"You wanna get choked?!" Movelist/Combo Thread (Updated: AE changes)



Seems like it. However for max distance you will need to do the early version such as when doing f.HK cross over.


Holy shit this on-block st.lk kara-kara is bananas.

I don’t have the numbers on me, but if my logic is right, as long as you cancel the st.lk into the rh karakusa after the first active frame, they will leave blockstun before karakusa becomes active. Since st.lk only has 3 active frames, this means there’s a MAXIMUM of a two frame window for them to do something, meaning if they don’t have a backdash or uppercut buffered already or are holding up, they’re caught.

This is awesome! Think of the mindgames we’ll have once people catch wind of this! “OH SHE’S IN JUMP JUMP JUST HOLD UP” “Naw, dude, st.fp HC cr.lk xx EX Hayate cornered”. It really is 3s all over again; guess right or die.


yes walk over slk kara is good for that but thats used very rarely. Most of the time were gonna be ticking into kara.


guys i karakusa akuma out of his teleport lmao. his auro was there to and i grabbed him


I did a forward throw on Yang, and then did a Fukikusa. He teleported behind me, and the Karakusa auto-corrected. Pretty sick looking.


I think you have to cancel it around the first frame of recovery. there’s 10 frames of block stun plus 2 (i think) ungrabable frames afterwards. And HK.karakusa grabs on the 10th frame.

But yeah, the use of this is really becoming exciting. Late on block s.LK kara-kara grabs 3 frame jab mashing as well.


Surely it doesn’t matter what frame you’re cancelling the LK from as the time to cancel to karakusa will be the same? If anything it just means the opponent comes out of block stun slightly earlier on the later active frames.
If that’s the case, that means if the opponent does nothing, HK karakusa will always grab after a blocked LK, which I don’t think is the case…

At least that’s my understanding

Man, I hate being stuck at work!! when the science is going down!!


it was his shakunetsu. I’m sure of it :slight_smile: (it sometimes happens when you use f+HK (hold) then karakusa). His input are screwed and he throws a shakunetsu and not teleport :>


Meaty c.LK beats Yangs Ultras… Played a bunch of matches against the twins yesterday. So angry because I can’t get higher than rank 30. so jealous of vryu :stuck_out_tongue:

Well, that’s if the LK hits meaty. And you should be able to grab immediately after the blockstun ends. (i’ve never heard of blockstun recovery lol). So…if the LK hits on the first active frame, and its active for 3 frames then there are 2 frames active frames remaining + the 8 recovery frames. there fore:

-if you cancel st LK and grab on the first active frame, st.LK will whiff and they will get grabbed. Note: You have 5 frames to do this. You can be grabbed out of this, I think…
-if you grab after the first active frame, then you have 2+8 frames of recovery, with Karakusa being active on the 10th frame. Will beat anything besides premeditated jump, backdash, or invulnerable move.
Note: i don’t think this can be thrown because Karakusa grabs on frame 10, and a normal throw should grab on frame 11.
-If you grab on the first frame of recovery, that means you will grab on frame 12. Which means that you can be thrown out of it with a normal throw, and they might be able to backdash/jump on reaction.

I know this is theory fighter, but does this make sense? It looks right to me, unless i’m missing something.


There’s the problem of the 2 unthrowable frames after recovery (be it hitstun, blockstun, wakeup…).
You should aim to grab the opponent on "recovery+2"th frame.

this was something discussed here at the release of Super. It seems “late cancelling” is the way to do this normal cancel into hk kara.
I could never get used to it, and it’s a big risk since if you’re not “late enough” the kara whiffs (and you die) and if you’re too late, you don’t cancel and leave a huge gap.

What I try to do instead to grab on “recovery+2” frame is: hit confirmed s.lp/s.mp, kara-ex-kara.
The normal is +5 on hit, so opponent is throwable on frame 7, kara-ex-kara helps “spending” those unthrowable frames and gaining range.


Ok i see… very interesting. So now we have to find a reliable way to do it on block… Thinking now…


hey guys, Ive been trying to play makoto but, seriously i dont understand her, it might be because I used to play akuma, and I try to like…play solid and stuff, but still i dont know how to be effective with makoto or how to use her vs chars with better normals/faster walkspeed…its soooo hard, any help :frowning:


I’m sorry new to SSFIV and was wondering what does the " :r: " means.


Is there an easier way to do the instant tsurugi with Makoto? I’m having trouble doing it. Sorry if its already been brought up before I’m a newb.


I translated the notes for Makoto on the AE wiki


It looks mostly the same as the Super notes though, which I thought were pretty well done. Lemme know if you see anything fishy


Blocked meaty st.mp for one. If it gets blocked after the second active frame, st.lk becomes a true blockstring. This is where your own brain power is going to become a deciding factor, cause if it HITS and you go through with the st.lk kara-kara plan, st.lk will connect and hitstun will outlast the delay on rh karakusa. In this case, though, you’ll probably want to go with a full combo (st.mp xx mp/ex hayate, cr.lk xx mp/exh hayate, or st.fp if you’re good). Otherwise, if it’s blocked, the delayed st.lk kara-kara will snag them. Throw in another layer with OS dash for backdashes, and you’re going to need a brain running at 900 rpms just to keep up with yourself.

And then you get wake up reversal’d and pass out on the stick.


Thanks a lot for the hard work.


slk to karakusa on block is so beautiful ive done it to so many ppl. Also im having problems on the right side doing ex oroshi walkover slk karakusa. Thats my only execution problem so far i can do it on left consistent. Do u guys have any shortcuts or tricks for it?

to get the gd range for slk karakusa u have to be super fast i swear


s.LK to Karakusa IS beautiful. It’s like Fei’s s.LP tick throw into his command grab. Finally, a way to command grab someone blocking without risking getting thrown or having to have jumped in! Her what-beats-what risk vs. reward just got a little higher in my book … Yun still blows her away in the what-beats-what risk vs. reward, though … :frowning:

By that I mean his dive kick doesn’t lose to focus attacks and gives him more pressure on block, his command grab range is so long it never loses to throws or even normals if done right, his frame traps give him much more advantage so that the gap is smaller (or as big if you want) for throws or crouch techs, his ways through fireballs are more diverse and less risky, and even his feints are less risky and more consistent due to his ability to do good chip damage. Don’t forget his DP and EX Lunge Punch bullshit. He even builds meter better, damn it.

Then again, I’m not saying I like him more or anything. Makoto’s normals are still fantastic, and her damage is just amazing. She’s also the most fun when played right, hands down. I can play a lame Rose or cautious Fei Long all day and beat people I don’t consistently win against with Makoto, but the spark is missing.

When they nerfed Makoto pre-SSF4, no way was she this scary. Sorry for the rant, just thinking WTF here.


OK I have more proposed meaty setups…

After Ultra 1, Wakup Frames: 89F

LP Oroshi, Dash, (meaty) MP Oroshi=89f

(Meaty) Level 5 HP Hayate=89f

F MK (whiff), HP Hayate (whiff), HK Karakusa=89f

Forward+HK (not hold): Wakup Frames: 46F

Dash, (meaty) HP Oroshi

F LP, Dash, (meaty) st HK

Hayate cancel, c.LP, Hayate Cancel, (meaty) c. LK