, REALLY puts dudley on notice. that shit is a wall. but ex duck upper vs divekick is too gdlk. vs seth, you literally have to DP every divekick. that’s dudley’s only anti air for that. fuck it if it trades, better that than having to block it. also vs those cross up j.rh where you either AA extremely early or you’re forced to block? cross counter AA that shit.
I have different idea of Dudley hard matchups. For me all the female chars are difficult. Rose, Viper, Cammy, Chun-Li. Makoto not so much. Most female chars have fast normals and with good reach to keep Duds out.
It is hard against good viper player because that flame kick can hit you from anywhere. Her ultra also leaves so much dust/smoke that you can’t see anything. Once I defended but her ultra didn’t go all the way, I still don’t know what happened (so much dust or smoke, wtf?). I find easy Akuma, Gief, Sagat and Yun. My favourite is Yun if I have to respect that wall, he must respect my j.HK and s.HP and he only goes mostly in horizontal direction like Makoto.
Basically give me yun/yang any day. I play a good Seth and Seth can be very easy or very hard. Depends on the momentum. If Duds can make some damage at the beginning then you can just control better the match.
The major problem with Duds in my opinion is he is hard to learn and also very easy to read because you tend to become very predictable with Duds since you tend not to use all this features. Furthermore, if you try to be random like a scrubby ken or elfuerte you get slaughtered.
The only character I really fear as Dudley is Zangief, he’s anti-Dudley in my opinion. The other match-ups that frustrate me are ones where I lack knowledge of the characters’ options/spacing. Honestly, I need to start ranking more online instead of just mostly with my friends and such (as good as they are) so I can get a wider range of experience.
EX Upper Anti Air > HK Duck straight > LP MGB/EX Duck Upper
s.HP c.MP c.HK duck straight f.HP Pokes max range
Punish combos dealing 350 damage
Jump in HP outside of lariat range
Just dont get cornered or knocked down and you win it’s simple
Every knockdown vs gief just duck/dash him to the corner
Tbolt chips him out for free on knockdown (ROUND ENDING CHIP)
I’ll post about rest of tut tomrrow
dud can really give gief some trouble actually. the thing is, you can’t play scared. max range duck straight is safe from l.spd, your s.mp can stuff zangief’s s.mp and s.hp is pretty much the stay the fuck away from me button. when it comes to AA, s.hp, jet upper (combo into MGB on trade to steal space), ex duck upper, and U2 if you have it. everything heavy that he whiffs, punish that shit. vs gief you can’t afford to not take damage when he gives you chances. all in all, you just gotta stand your ground or even bring the fight to gief. when you have 2 bars you get 1 safe mix up attempt. just don’t play scared.
personally, i think this is how dudley’s match ups look.
6-4: sagat, dan
5.5-4.5: rufus, deejay, c.viper, akuma, abel, ryu, hakan
5-5: balrog, makoto, oni, yun, evil ryu, el fuerte, gouken
4.5-5.5: rose, honda, gen, cody, guy, ken, fei long, blanka, sakura, vega
4-6: adon, seth, chun li, cammy, juri, guile, bison, yang, dhalsim, zangief, t.hawk
Playing my Dan, Sagat, DJ, Ryu made you quit XBL for months.
You were visibly upset in your comments following the Dan sessions especially.
Dudley beats Rose Blanka Chun Li Guile and Thawk Oni Eryu (lol) Makoto and Gouken (lmao)
Dudley is even with Juri Yang Sakura Ken
Man how you gonna quit XBL, go back to PSN, and post nonsense like dis.
You know how much everyone reads into match ups and tierlists on SRK, so why, at your level (2) post all this match up advice?
I dont even wanna look at this weeks posts im not.
Imma just stick to the tut afk
Yeah, Guile being 4-6 confuses me too. What can he even do to you really besides like cr. forward?
EDIT: Also yeah you guys’ posts about Gief kinda hit home why I don’t like playing him. He kinda forces you to be a pokey character and you can’t ever really pick up momentum on him win or lose. Feels like it anyways, thanks for those tips though.
I’m a pretty shitty player so just looking for some insights.
What? Dudley beats Rose, Chun li, and guile? stick to tut.
Dudley can beat anyone
lol what? the only time we ever played you only used ryu, makoto and dudley. lol i never quit XBL, i just can’t afford live every month so when i can, i get it and play. i can SORTA see how dudley beats rose, oni, mak and gouken. a part of me thinks so but at the same time, shit can go wrong real easy if you’re not on your toes constantly.
why post match up advice? idk, in a way it helps me as much as it helps them. if i’m right then everyone benefits, if i’m wrong or people disagree, it’ll start a discussion that’ll lead to the right answers. it’s a win/win really.
i should get back on XBL soon. PSN AE scene is dying. everyone playing that SFxT :(. but my xbox gets sooooo hot! should sell it and buy a slim. or a cooling fan.